Please Critique My Character - Dumpshock Forums

Please Critique My Character

Dog View Member Profile	Mar 8 2004, 12:11 AM Post #26
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 903 Joined: 7-February 03 Member No.: 4,025	IMHO, I think that the biggest problem is this: You asked folks to critique a character, then posted a bunch of numbers. You added a rudimentary and (sorry to say) cliched history afterwards and have only made a token attempt to describe a personality. You are designing your character backwards. Try this: Start with an idea. A character from a book or a novel, a person you think is cool. A song that could be a theme song, a cool picture, whatever. Now picture a scene, any kind of scene, action, social, some guy walking into a grocery store and shopping. Watch how he does it in your head. NOW pick up a pencil, just write down words. Descriptive words. Things and names that are associated with your character. Lines he might say. Doodle. Now wait and think about it for a couple of days, talk to your buddies. Pick out other cool characters and pull the stuff that was cool about them out and add it to your new character. NOW you can write about him as a person. You don't have to describe everything that occured in his past, leave it open for development. Write an opening scene that would introduce this character in a movie. SHOW the reader what he's like, don't just tell them. Don't commit yourself to concrete traits. How many people 'Never smile.' or 'Can't trust people.' Avoid using statements that describe how other people react to him. You don't need to show this writing to anyone if you don't want to. Now, maybe you can come up with some stats. Go for accuracy, don't worry about how many points you spend or whatever. Just reflect what you know about him. After that you can go back over the numbers and make sure that they fit the rules. If you still need someone else to help you like your character. Start over. Get your friends to quiz you about your character, they should ask you questions about things you haven't thought of yet. "Does he like to swim? Who was the girl that broke his heart?" The answers aren't important UNLESS you WANT them to be. Now play him for a bit, and you've got CHARACTER.

BitBasher

Mar 8 2004, 12:14 AM

Post #27

Traumatizing players since 1992

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QUOTE

You don't need SoTA. The rules for cracking MagLocks are in the basic book, pg. 235. Everyone is correct that you need both the Electronics and Electronics B/R skill. Or, you could save some skill points and get a sequencer and a MagLock passkey, instead.

The problem with that is that maglock passkeys are VERY expensive, and like a sequencer only works on one type of maglock. There are card swipe, keypad, retinal and thumb maglcoks off the top of my head, and you need a different type to bypass each. It's doable, just very, very expensive. Not counting maglocks that use a combination of the two above.

Jason Farlander View Member Profile	Mar 8 2004, 12:14 AM Post #28
Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,049 Joined: 24-March 03 Member No.: 4,323	Echo what Glyph said about Etiquette - if you ever intend to buy anything in game, you'll need it. What chargen system did you use? If you used priority system, your skills are off by a point (or, at least, im pretty sure they are). If you used Build point, how did you spend your 400,000 :nuyen: ? In either case, did you end up using "compulsive: opening doors" as a 3 point flaw? It seems so, and I don't know if I agree with that.

Zazen

Mar 8 2004, 12:22 AM

Post #29

Shooting Target

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QUOTE (Shanshu Freeman)

For now I'd just like your thoughts on the raw character

I'd just like to say that you left a lot out; I hope this is preliminary. If this was a completed character and it was handed to me, I'd ask a bunch of questions and tell them to write their answers on the sheet and bring it back to me.

Just a few that jump to mind:

What is the characters compulsion?
What is the characters race? If human, why know Sperethiel?
Do you have resources, lifestyles, contacts, and gear?
Why Latin?
What's non-metahuman psychology?
How do you see Common Sense and Impulsive working together?

etc. etc. I assume that this stuff is addressed in your background, but you've still got to assign resources and clean up some stuff like the martial arts specialization and the unassigned rating of your forensic medicine skill.

Large Mike View Member Profile	Mar 8 2004, 12:22 AM Post #30
Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,311 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Calgary, Alberta Member No.: 2,062	HEll, if you ever intend to open your mouth in-game you'll need etiquette.

Shanshu Freeman

Mar 8 2004, 12:38 AM

Post #31

Moving Target

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QUOTE (Dog)

IMHO, I think that the biggest problem is this:

You asked folks to critique a character, then posted a bunch of numbers. You added a rudimentary and (sorry to say) cliched history afterwards and have only made a token attempt to describe a personality.

You are designing your character backwards.

Try this: Start with an idea. A character from a book or a novel, a person you think is cool. A song that could be a theme song, a cool picture, whatever.
Now picture a scene, any kind of scene, action, social, some guy walking into a grocery store and shopping. Watch how he does it in your head.

NOW pick up a pencil, just write down words. Descriptive words.
Things and names that are associated with your character. Lines he might say. Doodle.

Now wait and think about it for a couple of days, talk to your buddies. Pick out other cool characters and pull the stuff that was cool about them out and add it to your new character.

NOW you can write about him as a person. You don't have to describe everything that occured in his past, leave it open for development. Write an opening scene that would introduce this character in a movie. SHOW the reader what he's like, don't just tell them. Don't commit yourself to concrete traits. How many people 'Never smile.' or 'Can't trust people.' Avoid using statements that describe how other people react to him. You don't need to show this writing to anyone if you don't want to.

Now, maybe you can come up with some stats. Go for accuracy, don't worry about how many points you spend or whatever. Just reflect what you know about him.

After that you can go back over the numbers and make sure that they fit the rules.

If you still need someone else to help you like your character. Start over.

Get your friends to quiz you about your character, they should ask you questions about things you haven't thought of yet. "Does he like to swim? Who was the girl that broke his heart?" The answers aren't important UNLESS you WANT them to be.

Now play him for a bit, and you've got CHARACTER.

I have my character background fully fleshed out, in fact, I did before I came up with the numbers. It's *how* I came up with the numbers.

Perhaps I should have been more specific, when I posted

QUOTE

For now I'd just like your thoughts on the raw character

I meant "Just critique the raw data/numbers in terms of in game effectiveness." (because I wasn't planning on sharing the story and background, which I later added a basic sketch outline of to appease those who were curious) So I'll accept responsiblity for not spelling out exactly what kind of responses I was looking for. None-the-less, some people seem to have gotten the idea I meant to convey anyway. This:

Glyph

QUOTE

You don't need SoTA. The rules for cracking MagLocks are in the basic book, pg. 235. Everyone is correct that you need both the Electronics and Electronics B/R skill. Or, you could save some skill points and get a sequencer and a MagLock passkey, instead.

This character really needs an Etiquette skill. Negotiation is useful, but not essential for every single character to have. Etiquette, however, is absolutely necessary for any character.

I agree with the others that this character is spread too thin. You lack the full range of skills needed to be a covert ops specialist, but with no cyberware you will not be able to stand up to cybered characters or adepts. Roleplaying and tactics are fine and all, but they can't completely compensate for low or missing skills, or for lacking advantages that many of your opponents will possess.

My advice? Given the general concept you have in mind, you have too many combat skills. I would lower Strength, raise Charisma, drop the Edged Weapons and Clubs skills and lower the Unarmed Combat (keep that high Quickness and that high Pistols skill, though), and take both Electronics B/R and some social skills - namely, Etiquette and Negotiation. With the pistols skill, you can still be effective in combat, but with those other skills, you will much better fit the role of snoop/spy/fast-talker. By the way, you might be able to take performance/acting as a knowledge skill to supplement your Etiquette or Negotiation tests.

is exactly the kind of response I was looking for.

Siege View Member Profile	Mar 8 2004, 04:54 AM Post #32
Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,065 Joined: 16-January 03 From: Fayetteville, NC Member No.: 3,916	Etiquette is nice, Negotiations is nice -- some form of skilled interaction is always beneficial when you're dealing in a market that revolves around trust and personal rep. That being said, you can live on dealing through intermediaries -- asking your crew to employ their social skills on your behalf. Frag, look at Bill Gates. Be that as it may, I'm curious as to why you picked Acting as it is no longer an Active skill in 3rd edition -- certainly not anything that is not covered by Active skills (as Glyph?) pointed out. Negotiations as Active and Acting as a knowledge skill would be the numerically superior way to go and it makes more sense in the existing rules structure. Electronics: I'm still unsure as to why you picked Electronics -- given that maglocks are at least half Electronics B/R. I have, since looked at the BBB and realized that Bit is correct. My crew tends to leave it as Electronics B/R solely. Split the two skills and specialize -- that should bring you pretty closely to where you were before and enable you to roll against almost any maglock as well as being well-versed in other electronic arenas. -Siege Sorry, I'm working through a buzz -- I have no idea if this will make sese tomorrow, but it's well-intended.

Sphynx

Mar 8 2004, 08:27 AM

Post #33

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QUOTE (Dog)

You are designing your character backwards.

NO!!!! Do not listen to this man. His way is the backwards way. (actually his way is just "his way", not right/wrong or backwards).

I think the best way to make a character is to just go through the spells/cyber sections until something really hits your fancy and focus your character around what you find. Example: When I got to the Telekinetic Manipulation spells, I knew I'd found my true love in the game. Despite the fact that, (until you read about Trauma Dampeners anyhows), I'll take drain everytime I cast those spells, they are a must-have for me. I also am completely in love with smartlinks and cybereyes. Love how they look, how they feel, and can really imagine seeing cross-hairs in my vision and loving it. Then of course, once I saw a Transducer, I couldn't imagine not having one of those, like my own little drain-free telepathy. Now all I had to do was "min max" to make sure my essence is 5.000 exactly. Finish adding some spells since I -must- be magical to cast the spells, find the most survivor friendly spells, add them with some sustaining foci.

NOW, just like the book says, NOW that I have my character numbers, I start back-thinking about his background. I never even fill out Knowledge skills until this point because I don't ever roll knowledge skills, they're IMHO, to show what your character is about. What occupation would let me legally have all this stuff I want to carry since I do want it to be legal? How'd I get the job? What led me to that vs another occupation? Why am I no longer working there... or am I? What do I do after hour? On weekends? I see that my "Raven Shaman" has both alot of cyber and a decent Electronics skill... I obviously love 'tech' so why did Raven choose me? Or perhaps, why did Raven suggest I cyber-up some? ;) -then- I get to the GM questions that I just know he's going to ask... "So, you're an Ex-LoneStar security mage working part time now for KnightErrant as a WardEstablisher. Sounds very magical.. why is it you don't have AuraReading as a skill?". Of course, I can't say "Because it's a stupid skill, I roll Intelligence..." so I come up with "I'm a Shaman, I've no interest in studying how to read Auras, that's too Hermetic for me, I look and I let my instinct guide me". Once I've come up with an answer to all the questions he'll ask (showing your character on the Forum is a great way to get more questions), my background is usually more fleshed out than those that start with background.

It's too easy, when 'imagine first' a character to picture this guy with swords on his back, stalking in the shadows with ninja-garb. Even if you're starting out imagining a Decker or Rigger. Imagination first tends to make your wish of how you could be into your character. Numbers first makes something new that you have to develop an awesome, doesn't quite fit yourself, but you get everything you really want for your character, kinda background which is more fully fleshed out because you have to come up with all the experiences on why/how you got something. ;)

Anyways, my way isn't the "right" way either, just wanting to point out that no matter how you build your character (me doing it completely opposite of Dog), background is easy to have just as fleshed out, and IMHO, his way makes it harder to make a character than my ways makes it to make a background. ;)

Sphynx

Fahr View Member Profile	Mar 8 2004, 04:56 PM Post #34
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 320 Joined: 13-August 02 From: Austin, Republic of Texas (not CAS) Member No.: 3,094	Sphynx: both ways work... Shanshu: If you are looking to strengthen your numbers, or make yourself more tuned to your purpose, it helps us to know what role he will be filling in the team. is he the jack of all trades? covert ops (sounds like it but not enough covert skills)? skilled at combat (to diverse, no cyber/magic, no special toys) he's not a mage/shaman so no magical rolse (why knowledge magic) Does he know lots of people? low chr says probably not(from your phys descriprion sounds like his chr should be a 3 not a 2, unless he is rude too.) if he has a defined role it will help us give you better advice. -Mike R.

Lindt View Member Profile	Mar 8 2004, 05:57 PM Post #35
Man In The Machine Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,264 Joined: 26-February 02 From: I-495 S Member No.: 1,105	In summery. If you want us to give you suggestions and what not, please please please (I cant say it enough) at least have the 'charcter' part with it. We love backgrounds. And yes, Dog and Sphynx you are both right. Also consider sending at least some of the gear with it next time. Personaly, I like the idea of the 'opening doors' motief, so run with that. It has potential, much like a loaded gun, it just needs a little kick to get it right.

Arach View Member Profile	Mar 9 2004, 09:53 PM Post #36
Target Group: Members Posts: 1 Joined: 3-March 03 Member No.: 4,193	.....And everybody's friends again. Gosh. Brings a tear to my eye.

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