Energy fields and non-projectile/alternate weapons, ....its the way of the future Options

[Pollux710]

Gauss weapons and lasers are pretty much all I've found concerning lethal "future" style weapons. How could one incorporate things such as Damper fields, shield arrays, "cloaking" fields, phasors and plasma weapons. Obviously these things would be RND steal type runs, and all in the prototype phase. But, I'm looking at getting some hitec fencine and sabotage runs going and I would like the input from the Dumpshock genius' pool. What would AP be like? just half armor like normal lasers? Would the damage be higher?

How would energy fields work? just add some armor? would it have a threshold like a character? or just last a few turns?

[Neraph]

Magic.

Tech versions of Physical Barrier, Physical Chameleon, Ruthenium Polymers, and laser weapons.

I don't know how plasma weapons would work or matter, since they already have laser weapons. Functionally I'd assume them to be roughly the same.

[AppliedCheese]

Cloaking, at least in its prototype stages, would likely be something very akin to an actual, well, rain cloak. Right now there's a rain-coat prototype in Japan that can, from a single angle, provided no environmental interference, not moving, and with a dedicated camera, effectively provide the classic Predator "slightly blurred invisibility". Assuming research continues in that direction, its not hard to imagine that by 2072 there would be a prototype-set of loose coveralls with implemented sensors and its own PAN capable of at least providing that effect 360 degrees for slow and deliberate movement, with minor environmental factors accounted for. It would still be a bad idea to try and pull action stunts with it, as you would likely end up smearing/breaking/misaligning the sensors or the fabric...

[Neraph]

Cloaking, at least in its prototype stages, would likely be something very akin to an actual, well, rain cloak. Right now there's a rain-coat prototype in Japan that can, from a single angle, provided no environmental interference, not moving, and with a dedicated camera, effectively provide the classic Predator "slightly blurred invisibility". Assuming research continues in that direction, its not hard to imagine that by 2072 there would be a prototype-set of loose coveralls with implemented sensors and its own PAN capable of at least providing that effect 360 degrees for slow and deliberate movement, with minor environmental factors accounted for. It would still be a bad idea to try and pull action stunts with it, as you would likely end up smearing/breaking/misaligning the sensors or the fabric...

Go read anything about ruthenium polymers. The Chameleon Suit from the core book or the upgrade from Arsenal.

[Matsci]

Gauss weapons and lasers are pretty much all I've found concerning lethal "future" style weapons. How could one incorporate things such as Damper fields, shield arrays, "cloaking" fields, phasors and plasma weapons. Obviously these things would be RND steal type runs, and all in the prototype phase. But, I'm looking at getting some hitec fencine and sabotage runs going and I would like the input from the Dumpshock genius' pool. What would AP be like? just half armor like normal lasers? Would the damage be higher?

How would energy fields work? just add some armor? would it have a threshold like a character? or just last a few turns?

Damper fields and shield arrays would probably be just super high energy plasma windows. Basically a tech version of the physical barrier spell, with enormous energy requirements. You wouldn't be seeing man portable versions till much later. Basicly, it lets you create a wall of bullet proof glass in a special contained region.

cloaking fields would either be Ruthinum polymer, or exotic materials that can be energized to gain a negative index of reflectivity. True cloaking would bee stupid, as you couldn't see out. Instead

Phasers are just microwave lasers with a fancy name, and not real tech at all.

Plasma weapons would be bigger, hotter flamethrowers, incapable of hitting anything beyond a few meters away.

Keep in mind that shadowrun has it's own tech tree, and that star trek is not real science.

[Pollux710]

Just looking for ideas and mechanics for said ideas. Obviously I could run rail guns and the like similar to gauss weapons. I'm getting a bit Deus Ex with my ideas.

[AppliedCheese]

Ruthlenium Polymers read. If that's considered the state of the art (-4 dice), then ignore my previous comments.

Short of someone developing a fully integrated material capable of bending light from 360 degrees around it, dynamically to fit its new shape every movement, cloaking would be not so much. Negative reflectivity would create a "hole" in the vision that the human mind would probably try to auto-correct out at longer ranges and in poor light conditions, but would grow more and more noticeable as the target got closer/better lit.

[Yerameyahu]

Phasers aren't microwave lasers. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) They're Trek-tech that uses some kind of multi-dimension/warp thing.

When people say 'plasma', they might possibly mean 'plasma burners', but probably not. They probably mean 'packeted plasma' directed-energy weapons, like HALO or something. More scifi tech.

To the OP, you're probably asking the wrong questions. These things don't fit in SR. There's Eclipse Phase, maybe they're in that. There's D20 Modern-Future. Between this thread and the one about video-game power-armor, you're just not talking about SR at all.

[KarmaInferno]

Ruthy Polymers aren't so much invisibility as they are camouflage.

They blur out your visual image, but by themselves won't make you undetectable by sight.

Stacked with environmental & other modifiers, however, they can make a mediocre Stealth skill roll pretty good and a great Stealth roll darn near invisible.

To the OP, you're probably asking the wrong questions. These things don't fit in SR. There's Eclipse Phase, maybe they're in that. There's D20 Modern-Future. Between this thread and the one about video-game power-armor, you're just not talking about SR at all.

Yeah, Shadowrun tech isn't so much "SCIENCE FICTION" as it is really just "Today, Slightly Advanced".

Or as a certain television show called it, "Twenty Minutes Into The Future".



-k

[Yerameyahu]

Really, it's the difference between 'high tech' and 'scifi tech'. In SR, the bleeding-edge stuff is genetech, nanotech, Resonance-tech, (AI, sorta), cyborgs, and manatech (including cybermancy).

[Pollux710]

The farthest im really looking to go is something like FEAR 2 and HALO. Though without all the SPARTANs and stuff. The prototype plasma weapon in FEAR 2, Gauss weapons from StarCraft, the StarCraft 2 armor. Just looking for mechanics input, not a starting point. These are all really great threads though, thanks for the input.

[Yerameyahu]

Well, gauss weapons are in the game, and feasible. I dunno if there'd be a reason to make a 'gauss assault rifle', but it's something that could exist in an R&D lab. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Summerstorm]

Hm... one could disperse lasers with some kind of "fog machine". Dispersing some nano-manufactured lighter than air foam, partially working like prisms. So if a laser gets shot into it, it just lights up and disperses the energy around.

I also read once about a real-world technology (They would made it for public speeches, integrated in the podium/stage) which would use a radar to find projectiles and try to intercept it with ceramic disks it shoots. Don't know what the stage of it is... but in SR 2071 it might work.

Projecting some kind of "Energy bubble" around you all the time is just bullcrap. It makes for good sci-fi (CAPTAIN, CAPTAIN... Deflector shields down to 20%), but just can't work, and even IF, is energy intensive as hell (Why are you protecting EVERYTHING all the time?)

[Pollux710]

I wasn't thinking something like a personal shield from star trek or star wars, more like a time or force limited deflection field similar to Mass Effect and HALO. But, its just an idea.

[Mongoose]

Vibro-blades. Monowhips. Nanites. Powerd exo-suits (military armor).

Sci-fi enough for yah?

[crash2029]

Star Trek phasers are actually PBW's. The fire a particle called a "nadion" that has a vairable decay rate. Depending on the how energetic the nadion is, it's decay causes different effects as it interacts with matter. If a nadion packet is fired near the end of its half-life it tends to create kinetic and quasi-electrical effects to the solid matter it contacts. This has the effect of stunning organic beings by disrupting their nervous systems and knocking them down. When the nadion packet is fired nearer to the beginning of its half-life cycle it tends to impart more heat and force. This is deadly. On highest levels the nadion interaction with matter can cause short-term nuclear bonding force nullification. As for what this has to do with SR, I don't know.

On the invisibility thing, what about quicksilver? Maybe there is a gland in the brain of bandersnatchii that secretes a chemical that when it expelled through the pores, creates their adaptive camouflage.

And finally a ray gun I came up with as a kid. It's an electric stunner. It uses a laser to ionise atmosphere between the weapon and the target. This creates a channel that a static electricity discharge can flow through, like lightning arcing toward the target. The amperage of the static discharge would be rather low as the weapon is intended to be nonlethal. The range also wouldn't be that great because as the distance gets larger the laser has to be more powerful in order to create a properly ionised pathway. If the laser is powerful enough to do that at significant range then the laser is powerful enough to cause damage by itself, which would defeat the purpose.

Mako Stun Pistol
DV: 7S(e) | AP: -1/2 | Ammo: uses battery pack | Availability: yeah, right | Range: as shotgun | Cost: you wish (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

Heh. Someone else came up with that (a few times):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolaser
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/26/io...on_still_going/

The technology in question is a fairly old idea: that of using a laser beam to create a plasma "tunnel" or "channel" through the atmosphere which would be more conductive than ordinary air. This would allow a powerful electric spark discharge - an artificial lightning bolt - to be directed onto a target with some precision.

[Mesh]

Beware tech inflation.

Mesh

[ProfGast]

Another thing to bear in mind is why would you need X technowizard weapon/item? In many ways technology is driven first by necessity, then by innovation. Plasma guns of any grade is a neat idea, but there's no real call for them. We have things that are equally destructive, but are easier and cheaper to make, and not nearly as theoretically temperamental. In current society, railguns and coilguns are a fairly easily constructed and the theory is very sound, but we don't USE them in the military for similar reasons. Their effectiveness-to-payoff is not yet sufficient to adopt them.

I'd think that SR has very experimental versions of a lot of those, but the actual weapon stats wouldn't vary much, just the flavor. Especially in a game universe, there's no need to needlessly complicate things.

[AppliedCheese]

I know the first half of the "bullet radar" is on its way true. You can mount a reasonable cheap (comparatively) Boomerang System on a vehicle (usually an MRAP or HMMWV today) and it will loudly announce to you the relative
clock direction from where someone is shooting. Don't know about look down-shoot down side of it though.

I assume a millimeter radar in SR, properly tuned, can provide reasonably accurate judgment on the point of origin for a shot. Snipers beware! Though the sneaky types can let the tech out tech itself when simple remote systems cause the guys with high tech radar to start looking in the wrong direction.

[KarmaInferno]

Hmm... if you know the likely sounds a rifle will make when fired, shouldn't you be able to at least muffle it with an inverted sound wave?



-k

[KarmaInferno]

Hmm... if you know the likely sounds a rifle will make when fired, shouldn't you be able to at least muffle it with an inverted sound wave?

Or, heck, if you control the area where the target is entering, use active sound cancellation right at that spot. They might get wind something is up when everything starts going quiet, but it means they may not be able to tell where a shot is coming from even with sound-tracking sensors.



-k

[Yerameyahu]

Maybe? It's a complicated question, and would possibly require mics and speakers all over the place (prohibitive). Certainly harder than using magic, in the setting. Ditto for the 'active ballistic defense': magic is so much easier than hitting bullets with bullets from all angles and times.

[crash2029]

Heh. Someone else came up with that (a few times):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolaser
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/26/io...on_still_going/

Yeah. When I grew up I found out that most of the ideas I has as a kid were already thought of and were generally theorised to work along the same principles. C'est la vie.

[X-Kalibur]

I'm still waiting for my AT Field.