How much should Johnsons be willing to pay runners? Options

[Tashiro]

This brings up a point -- in most published adventures, what's the average payment suggested? We can use that as a frame of reference.

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

3k-5k on average, considering it is just a 1-2 day job.
Jobs that take more time usually pay more or the runners have the opportunity to loot whatever they want.

[Doc Byte]

Really? Because from what I saw, you could tally together the different things the Johnson wants as part of the run, and come up with a reasonable figure. Then what I'd usually do is use the reputation of the runners as a modifier to increase how much they'd get. Then there's the negotiation roll by the runners themselves to raise that even further. And the outcome, I considered, was 'per runner', not 'for the whole group to divide'.

Reputation's even more bugged. It stops working beyond the first hundred karma points. SR4's even worse than SR3. My character would have a Street Cred of 48 if I'd use that rule. (I stopped playing SR3 with a Karma Pool of 15 as I used the optional RC rules for keeping it low.)

Keep in mind, Nuyen has increased in buying power from SR3 to SR4, so the old values per-run are quite a bit more lucrative.

And lifestyle costs have gone up. That's the important indicator concerning incomes.

[Tashiro]

Reputation's even more bugged. It stops working beyond the first hundred karma points. SR4's even worse than SR3. My character would have a Street Cred of 48 if I'd use that rule. (I stopped playing SR3 with a Karma Pool of 15 as I used the optional RC rules for keeping it low.)

Hmm, aren't there supposed to be activities which help to reduce reputation? The game master should be willing to use those to keep things in check.

[Doc Byte]

Hmm, aren't there supposed to be activities which help to reduce reputation? The game master should be willing to use those to keep things in check.

Yeah, killing innocent bystanders will reduce Street Creds. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dead.gif)

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

Critical glitches, talking shit to Johnsons, etc...

[CanRay]

Napalming a bus full of Nuns and Orphans. And Orphaned Nuns.

Using a Improvised Weapon of Mass Destruction in the middle of a heavily populated area...

[Game2BHappy]

My runs usually award between 3K and 20K per PC.

Something simple like a simple assassination (takes no skill to kill) will be on the low end.

Something difficult like kidnapping a 3-person science team from their megacorporate lab will be quite a bit more.

Something complex and difficult like the said extraction above combined with an assassination combined with making the newly-dead victim appear to be the kidnapper would be toward the top of the scale.

Really it can be a matter of how often your group plays SR and how fast you would like your players' characters to advance. Its okay if you overpaid them in the beginning as a kick-start to their shadow careers, just have their character's 'find out' that that kind of pay was a fluke and bring it back down to a normal range.

[Wesley Street]

Pay 'em just enough to keep them hungry. Figure out what the runner's lifestyle costs are and pay them just enough to make the rent, depending on how many jobs they do in a month. The only time I go above and beyond the norm is if it's a part of the story and I deliberately want the PCs flush with cash.

This is the kind of stuff that needs to be handled in a Mr. Johnson's Black Book type product because this is the most asked question in this game.

[Doc Byte]

My runs usually award between 3K and 20K per PC.

Something simple like a simple assassination (takes no skill to kill) will be on the low end.

You're telling us that your runners are willing to commit a capital crime for 3ks? My character would never ever risk a death penalty if he could easily earn much more by stealing a car.

Pay 'em just enough to keep them hungry. Figure out what the runner's lifestyle costs are and pay them just enough to make the rent, depending on how many jobs they do in a month.

And after about 10 runs every sam, rigger and hacker player will ask you, if he may play a mage or ki-ad.

[CanRay]

This is the kind of stuff that needs to be handled in a Mr. Johnson's Black Book type product because this is the most asked question in this game.

You mean "Mr. Johnson's Little Black Book"?

I mean, paying and such is fluff for the most part. Fluff doesn't change even when Crunch does.

[James McMurray]

I mean, paying and such is fluff for the most part. Fluff doesn't change even when Crunch does.

I hope I'm misunderstanding that. Are you saying that the money runners get for a job is fluff, and so has little bearing on the mechanics of the game system?

[Game2BHappy]

You're telling us that your runners are willing to commit a capital crime for 3ks? My character would never ever risk a death penalty if he could easily earn much more by stealing a car.

I definitely like to respond to my player's feedback and I respect that you do too. However, is it worth considering that car theft might be too easy and too profitable in your game?

Personally, I love it when my players steal cars for their runs, but they usually end up with some beater that has more RP value than NuYen value.

[Tashiro]

I definitely like to respond to my player's feedback and I respect that you do too. However, is it worth considering that car theft might be too easy and too profitable in your game?

Personally, I love it when my players steal cars for their runs, but they usually end up with some beater that has more RP value than NuYen value.

Actually, I consider the car to be one of the bigger things in the adventure -- simply because one of my characters owns a very nice car, and driving to / from the mission is a big thing for him. He scopes out the city, streets, patrols, and everything like that, to plan the perfect approach and get-away.

[CanRay]

Actually, I consider the car to be one of the bigger things in the adventure -- simply because one of my characters owns a very nice car, and driving to / from the mission is a big thing for him. He scopes out the city, streets, patrols, and everything like that, to plan the perfect approach and get-away.

In addition to being a gun nut, I'm also a classic car nut. Muscle cars in particular. Also, motorcycles.

I freely admit that Jon "Money" Johnson is my Gun Nut run free, and Nas is my Car Nut run free.

[Drace]

Hmm, aren't there supposed to be activities which help to reduce reputation? The game master should be willing to use those to keep things in check.

Well the whole thing in the OP about the runners highballing to the extreme and walking out will easily cause a rep to drop rapidly, as well as cause their notoriety and PA to raise up.

For the concept of pay, like nearly everyone says, it varies on the game and runs. I use to have a chart I made for the last campaign I gmed years ago where I had a rough payout for different types of jobs, and then different factors would effect the price (e.g. If target was corp base would be for non-rated corp. +% for Nat, +higher% for A, +even higher% for AA) mainly who they were agaisnt, opposition, risk, expenses, extra intel/equipment supplied, threat of reprisal and another column or two and the player's negotiations were taken off as a percentage, roughly 1-3 percent per hit . So essentially it was base price + all percents = base payout + Neg% = Final cut.

I found doing it that way kept a set system so that the players knew what certain jobs were worth, in a rough sense, in the shadows (They never saw the chart though) but each job was a different payout.

Also, for the OPoster, maybe have a pre-planned fallout scenario, where the johnson decides that since he already spilled so much he has to go after the runners to silence them, or they insult a johnson for a major crime family and they want revenge etc. Or just talk to the players.

[PoliteMan]

I've said it before in other runs and I'll say it again here: Figuring out what to pay the runners gets a lot easier if you work out motivations with the players other then coin.

QFT

And lifestyle costs have gone up. That's the important indicator concerning incomes.

If you're actually paying lifestyle costs, your hacker hates you.

[Makki]

last time, I wanted to be noncommittal about the payout.
J gave the team some boxes and told them what they can expect, if they bring the boxes to the designated target who will pay them. Then I brought in two more parties making totally different offers (a bigger amount cash, some high availability hot guns). they stuck to the expected certified cred. If somebody had kept the contents (a new drug), he could have made up to 10 times instead, depending on the date of selling. sadly nobody considered gambling. so they just sticked to the safest solution and the lowest amount. And I rewarded them with a new connection.

most fun was the mage who considered keeping his share for personal use (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Game2BHappy]

... and Nas is my Car Nut run free.

I'm surprised he isn't named "NOS". (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[CanRay]

I'm surprised he isn't named "NOS". (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

His name is short for "NASCAR", as he was a driver funded by Stuffer Shack (Car #711). He was in a major wreck and his insurance company cheaped out on his recovery, using replacement parts that are violations of NASCAR rules. His wife, accountant, and lawyer ran off with his money, and left him destitute and kicked out of the hospital barely able to walk.

He worked as a taxi driver for a bit until a Shadowrunning team spotted him and asked if he could still drive. He could, and got the handle "Nas" as a result. He refuses to answer to anything else now unless it's part of a Fake SIN. (Well, OK, his boyfriend calls him a few things he'll answer to, but that's a special case.).

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Yeah, killing innocent bystanders will reduce Street Creds. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dead.gif)

Just spend time burning Street Cred to reduce that Notoriety... or when the Cred gets cumbersome, just change your identity (Reduces your Cred to 0) and rebegin with a new Identity and New Street Cred.

Easiest ways I know...

Of course, there is always something to be said for having a reputation that is unmatched, just look at Fastjack.

[CanRay]

Yeah, exactly, FastJack. Just how many gigs is he getting now?

Of course, it's not like he really needs to work any longer, does it? 'Course, he will anyways, just to keep from being bored (And having to deal with his Sister and the rest of his family.).

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Yeah, exactly, FastJack. Just how many gigs is he getting now?

Of course, it's not like he really needs to work any longer, does it? 'Course, he will anyways, just to keep from being bored (And having to deal with his Sister and the rest of his family.).

Yeah, Well, You know how Family can be... what are you going to do? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

[CanRay]

Take your sister's kids to The House of Mouse, apparently. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Take your sister's kids to The House of Mouse, apparently. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Heheh... Awesome...