 This Old Drone, Because "This Old Safehouse" never got the ratings needed... |
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 Nov 3 2010, 02:52 AM
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#51
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Advocatus Diaboli  Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282  |
Um. My PDF reader skips back and forth. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I think most do.
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Nov 3 2010, 03:45 AM
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#52
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Nov 2 2010, 09:52 PM)  Um. My PDF reader skips back and forth. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I think most do. Right, but not as effectively—a common issue I'll have is that I'll be reading one page, I'll want to reference another page but not know the exact page and then go to the general vicinity and skim to find; depending on quality of implementation, at this point the "Back" button takes me back either to the previous page skimmed or the beginning of the skimming process, because it can't read my mind and find out what the important bits are. ~J |
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Nov 3 2010, 03:50 AM
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#53
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Advocatus Diaboli Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 |
Ahh, I see what you're talking about. I just mark exact pages. I thought you meant like, holding fingers at multiple places. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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Nov 3 2010, 07:27 AM
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#54
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Immortal Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,358 Joined: 2-December 07 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Member No.: 14,465 |
That's why I have a workhorse of a laser printer and print out my PDFs, then put them in sheet condoms.
It also has the advantage of making the books cola resistant. But my group generally has decided that I'm very much insane in a variety of ways, and that's another of them. |
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Nov 3 2010, 03:07 PM
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#55
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,556 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle Member No.: 98 |
QUOTE (Kagetenshi @ Nov 2 2010, 07:45 PM) Right, but not as effectively—a common issue I'll have is that I'll be reading one page, I'll want to reference another page but not know the exact page and then go to the general vicinity and skim to find; depending on quality of implementation, at this point the "Back" button takes me back either to the previous page skimmed or the beginning of the skimming process, because it can't read my mind and find out what the important bits are. Alt-L is the shortcut for "Previous View" in Adobe Reader (View/Go to/Previous View menu), which works like Back in Internet Explorer (rather than "the page before this one"). Doesn't do you much good if you went skimming, admittedly. You probably know that one, but I just figured it out myself a couple of days ago, so hey (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) |
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Nov 3 2010, 05:49 PM
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#56
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 268 Joined: 30-March 03 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 4,355 |
QUOTE (JM Hardy @ Nov 2 2010, 06:30 PM) Typos--they're going to be fixed. But our layout guy, who has a day job at a newspaper, has to survive election day first. Jason H. As long as we are looking at fixes... Pg10: M1216 Mule is missing drone size after its name Pg10: MQ-8 Fire Scout is missing drone size after its name Pg10: MQ-8 Fire Scout should probably have "Improved Takeoff and Landing 2" as a Std Upgrade This next one is not a typo/fix (nor even that important), just a request from me if changes are already being made: The Drone "cards" at the end are great. Could the "Notes" section of each include the drone size and the Std Upgrades? |
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Nov 3 2010, 05:56 PM
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#57
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 268 Joined: 30-March 03 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 4,355 |
Obsolescent (pg10, TOD) reduces the device rating by 1. The device rating (p222, SR4a) is just a handy shortcut for GMs to track all of a devices attributes as one number for simplicity. If the device rating is reduced by 1, my understanding is the pilot and sensors are reduced by 1 (which would explain the cheap price on obsolescent devices).
It isn't clear to me in the PDF. Am I reading this correctly? |
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Nov 3 2010, 07:12 PM
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#58
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Hoppelhäschen 5000 Group: Members Posts: 5,807 Joined: 3-January 04 Member No.: 5,951 |
Just Pilot. Sensor is derived differently.
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Nov 3 2010, 07:15 PM
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#59
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Advocatus Diaboli Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 |
Pilot isn't really based on Device Rating, either. It's Response, System, Firewall, and Signal. Pilot is technically System, but a glance at the rules clearly shows no correlation to Device Rating (as suggested by Sample Devices).
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Nov 3 2010, 08:18 PM
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#60
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 222 Joined: 12-July 10 Member No.: 18,814 |
QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Nov 3 2010, 03:15 PM) Pilot is technically System, Pilot is a program, its just a vehicle specific version of an agent or IC, a program thats runs more programs. |
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Nov 3 2010, 08:46 PM
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#61
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
Ugh, of all the things the books are unclear about...
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Nov 3 2010, 11:04 PM
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#62
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Awakened Asset Group: Members Posts: 4,464 Joined: 9-April 05 From: AGS, North German League Member No.: 7,309 |
QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Nov 3 2010, 09:46 PM) Ugh, of all the things the books are unclear about... Pilot Programs, pg. 245 of The Precious. Pilot is used in place of System. Due to that rule, nearly all published Pilot ratings do not conform with the Sample Device Rating Table. |
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Nov 4 2010, 12:05 AM
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#63
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Old Man Jones Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,415 Joined: 26-February 02 From: New York Member No.: 1,699 |
Most games I've been in assume the Device Rating Table is correct for a vehicle's Device Rating if it's equal to or higher than the listed Pilot Rating, or the Pilot Rating if that is higher.
Because System (Pilot) can be equal to or lower than the Device Rating, but not higher. -k |
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Nov 4 2010, 12:55 AM
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#64
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
QUOTE (Ryu @ Nov 4 2010, 12:04 AM) Pilot Programs, pg. 245 of The Precious. Pilot is used in place of System. Due to that rule, nearly all published Pilot ratings do not conform with the Sample Device Rating Table. i never looked much on the sample device table, as it seems to have been a "cover anything we forgot to specify" kind of table. A kind of "oh look, they forgot to stat xyz, so that cant exist in SR" cover. My basic take on such tables are that specific device stats override the table data, but it do not invalidate the basic utility of the table as a guideline when in a hurry. This because stats in RPG books are rarely set via rigid rules. More often then not, design rules are written after, perhaps long after, the stats have been hammered onto paper after being created on a "looks good" basis. And yes, i fully know that pilot replace system. I just wonder how it is possible for so many people to read it as either a separate program or a separate piece of hardware from system. Still, there is the old help desk horror stories to remind me that what i assume is easy to grasp about computers can be wildly misunderstood... |
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Nov 4 2010, 01:06 AM
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#65
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Advocatus Diaboli Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 |
*shrug* Pilot is System, and Device Rating is (Response, Signal, Firewall, System). For vehicles, I just have the listed Pilot override the *implied* Device Rating, and logical inconsistencies be damned. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Honestly, it's their fault for making Pilot *be* System in the first place. Bleh.
My point is that Pilot certainly does not derive *from* device rating (which you have to broadly assume from the Sample Devices table in the first place). If it did, it would contradict the hell out of the vehicle listings. For completeness, I'll re-agree Rotbart's second part: Sensor is *also* independent of Device Rating. Indeed, hobgoblin: a general, 'sample' table clearly is overridden by specifics, and the entire concept of Device Rating is definitely a shorthand catch-all. |
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Nov 4 2010, 05:16 AM
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#66
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Old Man Jones Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,415 Joined: 26-February 02 From: New York Member No.: 1,699 |
Well, it's certainly possible for a vehicle to have Device Rating 3 but Pilot 2.
I have the Pilot rating override the general System Rating, but not the rest of the Matrix Attributes. -k |
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Nov 4 2010, 06:00 AM
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#67
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Advocatus Diaboli Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 |
Right. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) There are cases when that is a problem, though; really, it'd all be simpler if Pilot were a (perhaps uncrashable) 'program' separate from System, though. Anyway, it's just *not* derived from Device Rating (itself just a general guess).
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Feb 28 2011, 02:04 AM
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#68
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Street Doc Group: Admin Posts: 3,508 Joined: 2-March 04 From: Neverwhere Member No.: 6,114 |
Anybody happen to know if they've corrected the acceleration typos yet?
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Feb 28 2011, 02:09 AM
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#69
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 268 Joined: 30-March 03 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 4,355 |
QUOTE (Method @ Feb 27 2011, 09:04 PM) Anybody happen to know if they've corrected the acceleration typos yet? Yes, I think it was in November of last year. If you buy the PDF, they send you an email to download the new copy for free as soon as its published. |
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Feb 28 2011, 02:48 AM
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#70
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Street Doc Group: Admin Posts: 3,508 Joined: 2-March 04 From: Neverwhere Member No.: 6,114 |
Thanks!
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Feb 28 2011, 03:08 AM
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#71
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Immortal Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,358 Joined: 2-December 07 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Member No.: 14,465 |
I never got my e-mail for correction.
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Feb 28 2011, 03:09 AM
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#72
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Prime Runner Ascendant Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 |
And Mine was correct when I bought it... *shrug*
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Feb 28 2011, 05:10 AM
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#73
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 268 Joined: 30-March 03 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 4,355 |
QUOTE (CanRay @ Feb 27 2011, 10:08 PM) I never got my e-mail for correction. I don't know if it makes a difference, but I purchased it from Battleshop and they have notified me of free updates on two different PDF books so far. |
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Feb 28 2011, 05:21 AM
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#74
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Immortal Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,358 Joined: 2-December 07 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Member No.: 14,465 |
Ah, I got mine from RPGNow. They might not be doing the free updates. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)
Sorry, Drive-Thru RPG. |
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Feb 28 2011, 03:52 PM
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#75
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 268 Joined: 30-March 03 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 4,355 |
QUOTE (CanRay @ Feb 28 2011, 12:21 AM) Ah, I got mine from RPGNow. They might not be doing the free updates. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif) Sorry, Drive-Thru RPG. That's not cool. |
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