Legwork Examples, Any Good Movie Examples? Options

[Drraagh]

I've been reading some of the different posts on the boards about what movies people think are Shadowrun, and also about how people think legwork should be. For some, legwork is the master face or the master hacker doing their thing with the terminal or with the contact, gathering the intel and then having the run laid out for them. For example, Johnny Mnemonic's information search and thus our exposure to cyberspace in that movie. Basically, its much like the precis Case had the cyberdeck do in Neuromancer, putting the GM in a place where they wave a magic wand and let the technology tell the PCs what they need to know. Same with a face going to a contact, 'So, what do you know about this'... *Few minutes later* 'Hey guys, guess what I found out.'

Other people believe the J should basically come to the PCs and say 'Here's everything you need, do the job'. Basically, the two of you have a vested interest in the job being completed, the J and the people hiring them usually have deeper pockets and better resources to do the legwork before it gets to you. That take all depends on the sort of game you're playing, I suppose, but for me, part of my fun is doing the legwork, both as a GM and as a PC. Since as a GM, it can be like crafting a logic puzzle, trying to have the players figure out how to find out the details they want and are they true, is it a lie, etc.

But the core of this post, I was trying to find some good examples of movies or TV shows that show legwork being done, especially things that a PC can do, and perhaps some options that could allow all players to be involved somewhat. Some examples that come to mind: Ronin, finding out about the case is a perfect example I think. Sneakers, that is another good example of legwork, and in the end, the whole movie could pretty much be considered legwork. I am just trying to shy away from the 'La Femme Nikita' style of legwork where Birkoff comes over and explains what they know and now the team is to assemble on site, if possible. Though, now that I mention LFN, I'm thinking of going back through the episodes for any traces of 'information retrieval' ops.

[Ascalaphus]

Blade Runner. If you haven't seen it yet, you should. If you have seen it, you should see it again anyway. The whole movie is so totally Shadowrun. It also has a lot of legwork in it, since the main person is chasing down other people who are trying to infiltrate a corporate HQ, so...

Body of Lies - both on the Matrix side and the human informer side.

Ghost in the Shell - some episodes more than others. But both seasons contain lots of high-tech investigation. Also don't miss the networking aspect done by their boss.

A good source of legwork is probably detective series though; action movies tend to gloss over it while police movies lap it up.

[KamikazePilot]

I've been reading some of the different posts on the boards about what movies people think are Shadowrun, and also about how people think legwork should be. For some, legwork is the master face or the master hacker doing their thing with the terminal or with the contact, gathering the intel and then having the run laid out for them. For example, Johnny Mnemonic's information search and thus our exposure to cyberspace in that movie. Basically, its much like the precis Case had the cyberdeck do in Neuromancer, putting the GM in a place where they wave a magic wand and let the technology tell the PCs what they need to know. Same with a face going to a contact, 'So, what do you know about this'... *Few minutes later* 'Hey guys, guess what I found out.'

Other people believe the J should basically come to the PCs and say 'Here's everything you need, do the job'. Basically, the two of you have a vested interest in the job being completed, the J and the people hiring them usually have deeper pockets and better resources to do the legwork before it gets to you. That take all depends on the sort of game you're playing, I suppose, but for me, part of my fun is doing the legwork, both as a GM and as a PC. Since as a GM, it can be like crafting a logic puzzle, trying to have the players figure out how to find out the details they want and are they true, is it a lie, etc.

But the core of this post, I was trying to find some good examples of movies or TV shows that show legwork being done, especially things that a PC can do, and perhaps some options that could allow all players to be involved somewhat. Some examples that come to mind: Ronin, finding out about the case is a perfect example I think. Sneakers, that is another good example of legwork, and in the end, the whole movie could pretty much be considered legwork. I am just trying to shy away from the 'La Femme Nikita' style of legwork where Birkoff comes over and explains what they know and now the team is to assemble on site, if possible. Though, now that I mention LFN, I'm thinking of going back through the episodes for any traces of 'information retrieval' ops.

BURN NOTICE. ALL 4 seasons. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) The amount of prepwork Mike and crew undergo can put most runner groups to shame.

CSI/Law and Order Series: Police doing legwork against runners (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Oceans 11,12,13: they dont just bust in and shoot at the safe until they make a 1 square meter hole open in the barrier (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

im sure there are tons others. anytime people are NOT busting in guns blazing and make a conscious effort to preplan and HAVE a contingency plan to me = Legwork (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Inncubi]

"Snatch", directed by Guy Ritchie. Honestly, it inspired me to use intimidation to get intel form contacts and other good thoughts that change the mood for legwork.

"The Usual Suspects", one of the nicest botched legwork rolls ever.

"Ronin", the stereotypical group of pro runners. Hell, I always want my groups to be like them, instead I get bad rehashed Batou wanna be's... (Off topic rant, back on track now)

[Kagetenshi]

Ghost in the Shell - some episodes more than others. But both seasons contain lots of high-tech investigation. Also don't miss the networking aspect done by their boss.

Ghost in the Shell doesn't have episodes. Maybe you meant the Stand Alone Complex?

Also, another vote for Ronin. It's much less varied than typical Shadowrun legwork, but also much more extensive than typical movie legwork.

~J

[TheFr0g]

Also, do some reading. The Parker novels by Richard Stark (And their comical companion novels the Dortmunder series) are all about the legwork. Also any old Dashiell Hammett story gives good ideas.

[Seth]

BURN NOTICE. ALL 4 seasons. The amount of prepwork Mike and crew undergo can put most runner groups to shame.

I agree totally. I was introduced to them from this forum and am enjoying them a lot. Shadowrun without the magic

[jaellot]

It's going to sound stupid at first, but there is one scene in The Other Guys. Closer to the end, Will Ferrell's character starts really looking into the case, putting bits and pieces together, goes out and talks to people, that sort of thing.

Also, the Illusionist, with Edward Norton. It's essentially an extraction/frame job. Everything that is done is a tiny step towards the end, where they live happily ever after, but still. Also, it lacks even a modern setting, but still, the attention to detail.

The Italian Job. First off- awesome heist. Second- lots of legwork, for both jobs.

[Udoshi]

BURN NOTICE. ALL 4 seasons. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) The amount of prepwork Mike and crew undergo can put most runner groups to shame.

CSI/Law and Order Series: Police doing legwork against runners (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I'm going to second Burn Notice. Not only is it a generally great show, but its basically all about the legwork.

NCIS stands out in my mind as a great example of going out, finding things, putting them together, and occasionally having the things you find be really unexpected. Plus, its funny.

The thing I like about those two shows is that they don't neglect the social element of information gathering. Occasionally, you have to use a contact for something, or get clues from how someone behaves.


Leverage also deserves a good mention, though its more about a great big con of the episode than legwork in specific.

[Critias]

There's a good amount of legwork going on in Cowboy Bebop, too (both the movie and the series).

[J. Packer]

You have to be a little careful. There is a fine line between setup, legwork/investigation, and the run itself.

I, too, would cite the Ocean's movies, but the legwork in this case is all part of the same larger con.

Any large ensemble cast or buddy film is likely to be useful. "Gone in Sixty Seconds" for example is a heist movie, but also has more legwork because there are many people involved.

[Troll]

I only skimmed this thread to try and not repost too many of what other users have already.


Movies.
Snatch, Rock&Rolla, Lock Stock&Two Smoking Barrels, heck pretty much any Guy Richie movie will have at least a reasonable amount of legwork to crime ratio. They're also all worth watching at least one

The Gone in Sixty Seconds remake is definitely worth mentioning twice in terms of legwork,(also day jobs, intriguing personalities doing stereotypical crime jobs, and how not to act as portrayed by Chris Eccleson) it's been an inspiration for me for more than one "caper" style gaming session.

All of the remake Oceans movies do a reasonable show of legwork, however I can't recommend that anyone watch the second one. When they choose to cut out legwork and explanation in favor of a capoeira montage I start fuming.

An oldie but a goodie is Sneakers with Robert Redford and River Phoenix. It actually deals with corporate installation raiding, and to some degree network security. (admittedly dated.

Speaking of network security and legwork, the classically (some say classically bad) Hackers is very much a legwork kind of movie.

People sometimes think me odd when i say this, but I have (even before it was made into a movie) always pointed to the quintessential "legwork" character in 80's-current geek media. and that's Rorschact from Watchmen. In addition to being the teams "black bag" man he's very much the "info guy" for the whole movie.

State of Play is pretty journalistic in nature, not criminal, but very much an exercise in legwork.

Of course, era innapropriateness aside, Sherlock Holmes has been the king of legwork for years and years, speaking of Guy Richie again.

For TV your options get broad. I've never seen Burn Notice but I'm told it is excellent and very much a legwork-ey, show.

There was a small run of Justice League Unlimited that involved The Question, it was almost entirely him doing his own crazy version of legwork. (Of course, Rorschach is for all intents and purposes a Question analog, so I may be flogging a dead comic horse here.)

Dexter is a constant show of legwork and preparedness.

And lastly, a show that for as cheesy as it can be at times, I'm amazed more Shadowrun fans don't watch. Leverage, which does a better job of using criminals to promote a better world by screwing with major corps/bad guys than I think SR's Karma system ever has actually portrayed. And is a constant exercise is gear/skill/legwork/repeat.

That's all I have for now, I'll come back if anything else pops up.

[Summerstorm]

Yeah most "Noir" or detective stories ARE pretty much 80% legwork: Gathering Info... getting to know the characters, visiting old sources. The rest is love-sidestory and the grand finale when all comes together.

In that regard: i really liked

"Brick" - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0393109/

It is a detective story in "film-Noir" style set in a modern day high school. And also pretty dark. We are following the "detective" unravaling the disappearing/murder/suicide of his girlfriend/friend. The whole - what is the right question for whom, who has part of this, whom can i trust - is great in this.

[Troll]

"Brick" - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0393109/

This. It's also some of the best work more than a few of the actors put forward.


Agreed also though, any noir oriented story is going to be 90% legwork. Even Woody Allen's Curse of the Jade Scorpion is good in that regard.


Oh, also, silly, but oh so dystopian Hudson Hawk does a fair bit of legwork.

On the cop side of things L.A. Confidential is another classic in that regard. It has tons of info gathering and socializing.

To a lesser degree (I'm probably only mentioning this so I can snicker a little and remember the "Rocker" template from earlier editions) Get Shorty and it's sequel Be Cool are pretty legwork oriented.

I suppose I'd be a jerk to Tarantino if I didn't at least mention Resevoir Dogs, it doesn't show you a ton of legwork, but it does show you team assembly, introduction, and planning. As well as what the OP mentioned on the other side of legwork, leaving the Johnson(in this case Nice Guy Eddie) to do most of it himself. (and the disastrous repercussions that can have when the Johnson has assembled the wrong team.)

For a slightly darker and I would almost say "wackier" version of legwork, you could check out Anton's typical day in Night Watch or Day Watch.

Oh, I almost completely forgot Casino, which doesn't go into so much detail, but does go into a lengthy diatribe about who all Nicky Santuro had on his payroll as far as information sources.

[Catsnightmare]

Troll mentioned the series Leverage above, and I'd also recommend the original 1969 The Italian Job for legwork/prep that goes into a job.

[TheWanderingJewe...]

While a bit silly....how about the X-Files as an example of leg work?

[WhiskeyJohnny]

Another vote for Burn Notice, Ronin, Snatch, and Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels. I also like The Sting - the set up for "the Wire" is fantastic. Also, the television shows Hustle and Sherlock can provide some excellent examples.

[CanRay]

How about that great Blaxploitation/Orxploitation movie, "Shaft"? A fine bit of legwork is shown, complete with bribes! (I've said to my players that most Orxploitation movies are just Blaxploitation scripts reshot with Trogs. The "Shaft" of the 2060s is a Troll, for example. Oh, and you better be a Ork or Troll when you say "Trog", too, or you'll get a beatin'!). The new one shows a bit of legwork as well, including some options on how to "Pay" people for information. (It's not always about (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) ).