IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

4 Pages V   1 2 3 > »   
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Second-generation exoskeleton robotic suit
Badmoodguy88
post Oct 5 2010, 03:06 AM
Post #1


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 347
Joined: 28-June 10
Member No.: 18,765



http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39386045/ns/te...ch_and_gadgets/
kind of cool
I guess in Shdowrun 2070 it would be military armor with strength enhancements.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Summerstorm
post Oct 5 2010, 03:19 AM
Post #2


Running Target
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,000
Joined: 30-May 09
From: Germany
Member No.: 17,225



Hm... okay, that second version at least looks like you could weld some armor on it... and some kind of minigatling on the arm or something *g*.

Hm, i am still interested in the energy consumption though. Same as for that big-dog robot and such thingies. I always think they would run out after 10-30 minutes. How good is the energy storage/conversation rate in modern robots anyway? (If they have to carry their own stuff)

Read about a robot being able to refuel by consuming organic matter. (Where the people were so shocked because they thought the robot would eat dead bodies... it would actually eat dry wood and such). Hm... How far can one get with an atomic battery (betavoltic or something) Lots of power, long lasting... but they can't get out much in short amount of time...
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Badmoodguy88
post Oct 5 2010, 04:24 AM
Post #3


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 347
Joined: 28-June 10
Member No.: 18,765



The current one probably does run out of power fast but it is still worth it as an aid to moving heavy things. Something that would need a forklift to movie safely could be moved by this. There is a gap between what a human can lift and the heavy weights that a fork lift is normally meant for. Probably the third gen one will be actually worth using. I could see them being used in construction. Reminds me of Appleseed and Alien's 2.

I'll give you an example. My buddy is in the marines. He and some people he works with are given a task with a deadline. It involved getting a 50 gallon barrel up onto a rack inside a tent. The tent had some multi ton vehicle currently with no engine in it. They would have gotten a tow truck (which they did know how to operate) to pull out the vehicle and then used a forklift to put the barrel in the rack, but there was construction materials all around this tent that they would also have to move. With a deadline that did not take all these unforeseen complications into account my buddy and his coworkers did something dangerous. They used a jack and 5 people to manhandle this thing onto its rack. It slipped and my friend lost a bit of one of his fingers and could easily have lost a hand.

In the same situation they could have used two of these exoskeleton things and got the job done. The 30 minute battery life would not have mattered.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
hobgoblin
post Oct 5 2010, 05:59 AM
Post #4


panda!
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 10,331
Joined: 8-March 02
From: north of central europe
Member No.: 2,242



The one man missile loading example may be most interesting, as i think one need perhaps 3-4 people pr missile today.

and the flexibility of this system outperforms any forklift or similar.

The basic problem now is that i think there is 3-4 people working logistics for each person in the field. If this system can bring the ratio down closer to 1:1 it will free up a whole lot of manpower.

And notice that it can also be tethered. if one need to load or unload a bunch of stuff in a fixed location, plug it in and keep going all day.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Saint Sithney
post Oct 5 2010, 06:13 AM
Post #5


Runner
******

Group: Members
Posts: 2,705
Joined: 5-October 09
From: You are in a clearing
Member No.: 17,722



SLC, hunh? Those LDS types sure do love some robots, neh?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Doc Chase
post Oct 5 2010, 01:10 PM
Post #6


Runner
******

Group: Members
Posts: 3,179
Joined: 10-June 10
From: St. Louis, UCAS/CAS Border
Member No.: 18,688



They do. This particular model is more Aliens than Warhammer - still badass, IMO - but it does make me wonder whether or not a diesel generator could power an armored version to do the Iron Man bit - maybe sans flying.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
yoippari
post Oct 6 2010, 01:47 AM
Post #7


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 375
Joined: 15-November 06
From: Salem, Dwarven Hell (Tir Tairngier)
Member No.: 9,865



I'm picturing this in maybe two generations as a physical therapy aid. Not full mobility asst (I think they have something like that already though) but one that just helps.

The tethered thing would make it useful in a fixed area like a hanger or aircraft carrier. Depending on stability add some jacks to the legs/feet and reach higher up.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Oct 6 2010, 06:08 AM
Post #8


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



This one's been around for some time - I saw it a year ago or more. There's also the Japanese version that's more mobile - HAL. There's also the Honda one.

If these guys get together and have some wierd 3-way brainchild, the world will be an amazing place really quickly.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Yama King
post Oct 6 2010, 01:35 PM
Post #9


Target
*

Group: Members
Posts: 36
Joined: 21-September 10
From: Livermore CA
Member No.: 19,060



Another RL news bit.

More Drones.. wheeled autonomous security. The answer to rent-a cops?

http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2...obotic-sentries
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
hobgoblin
post Oct 6 2010, 01:45 PM
Post #10


panda!
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 10,331
Joined: 8-March 02
From: north of central europe
Member No.: 2,242



nothing a good RPG can't deal with...
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
hobgoblin
post Oct 8 2010, 05:22 AM
Post #11


panda!
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 10,331
Joined: 8-March 02
From: north of central europe
Member No.: 2,242



http://www.ubergizmo.com/15/archives/2010/...walk_again.html
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Oct 8 2010, 06:18 AM
Post #12


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



'Bout time.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rayzorblades
post Oct 17 2010, 08:17 PM
Post #13


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 127
Joined: 22-October 08
Member No.: 16,542



QUOTE (Badmoodguy88 @ Oct 4 2010, 08:06 PM) *
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39386045/ns/te...ch_and_gadgets/
kind of cool
I guess in Shdowrun 2070 it would be military armor with strength enhancements.

I've been keeping up with Raytheon Sarcos for years now. What really gets me hot about their stuff is that it's hydraulic, the potential for which is amazing. The power limitations and whatnot have always bugged me especially since Japan's Cyberdyne and their Hybrid Assistive Limb suit can multiply your strength by a factor of 10 and have enough juice for 2 hours.

QUOTE (Summerstorm @ Oct 4 2010, 08:19 PM) *
Read about a robot being able to refuel by consuming organic matter. (Where the people were so shocked because they thought the robot would eat dead bodies... it would actually eat dry wood and such). Hm... How far can one get with an atomic battery (betavoltic or something) Lots of power, long lasting... but they can't get out much in short amount of time...
You're talking about EATR. The shock the people had is understandable, I remember reading that EATR could get a helluva lot more energy from dead bodies than it could from bark mulch.

As to the atomic powering idea, I like that, and the new supercapacitor tech could solve the duration problem. Does anyone remember the Ford Nucleon concept from the 60s? A mini nuclear reactor for thousands of miles of driving, maybe that could be adapted.

QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Oct 4 2010, 10:59 PM) *
And notice that it can also be tethered. if one need to load or unload a bunch of stuff in a fixed location, plug it in and keep going all day.
If the tethering was portable and contained in the suit it'd be even more convenient. Like those vacuums with cord retrators.

Wireless power is even coming along pretty good these days. Imagine if one of these could tap into the grid wirelessly from even a few feet away (IIRC 10 feet is the distance they got it up to at MIT). Most places in a city have the grid a few feet away and supercapacitor tech dispursed through the suit would make it so that you didn't need to stay near a powerline (or plug outlet if you were tethering).

I also remember hearing tales of an ultra high output black silicon solar panel type device constructed by MIT that could be useful for keeping capacitors topped up.

That link with the paraplegics walking using HULC derived tech put a frog in my throat. Good show.

I think the whole thing really comes down to collating data and technologies. A few of the ones I've listed here could possibly be used to really offset the need for tethering, if not totally circumvent it.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Oct 18 2010, 03:51 AM
Post #14


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



QUOTE (Rayzorblades @ Oct 17 2010, 03:17 PM) *
I also remember hearing tales of an ultra high output black silicon solar panel type device constructed by MIT that could be useful for keeping capacitors topped up.

IIRC they were using liquid salt at like 3,000 degrees F or something to retain the heat. You must be a daily reader of SlashDot like myself to keep up with all that stuff.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Karoline
post Oct 18 2010, 04:23 AM
Post #15


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,679
Joined: 19-September 09
Member No.: 17,652



This reminds me, I've been seeing ads for some show about advanced robotics/AI on either science or discovery. Looked cool, they had an anthroform (4 legged) drone that was walking along, and someone kicked it, and it actually caught itself.

Also, what was the first generation? I've seen this one for a few months now at least.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
KarmaInferno
post Oct 18 2010, 04:29 AM
Post #16


Old Man Jones
********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 4,415
Joined: 26-February 02
From: New York
Member No.: 1,699



BigDog?





-k
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rayzorblades
post Oct 18 2010, 01:09 PM
Post #17


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 127
Joined: 22-October 08
Member No.: 16,542



QUOTE (Neraph @ Oct 17 2010, 08:51 PM) *
IIRC they were using liquid salt at like 3,000 degrees F or something to retain the heat. You must be a daily reader of SlashDot like myself to keep up with all that stuff.

Haha among many other places.

QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ Oct 17 2010, 09:29 PM) *


That was EPIC! Man I had no idea that particular tech had come so far. I usually ignore drone stuff.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Karoline
post Oct 18 2010, 05:08 PM
Post #18


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,679
Joined: 19-September 09
Member No.: 17,652



QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ Oct 17 2010, 11:29 PM) *

Yeah, that was it.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Oct 19 2010, 12:18 AM
Post #19


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



Big-Dog is fairly old-ish. Heck, they have some steam-powered versions.

... That is not to say that it's so old it originated as steam powered. Just that it is old. And they also have some steam powered.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Karoline
post Oct 19 2010, 12:47 AM
Post #20


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,679
Joined: 19-September 09
Member No.: 17,652



Yeah, if it originated with steam power... scary.

But yeah, it is on a channel called 'green planet', and the show is called 'Dean of Invention'. Sounded like it was going to involve all kinds of other stuff like nanobots. I'll have to find that channel.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Smokeskin
post Oct 19 2010, 11:29 AM
Post #21


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 881
Joined: 31-July 06
From: Denmark
Member No.: 8,995



Gasoline contains about 35 MJ per litre. 1 litre would cover the energy expenditure of a grown man for 3 days, and that's including all the overhead of maintaining the body. If such a suit required 5 times the energy of our bodies, the soldier only needs 1.5 litres of gasoline per day to power it, less than his water requirements in hot environments.

If we don't want to use combustion engines, lithium ion batteries would be an alternative - if you take the Tesla Roadster, it has 450kg (1000 lbs) of batteries storing 190 MJ. 100 kgs (220 lbs) of batteries could power such a suit for a day.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rayzorblades
post Oct 19 2010, 07:54 PM
Post #22


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 127
Joined: 22-October 08
Member No.: 16,542



Including to carry the additional weight of the batteries/fuel/engine?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Doc Chase
post Oct 19 2010, 08:17 PM
Post #23


Runner
******

Group: Members
Posts: 3,179
Joined: 10-June 10
From: St. Louis, UCAS/CAS Border
Member No.: 18,688



That was my concern. I would figure on this suit weighing about 800-1200 lbs after armor, electronics, engine, fuel storage, and pilot survival supplies are added. I think it'd require a great deal more than 1.5L a day.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rayzorblades
post Oct 20 2010, 10:57 AM
Post #24


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 127
Joined: 22-October 08
Member No.: 16,542



Another thing I'm wondering about the gasoline. Is that 35 MJ/L figure the amount of total energy in the gasoline? Or the 30% the can be derived from a combustion engine? If the former, then combustion will only yield about 12 MJ/L, if the latter then the actual total is over 105 MJ/L.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Smokeskin
post Oct 20 2010, 01:38 PM
Post #25


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 881
Joined: 31-July 06
From: Denmark
Member No.: 8,995



QUOTE (Rayzorblades @ Oct 20 2010, 12:57 PM) *
Another thing I'm wondering about the gasoline. Is that 35 MJ/L figure the amount of total energy in the gasoline? Or the 30% the can be derived from a combustion engine? If the former, then combustion will only yield about 12 MJ/L, if the latter then the actual total is over 105 MJ/L.


I don't know, but we're comparing to what energy we put into a human body, and our bodies are inefficient too, plus we have lots of overhead going to just keeping cells alive and running, growing new cells, breathing and pumping blood around, even to stand still requires muscle activity.

Even if my estimates were off by factor 2 or 5, it is still clear that powering stuff like this isn't impossible, it isn't even that hard. I think people overestimate the power problem because they're thinking in terms of toys with crap batteries that run dry quickly. That's not the right way to look at it. You should be looking at stuff like excavators. A 30 ton excavator can dig and shovel tons of dirt around at around 30 litres per hour - I don't know if you can conclude that a 1 ton miniexcavator uses 1L per hour digging dirt, but even if was 2 or 3 L per hour, we're still looking at more power and much harder work than you'd need for a soldier's suit. Look at how far a 2 ton car can drive on a single liter of fuel. Look at how small an engine and fuel tank can get a human flying in an ultralite.

Now think about how far any of those performances are from what a human can do. And this suit just needs to outdo human performance by a factor 5 to allow it to weigh 800lbs - I think engine and fuel would fit in a backpack. Gasoline is really, really powerful stuff. Lithium ion batteries aren't too shabby either.

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

4 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 
Reply to this topicStart new topic

 



RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 26th February 2024 - 03:19 PM

Topps, Inc has sole ownership of the names, logo, artwork, marks, photographs, sounds, audio, video and/or any proprietary material used in connection with the game Shadowrun. Topps, Inc has granted permission to the Dumpshock Forums to use such names, logos, artwork, marks and/or any proprietary materials for promotional and informational purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not affiliated with the Dumpshock Forums in any official capacity whatsoever.