Money for Magicians and Adepts? Options

[Angelone]

Yes, but you will have all the useful "external" ware with... maybe 100.000? Then what?
A deltaware will keep you searching for money for a lot of time...

It's harder to lose/break/be disarmed of implants. It's easy for someone to take your monowhip off your belt, harder for them to take or even find the one in your finger.

The monowhip is just an example, it's a valid arguement for all implants.

[Machiavelli]

Ahmm...no one takes your weapons from you unless you are dead or unconscious.^^ And if i earn money and karma, but i basically only need one of them excessive (most of the time karma), i anyway wouldn´t waste the other part (money) just to do anything with it. Mages simply don´t need that much money, thats inherent to this character class. So if your GM does´t let you use the optional rule "karma for cash" (or the other way round) you don´t have many choices left. Maybe this problem is the reason that so many mages live in a high- or luxury lifestyle? Simple desperation.^^

[Angelone]

People take your weapons all the time, most just don't see it as such. Going to a classy restaurant for a meet? No weapons. Meeting a VIP? No weapons. The Don wants "to talk"? No weapons.

Granted as a mage it's no real biggie. For others it's kinda a big deal. It came up a few times in the Missions even. One time you wake up in a room, dressed in a hospital gown, with a tied up school girl.

I was mainly talking about headware, with weapons as an after thought, I probably should have said cybereyes instead.

[sabs]

Even with a Mage character I could spend money for a seriously long time, before I ran out of things I wanted to get.

[Myrgan]

So mages live cheaper, I honestly don't see how that's a disadvantage. A well developed mage with the right spells and a set of force 6 foci, including a dozen sustaining foci, will have spent a little over a million, but can take on ten of sabs' 5.2 mill cyberpunks any day. The only thing that stops mages from being completely overpowered is their heavy karma thrust.

[Machiavelli]

That is the point. I wouldn´t really spent half a million nuyen in foci i cannot bond because i lack the karma, would you? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[sabs]

So mages live cheaper, I honestly don't see how that's a disadvantage. A well developed mage with the right spells and a set of force 6 foci, including a dozen sustaining foci, will have spent a little over a million, but can take on ten of sabs' 5.2 mill cyberpunks any day. The only thing that stops mages from being completely overpowered is their heavy karma thrust.

Sadly it's true. Even if those 10 cyberpunks were dwarves, with maxed out willpower and genetic therapy to their willpower. The best they could do is 8 dice of "defense" against those spells.

Although, I could make a 200k hacker, that could kill that well developed mage.. easily.
Mage has to sleep, his home is not un-hackable.
Hack his home system, house drones to ignore the Dragonfly drone flying into his house and cutting his throat while he sleeps.
Reprogram his house to put cleaner in his morning Soykaf™
Edit the automated supply delivery system and deliver a batch of poisoned soynutrient.

And given the number of mage characters who take Gremlins as a NQ, it might actually be easier than all that.

[Karoline]

Sadly it's true. Even if those 10 cyberpunks were dwarves, with maxed out willpower and genetic therapy to their willpower. The best they could do is 8 dice of "defense" against those spells.

Although, I could make a 200k hacker, that could kill that well developed mage.. easily.
Mage has to sleep, his home is not un-hackable.
Hack his home system, house drones to ignore the Dragonfly drone flying into his house and cutting his throat while he sleeps.

Well, now you're just playing 'he who has initiative wins'.

Because the hacker also has to sleep, and the hacker's home is not astrally warded.
Summon a spirit to materialize inside his house and cut his throat while he sleeps.

[Machiavelli]

Aaaaaah....again my motto "everything has a weak spot" comes back into play. SR is great, isn´t it? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[sabs]

True.

Although the poor defenseless streetsam is actually screwed from both sides.

Spirits.. are so damn good.

[Machiavelli]

Sammies have big weapons most of the time. Countermeasure...GO.^^

[sabs]

Sammies have big weapons most of the time. Countermeasure...GO.^^

How does the street sam stop the force 8 mana/stunbolt to the head he just got?

[Machiavelli]

Ahm...this requires serious overcasting from the mage to summon the spirit which can cause serious death. So if you P**ss of a mage that can summon a spirit at force 8, you are already f***cked up.

[Karoline]

How does the street sam stop the force 8 mana/stunbolt to the head he just got?

Astral Hazing.

[sabs]

Ahm...this requires serious overcasting from the mage to summon the spirit which can cause serious death. So if you P**ss of a mage that can summon a spirit at force 8, you are already f***cked up.

It does?
Force 4 spirit catches you in your sleep. Gets 1 free attack with no dodge, possibly 2 (how many rounds of surprised do you get for attacking someone asleep) that's assuming the GM doesn't just give the spirit an autokill for getting to slice your throat open while you're asleep.

[Machiavelli]

Correct. You could also argument "how can the mage with his low physical attributes and skills dodge a 12D / AP-4 attack from a sniper rifle dodge 6-8 hits from the sammie".

[sabs]

Astral Hazing.

Which is a special quality from Runner's Companion.
Not something everyone has.
Though it does seem like a must buy for non awakened combat characters.

[Karoline]

Correct. You could also argument "how can the mage with his low physical attributes and skills dodge a 12D / AP-4 attack from a sniper rifle dodge 6-8 hits from the sammie".

Especially when it was made from a mile away, and the mage is thus unaware of the attack, and thus not allowed to make a defensive roll at all.

Like I said 'he who has initiative wins'

[Machiavelli]

Magic resistance would also work...don´t know if it was already in the core-cook.

[sabs]

Correct. You could also argument "how can the mage with his low physical attributes and skills dodge a 12D / AP-4 attack from a sniper rifle dodge 6-8 hits from the sammie".

All at force 6 (or higher, on foci)
Combat sense spell
Increased Reaction
Detect Enemies (extended)
Increase Body
Armor

as a for example (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Admitedly you need to be a 4 Initiate Grade mage casting a force 10 spell to get a range of 1km on the detect Enemies. So that's not as awesome.

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

Magic resistance would also work...don´t know if it was already in the core-cook.

Yes it is, and it is a GREAT advantage for every mundane.

[Machiavelli]

Surprise = no dodge roll.^^

[Myrgan]

That is the point. I wouldn�t really spent half a million nuyen in foci i cannot bond because i lack the karma, would you? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Well that's exactly *my* point! It's a *good* thing the mage will take forever to get that kind of karma together. If you have a mage with 2 mill and you let him trade 1 mill for enough karma to bond 1 mill's worth of foci, you will have one overpowered mage.

[Machiavelli]

IF the GM allows "cash for karma" and now it ist getting a little big complicated again.^^

[sabs]

Surprise = no dodge roll.^^

You still get body/armor soak.
And getting surrprise on an established mage.. is trickier than you might expect.