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> Car Jacking, With Hacking
klinktastic
post Jan 9 2011, 04:18 AM
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I was wondering what the preferred car jacking approach is? I was thinking that the smartest thing would be to identify the car you want to jack, follow it, while sniffering signals between the car and owner's commlink. Once you've obtained the commcodes, you probe the target and edit your commcodes in inplace of the owners. Then you remote control the car to a chop shop and tag erase, clear out any linkages to the former owner, and paint it a new color. Thoughts? Is there a better way?
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CanRay
post Jan 9 2011, 04:20 AM
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Depends on what you want to do with the car.

Personally, I'd hack it, drive it around in Spoofed mode, filling the trunk up with something nice and illegal, putting it back, then dropping a dime on the owner would be one hell of a fun way of getting someone in deep trouble.

But if you're talking about owning/selling it... Yeah, that sounds about right.
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Yerameyahu
post Jan 9 2011, 04:20 AM
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AFAIK, you can just scan for nodes, hack, done. *shrug*
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KarmaInferno
post Jan 9 2011, 04:28 AM
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Wasn't there shadowtalk in the books about some hacker gangs making a sport out of hijacking people's cars while they are in motion and racing them, with the terrified car owners as unwilling passengers?





-k
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klinktastic
post Jan 9 2011, 04:28 AM
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So when a car is "turned off" its actually still on, but running as a hidden node? I guess, would there be a benefit to knowing the admin access codes and passwords? Assuming that info is encrypted, a small time decrypting it could make your life easier. Shit, the firewall might not even get an analyze test. Would it be easier to sniffer and spoof, get it into a jamming zone, then hack it? Then it couldn't send a distress signal if it detects the hacker?
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Yerameyahu
post Jan 9 2011, 04:34 AM
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Yup. Hackers run the world. The node would have to be on, so that your keyless entry works. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (I realize, not literally.)

It's true that having the valid credentials/codes/etc. would be even easier, but most cars would be easy to take in seconds.
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klinktastic
post Jan 9 2011, 04:36 AM
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I guess I should add, I'm in a street level game, 320 BPs and we just finished our first run. Now that we're gonna be running full time, I figured since I'm the rigger, wheelman, and hacker....as well as go ganger, I should probably provide group transportation, as well as transport for my dalmation and nissan roto-drone. Just wondering what the best way to about obtaining one in the most realistic manner possible.

I'm a program 3, cracking group 1, going to specialize in exploit and sniffer, with PuSHeD and Math CPU and can go Hot Sim for additional dice. Obviously not worlds best hacker, so I need something that minimizes my risks.
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CanRay
post Jan 9 2011, 05:51 AM
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If your car is attached to GridGuide, then it doesn't even matter if it's transmitting or receiving or anything, you can hack it through that system.

A bit harder than getting through a car's crappy security, but GG is swiss cheese according to ShadowTalk.
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hermit
post Jan 9 2011, 10:31 AM
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Just hard encrypt the car for 24 hours, and all on-the-fly hacking is rendered futile. Oh, removing your car's nonsensical wireless and driving a combustion vehicle also helps.
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Ascalaphus
post Jan 9 2011, 11:31 AM
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Well, there are advantages to having a wireless piloted car. You can snap your fingers to have that care come pick you up; that's hugely convenient. And all you need to do is plug the huge security holes.
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hermit
post Jan 9 2011, 11:36 AM
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QUOTE
Well, there are advantages to having a wireless piloted car. You can snap your fingers to have that care come pick you up; that's hugely convenient. And all you need to do is plug the huge security holes.

Patch SR4's security holes? That's impossible by RAW. And yeah, you can have your car drive to you, but you don't need to wirelessly conect all the car parts that way (which is nonsensical anyway since the car's interior isn't very well suited for radio transmissions and jamming will make your car die).

Just remove that crap and hardwire your car to a decent all-6 hard encrypted, high-security commlink for all your wireless communications needs.
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Rotbart van Dain...
post Jan 9 2011, 12:12 PM
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QUOTE (klinktastic @ Jan 9 2011, 05:18 AM) *
Thoughts?

Rating 2 Jammer to supress the RFIDs but not the car (or anyone else) until you are done.
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Rotbart van Dain...
post Jan 9 2011, 12:15 PM
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QUOTE (hermit @ Jan 9 2011, 11:31 AM) *
[…] driving a combustion vehicle also helps.

Not really, those are completely electronically controlled even today.

And of course, since Recharge, there is no point anymore, at all. There are no fuel stations in the outdoors, just conjurers on duty.
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Tymeaus Jalynsfe...
post Jan 9 2011, 03:31 PM
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QUOTE (hermit @ Jan 9 2011, 04:36 AM) *
Patch SR4's security holes? That's impossible by RAW. And yeah, you can have your car drive to you, but you don't need to wirelessly conect all the car parts that way (which is nonsensical anyway since the car's interior isn't very well suited for radio transmissions and jamming will make your car die).

Just remove that crap and hardwire your car to a decent all-6 hard encrypted, high-security commlink for all your wireless communications needs.


Not all that hard to patch the holes, really... Definitely not "Impossible by RAW" as you make it out to be... The only drawback is that it could more than double (or even triple) the price of the car to patch the holes effectively, depending upon what process you used. Simply applying Strong Encryption will usually do the trick (Most thieves will not spend hours trying to break into a vehicle, tehy will go for the easy marks instead). It all really depends upon how difficult a task you want the intrusion to be.

Most people do not go to the trouble to harden their vehicles, because of the price involved. That is a much bigger difference than it being impossible to accomplish.
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hermit
post Jan 9 2011, 05:02 PM
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QUOTE
Not really, those are completely electronically controlled even today.

But they do not depend on GridGuide to power themselves and hence can be cut off and run as a closed system. Barring Neomancers with the hack anything on touch skill, it's impossible to hack then.

QUOTE
And of course, since Recharge, there is no point anymore, at all. There are no fuel stations in the outdoors, just conjurers on duty.

Yeah, fair enough.
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Rotbart van Dain...
post Jan 9 2011, 05:13 PM
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QUOTE (hermit @ Jan 9 2011, 06:02 PM) *
But they do not depend on GridGuide to power themselves […]

They all rely on GridGuide for to realtime traffic data and routing, by WiFi access.
GridLink, is an optional modification that can be added to any vehicle, electric, fuel-cell or combustion – since the latter are hybrids. Aside from drawing power, it allows also for communication, similar to SkinLink.

By default, electric vehicles don't feature it – and since they have the exact same performance, range and handling time of their combustion counterpart in SR, there is no point not getting one. In fact, with a roll-up solar tarp in the trunk (even standard car paint has basic photovoltaic properties in SR4), you are better off even in the countryside when the Recharge mage has his day off. Of course, War! never would bother to stat or even feature such a useless item like that – magic is better anyway.
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hermit
post Jan 9 2011, 05:23 PM
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QUOTE
They all rely on GridGuide for to realtime traffic data and routing, by WiFi access.

which can be done via a commlink that's not connected to the operational parts of the car, can it? It's not like a poilot system suddenly dis unable to function independently anymore. But you're right, it's probably illegal.

QUOTE
Of course, War! never would bother to stat or even feature such a useless item like that – magic is better anyway.

It's so easy to write. No thinking required why it works as it does. And you need no research.
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klinktastic
post Jan 9 2011, 08:01 PM
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Ok, so if one of you was GM'ing a game, the hacker wanted to steal a van for future use in the campaign. What kind of roles would you required to hack it?
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Ascalaphus
post Jan 9 2011, 08:14 PM
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The hacking isn't so hard - civilian cars would have a device rating of 3.

As far as I know however, there aren't any rules to turn your hacked account into a "legitimate" account, thereby permanently changing the legitimate owner of the car's system. You might want to rip out the old node and put in your own chipset.

And don't forget to kill the old RFIDs, put in your own to prove you're the "owner", and get fake papers/deeds/licenses for the car.
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Squiddy Attack
post Jan 9 2011, 08:16 PM
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QUOTE (klinktastic @ Jan 9 2011, 12:01 PM) *
Ok, so if one of you was GM'ing a game, the hacker wanted to steal a van for future use in the campaign. What kind of roles would you required to hack it?


Exploit, Control Device, and spoofing. Unless you've got the owner's access ID; then you can just spoof commands.
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klinktastic
post Jan 9 2011, 08:23 PM
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QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Jan 9 2011, 02:14 PM) *
The hacking isn't so hard - civilian cars would have a device rating of 3.

As far as I know however, there aren't any rules to turn your hacked account into a "legitimate" account, thereby permanently changing the legitimate owner of the car's system. You might want to rip out the old node and put in your own chipset.

And don't forget to kill the old RFIDs, put in your own to prove you're the "owner", and get fake papers/deeds/licenses for the car.


How much would replacing the node be? Say I have access to a go ganger's chop shop. It won't be free, but I can get it done for me.
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Yerameyahu
post Jan 9 2011, 08:25 PM
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I mean, get the price of a 3/3 commlink + Pilot, Firewall, etc.
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hermit
post Jan 9 2011, 08:28 PM
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Build it from DIY components and you save money.
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klinktastic
post Jan 9 2011, 08:30 PM
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Seems like you could just get into the admin account after you've stolen and decrypted the owner's commcodes and passcodes. Then you could just edit the shit of out of that admin account and replace it with your info. Obviously wipe it down with a TAG eraser, plant your own TAGs on it. Get some licenses for it. Shit, hunt down the VIN, edit the data trail that the car was bought by you, not the original owner. Wouldn't that be easier? Or well at least cheaper.
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Squiddy Attack
post Jan 9 2011, 08:47 PM
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Of course, you can also get into the admin account without stealing the owner's codes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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