Blood Mages and Dunkelzahn's Will |
Blood Mages and Dunkelzahn's Will |
Oct 1 2010, 03:56 AM
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#1
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Target Group: Members Posts: 80 Joined: 26-September 10 From: USA Member No.: 19,075 |
Ok, so as last topic of mine said, I'm new to shadowrun and I have (yet another) question. How dangerous are blood mages? I've done some preliminary research into blood mages but have not really yielded any pertaining information as to how dangerous they are. In my game we came across a blood mage (i missed the session where he was introduced was there for the second session) and he basically wrecked everything with black fireballs... how difficult would it be to capture him alive? I understand that if characters (or others) turn a live blood mage into the Draco Corporation, they will get on million nuyen and I'm thinking this could be permanent financing for the campaign... Also, since they are worth so much, they must be utterly difficult to capture. Any idea what they are capable of??
I understand that the GM has full digression over their actual powers but I'm hoping for some further information on them... I only have access to the Sourcebook and Arsenal... |
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Oct 1 2010, 04:14 AM
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#2
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,542 Joined: 30-September 08 From: D/FW Megaplex Member No.: 16,387 |
All a blood mage is is a normal Awakened person ([Mystic] Adept/Magician) with anything blood-related - IE: Blood Fetishes (page 14, Digital Grimoire), Blood Metamagics (pages 139-141, Street Magic), or summoning free blood spirits (Calling, pages 174-175, Running Wild; pages 106-110, Street Magic; and also detailed on my threads here and here).
The mages are only as dangerous as they are easy to be hit with Slab. Also, the bounty is only for those mages on a "Most Wanted" list. |
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Oct 1 2010, 04:36 AM
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#3
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Target Group: Members Posts: 80 Joined: 26-September 10 From: USA Member No.: 19,075 |
Also, the bounty is only for those mages on a "Most Wanted" list. What does that mean then? What makes a person "Most Wanted?" Highly proficient in blood magic or what? Also (i hate doing this for fear of being someone breaking the rules, i swear it's out of curiosity...) What would a blood magician look like statwise if you as a GM would make it? I honestly don't know the magic system in this game as I made my character in haste (less than a day before first session) and didn't read that section fully. I'm wondering what makes them so dangerous. *sigh* i hate being such a noob... |
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Oct 1 2010, 04:58 AM
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#4
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,542 Joined: 30-September 08 From: D/FW Megaplex Member No.: 16,387 |
Don't worry about your "noobness" - experience comes just after you needed it, after all.
The thing that puts blood mages on the Most Wanted list is them being identified positively as a Blood Mage by the Foundation. This was meant to prevent "Witch-Hunt"-styled attacks on basically any Awakened that acts oddly, or against any person just to try and make a quick mil. Read over my Free Spirit/Ally Spirit thread and think about what you can do with the rules and suggestions I present there. Anything you come up with will fit your campaign much better than something I stat up. That aside, Infected make natural Blood Mages. Ghoul Adepts could easily stumble on the Cannibalize Metamagic, and Vampires, Nosferatu, Wendigo, and a few others make good Blood Magician/Mystic Adepts. One Blood Mage I used for my campaign was a Troll Western Drake Adept that used Cannibalize and Power Bleed to take Immunity (Toxins) from a Devil Rat and Regeneration from a Vampire, in addition to maxing out all his physical stats. He also had an Infusion Focus and changed his Elemental Attack to Blast. I played him poorly so he only lasted 1 Combat Turn. If you decide to do something similar, I suggest using a Feathered Drake Elf and trying to stay at range with his Elemental Attack instead of trying to go melee like I did. Keep the Elemental Attack (Blast) though. Ask me if you want me to actually scrounge around for his stats or make a new guy's stats. I have one set of 400 BP stats for a Nosferatu waiting in the rafters, but I'm certain that one would TPK a group if used anything remotely resembling "right." |
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Oct 1 2010, 05:01 AM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 935 Joined: 2-September 10 Member No.: 19,000 |
According to fluff and a handful of canon-statted examples, blood mages are very, very dangerous.
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Oct 1 2010, 05:03 AM
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#6
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,542 Joined: 30-September 08 From: D/FW Megaplex Member No.: 16,387 |
Yah.
First off they're mages. Secondly, they're smart and resourceful enough to not be killed on sight. |
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Oct 1 2010, 05:08 AM
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#7
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 202 Joined: 1-November 09 Member No.: 17,826 |
Essentially Blood mages are so dangerous b/c They found a working solution to the primary inhibitor of magical badassary (Drain). The only thing that stops a mages from doing the truly impossible is they want to survive doing it. The more impossible the more power it takes the more dangerous the drain is. There are other factors involved. But thats the general concept. Why is this bad you ask? Good question, the means to overcome this problem is by shifting this drain to other people in the form of shedding the other person's blood. Think Virgin Sacrifice. This make them feared, dangerous, ruthless and powerful all good reasons to hunt them down and collect mad bounties.
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Oct 1 2010, 05:19 AM
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#8
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Target Group: Members Posts: 80 Joined: 26-September 10 From: USA Member No.: 19,075 |
Ask me if you want me to actually scrounge around for his stats or make a new guy's stats. I have one set of 400 BP stats for a Nosferatu waiting in the rafters, but I'm certain that one would TPK a group if used anything remotely resembling "right." To clarify, this character is not for me, I have no ambitions to play a blood mage but am merely trying to see what I'm up against. The GM already said that it was interesting to see the Blood Mage in question (an NPC) as a possible Dunkelzahn's Will collection when I asked him. I'm merely trying to metagame the knowledge of what blood mages are so I can know what to search for in character (I'm 1/2 sniper, 1/2 hacker)... |
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Oct 1 2010, 05:23 AM
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#9
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,431 Joined: 3-December 03 Member No.: 5,872 |
Ah part hacker and you decided to use your data search skills by asking around on dumpshock. You aren't metagaming, you are role playing.
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Oct 1 2010, 05:26 AM
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#10
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Target Group: Members Posts: 80 Joined: 26-September 10 From: USA Member No.: 19,075 |
Ah part hacker and you decided to use your data search skills by asking around on dumpshock. You aren't metagaming, you are role playing. I feel less bad as a result of this post (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) . Seriously though, I fell into being hacker after nobody else took it and i had BP left to spend... I seriously didn't want to mess with the matrix and wanted to be pure sniper... now it's more of my specialty... :-/ |
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Oct 1 2010, 08:45 AM
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#11
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 873 Joined: 16-September 10 Member No.: 19,052 |
Essentially Blood mages are so dangerous b/c They found a working solution to the primary inhibitor of magical badassary (Drain). The only thing that stops a mages from doing the truly impossible is they want to survive doing it. The more impossible the more power it takes the more dangerous the drain is. There are other factors involved. But thats the general concept. Why is this bad you ask? Good question, the means to overcome this problem is by shifting this drain to other people in the form of shedding the other person's blood. Think Virgin Sacrifice. This make them feared, dangerous, ruthless and powerful all good reasons to hunt them down and collect mad bounties. This is the simple reason why even a "poorly" built blood mage can be a pest. For example: Summoning high-force spirits can be really dangerous. Binding them even more so. If you can just avoid the drain, all you really need are enough dice to get some services. For combat spells... well, it's mostly a waste, unless you want to go with those REALLY high drain elemental area spells. But seriously, an invisible stun-bolter is always more dangerous, really. Especially since he doesn't have to lug a collection of slaves around with him to power his magic. Which puts blood magic mostly the realm of conjuring and ritual magic in my book. However, if you walk into an Aztlan stronghold and meet the final "boss" in his tricked out lair, then he might just shoot force 12 fireballs at you, because he could be standing in rivers of blood. |
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Oct 1 2010, 11:20 AM
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#12
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,899 Joined: 29-October 09 From: Leiden, the Netherlands Member No.: 17,814 |
I feel less bad as a result of this post (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) . Seriously though, I fell into being hacker after nobody else took it and i had BP left to spend... I seriously didn't want to mess with the matrix and wanted to be pure sniper... now it's more of my specialty... :-/ Metagaming and powergaming in Shadowrun isn't quite the same as in D&D. Because the setting of Shadowrun is a high-tech society, characters in that society may be used to searching for information in a sensible and modern way (i.e. use google to look things up if they seem relevant) and have a modern rational/scientific approach towards gear selection. So choosing good weapons isn't powergaming; it's playing a smart tech-savvy character. Particularly hackers should be doing this; part of hacker attitude is curiosity and a "use knowledge to beat them" approach. (And before people misunderstand me: no, not everything goes, but using technology cleverly is okay in my book.) |
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Oct 1 2010, 03:45 PM
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#13
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Shooting Target Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,989 Joined: 28-July 09 From: Somewhere along the brazilian coast Member No.: 17,437 |
One thing most people didn't mentioned but I think it is worth telling. As far as the "shadows" know, Aztlan/Aztechnology deals HEAVILY with blood magic. Not every Aztlaner magician will use Blood Magic, but every high-echellon magician of the government/corporation will.
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Oct 1 2010, 04:03 PM
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#14
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Target Group: Members Posts: 80 Joined: 26-September 10 From: USA Member No.: 19,075 |
So even if you could capture a blood mage from Aztlan, you'd effectively be capturing a high ranking individual from their government for which they'd come after you with their entire security forces correct?
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Oct 1 2010, 04:12 PM
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#15
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Shooting Target Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,989 Joined: 28-July 09 From: Somewhere along the brazilian coast Member No.: 17,437 |
So even if you could capture a blood mage from Aztlan, you'd effectively be capturing a high ranking individual from their government for which they'd come after you with their entire security forces correct? "Like my grandfather used to say: you can't make omelets without making someone permanently deaf". I just pointed where is the best place to find Blood Magicians, I didn't say it should be easy, did I? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotfl.gif) |
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Oct 1 2010, 05:38 PM
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#16
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Great Dragon Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,082 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 |
So even if you could capture a blood mage from Aztlan, you'd effectively be capturing a high ranking individual from their government for which they'd come after you with their entire security forces correct? Since blood magic needs to be learned from an appropriate initiatory group or spirit tutor, it's safe to assume that a blood mage has some powerful friends. Of course given the ruthlessness and power lust of blood mages, these "friends" might actually be pleased if one of them gets captured and it helps their own agenda... |
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Oct 2 2010, 12:48 AM
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#17
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 873 Joined: 16-September 10 Member No.: 19,052 |
I just noticed a very nifty thing about blood magic is that while you can't heal drain damage magically, you should be able to heal self-mutilation for drain reduction. So while it doesn't SEEM to make sense to cut yourself to throw fireballs, it does make sense on the slightly longer run, if you survive (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) .
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Oct 2 2010, 05:30 AM
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#18
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 202 Joined: 1-November 09 Member No.: 17,826 |
I just noticed a very nifty thing about blood magic is that while you can't heal drain damage magically, you should be able to heal self-mutilation for drain reduction. So while it doesn't SEEM to make sense to cut yourself to throw fireballs, it does make sense on the slightly longer run, if you survive (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) . Somehow I don't find this comforting. |
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Oct 2 2010, 05:33 AM
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#19
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 604 Joined: 1-December 08 From: Sacramento, California Member No.: 16,646 |
I just noticed a very nifty thing about blood magic is that while you can't heal drain damage magically, you should be able to heal self-mutilation for drain reduction. So while it doesn't SEEM to make sense to cut yourself to throw fireballs, it does make sense on the slightly longer run, if you survive (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) . Follow that logic through the above mentioned Nosferatu Blood Mage. Regeneration and self-mutilation = powerful mojo with limited drain. |
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Oct 2 2010, 04:58 PM
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#20
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 202 Joined: 1-November 09 Member No.: 17,826 |
Follow that logic through the above mentioned Nosferatu Blood Mage. Regeneration and self-mutilation = powerful mojo with limited drain. This could also be used in another way. Find something with as many health levels as possible with regeneration and suddenly you have an nearly endless magic supply. In the end to fix that the rules would have to be changed so that damaged dealt to alleviate drain cannot be magically healed. But I think its more likely to just accept that Blood mages are Bad, and that fighting them you just have to expect them to do stuff like this. |
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Oct 2 2010, 05:03 PM
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#21
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 516 Joined: 22-July 10 From: Detroit Member No.: 18,843 |
If you can get your hands on it, the old Atzlan book is a trove of info on blood mages.
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Oct 2 2010, 05:07 PM
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#22
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 202 Joined: 1-November 09 Member No.: 17,826 |
Yeah its a great book.
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Oct 3 2010, 09:35 PM
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#23
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 873 Joined: 16-September 10 Member No.: 19,052 |
Follow that logic through the above mentioned Nosferatu Blood Mage. Regeneration and self-mutilation = powerful mojo with limited drain. That's pretty nasty, true. However, the idea of a guy who casts spells and then knifes himself nearly to death, and then knifes himself again to heal himself is just hilarious. It would almost make sense to play such a character - that would be like the ultimate masochist. And I disagree that you should house-rule that option away. I was even disappointed with the errata, that you couldn't normally heal drain damage. Actions per round is the key, and if you need to waste yours to heal yourself, you're not going to do other things with them. |
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Oct 4 2010, 04:23 AM
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#24
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,542 Joined: 30-September 08 From: D/FW Megaplex Member No.: 16,387 |
I've actually found a much more effective way of reducing drain than that. A few, actually.
The most logically acceptable one is for a(ny) mage to take Shielding and Absorption and then hit himself with a Touch-ranged Combat Spell. He then Absorbs the spell to reduce the Drain on his next spell. The next option I found was actually an interesting use for something that is still hotly debated on these here forums, so I'll only talk about it if you guys really want to know. And it has to do with the other classification of Awakened that have bounties on them from the Draco Foundation (I think it's them... or the other Dunkie-built magical research group). |
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Oct 4 2010, 04:32 AM
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#25
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 202 Joined: 1-November 09 Member No.: 17,826 |
I've actually found a much more effective way of reducing drain than that. A few, actually. The most logically acceptable one is for a(ny) mage to take Shielding and Absorption and then hit himself with a Touch-ranged Combat Spell. He then Absorbs the spell to reduce the Drain on his next spell. The next option I found was actually an interesting use for something that is still hotly debated on these here forums, so I'll only talk about it if you guys really want to know. And it has to do with the other classification of Awakened that have bounties on them from the Draco Foundation (I think it's them... or the other Dunkie-built magical research group). Well that certainly works, and could be very useful for a spell duel. The only downside being the magic Attribute limit. I'd be happy to take gander at it, if you don't want to start a debate on the board you can just drop a link to the thread. |
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