Spells: Combat sense vs. Increased Attribute (Reaction) Options

[mmmkay]

Combat sense has a DV of F/2+2. Each hit adds 1 die to reaction for surprise and 1 die for defending against ranged and melee attacks.

Increased attribute (reaction) has a DV of F/2-2. Each hit adds 1 die to reaction. The force must not be less than the augmented reaction.

So IA® will do everything CS does but will add dice to initiative and have other secondary effects for -4 drain. The caveat is that if you are applying this spell to your street samurai you'll probably have to overcast it.

What's the deal? Is that the only trade off? Why is IA® so much better than CS?

[Yerameyahu]

It happens. There are several spells like this, where some things are plain better. *shrug*

[Mäx]

Well CS doesn't actually augment the attribute, so it can be used even if you're at the augmented max of your Reaction.
I'd say thats a pretty big pluss for CS and means that you preferable want both of those spell, unless you allready have maxed your reaction.

Also it's much easier to get a sustaining focus for CS as it doesn't have to be cast at such a high force.

[mmmkay]

It happens. There are several spells like this, where some things are plain better. *shrug*

Do you have examples? Cause I just realized the CS vs. IA® difference and it was shocking. I mean granted there are obviously like 1 or 2 combat spells you would ever use, but do you observe this with anything other than combat spells?

Well CS doesn't actually augment the attribute, so it can be used even if you're at the augmented max of your Reaction.
I'd say thats a pretty big pluss for CS and means that you preferable want both of those spell, unless you allready have maxed your reaction.

Also it's much easier to get a sustaining focus for CS as it doesn't have to be cast at such a high force.

Well the spell doesn't explicitly state that it can only augment up to your augmented maximum, so does that imply that it can be used to exceed your augmented maximum? Or because it doesn't explicitly state anything about augmented maximums you assume that it is subject to augmented maximums?

Well I can't argue with the sustaining focus statement.

[Mäx]

Well the spell doesn't explicitly state that it can only augment up to your augmented maximum, so does that imply that it can be used to exceed your augmented maximum? Or because it doesn't explicitly state anything about augmented maximums you assume that it is subject to augmented maximums?

Everything is subject to augmented maximums, unless the rules for that particular think explicitly say otherwise.
Augmented maximums is a general rule after all.

[Yerameyahu]

Ask Neraph, I think, for the full list. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Glyph]

Combat sense, as a dice pool modifier, can potentially go a lot higher than increase Reaction, and it is easier to cast on your cybered-up teammates. On the other hand, for a mage with a Reaction of 3, increase Reaction will probably be the best personal combat-enhancement spell of the two.

[mmmkay]

Ask Neraph, I think, for the full list. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Is that a reference to an older thread, because if so I can try searching for it if you give me more hints, or are you neighbors or friends or something?

[mmmkay]

Combat sense, as a dice pool modifier, can potentially go a lot higher than increase Reaction, and it is easier to cast on your cybered-up teammates. On the other hand, for a mage with a Reaction of 3, increase Reaction will probably be the best personal combat-enhancement spell of the two.

Are you saying that because 1) IA® is a lower drain spell and he wouldn't want wound penalties, 2) IA® increases his initiative, and 3) he has pretty much no chance of exceeding his augmented maximum so there are no downsides?

As an aside when Running Wild came out I had dreams of a catlady shadowrunner who would get her mischief of blackberry cats to cast combat sense on her so that she'd have ridiculous bullet dodging skills.

Edit: it's the first time I've noticed that putting parentheses around R makes the ® symbol.

[Glyph]

I was only thinking about #3, although #1 and #2 are also good reasons.