downtime questions/issues Options

[Wraith235]

so another thread kinda turned into what should have been a new thread and so I am doing it

downtime on the calender ... now while I understand the concept ... its the specific practice that I am having some issues with

it boils down to .. a question of

does downtime even really matter for anything other than bookwork and record keeping
basically by the rules of Missions and the calander a character ,as long as his lifestyle is covered, could take a relativly unlimited amount of downtime and code all of his programs up to 6 with max Program options,

there are other examples of how this can be done this is just the one in my head ATM

again I can understand if "Time is irrelevant" or if there is supposed to be some "Self imposed level of logic"

if the answer is the latter are we allowed to use Pre-1st mission to explain this huge ammount of time in the pocket dimension that doesnt follow the rules of standard time and space

Im hoping Bull can pipe in on this one way or another

[Hida Tsuzua]

If my memory serves on making your own spells, you can't spend downtime before your 1st mission. I think this is because the character doesn't officially "exist" until that point. I'll hunt down the threads at some point.

As for caps on downtime, I've never seen any mention of it from my discussions on programming (both pre and post SRM4 FAQ). I believe the thought is that as long as you can pay the bills, you're good. It can cause time weirdness, but that's inherent to the system (why yes I played Mission X before Mission Y so I avenged Z that hadn't happened yet). What am I unclear about is if you can program your own military rating programs or not.

[Wraith235]

I have abandoned the Milspec programs question .... for now

I need to get the downtime thing cleared up before tackling that bear

[Bull]

With War! in print, I've decided I'm going to tackle that, and a few other things that have come up, and release an updated FAQ sometime in the near future.

A) No, you cannot spend downtime before your first mission. In theory, Week One on your calender should be your first Missions adventure.

B) Yes,. you can, again in theory, spend an unlimited amount of time in Downtime between Missions, so long as your rent and other upkeep is paid. This may be addressed though, because as folks like to point out, this can be abused heavily.

C) I missed something in the FAQ. A couple somethings. "Item Creation" of all sorts should be off limits to PCs, mainly to prevent abuse. Creating FOci was covered, but I left out creating your own spells (Which, since it requires GM approval, is out by defauylt anyway, but never hurts to be clear) and Programming. Mainly, this is because the price associated is one major balancing factor. And again, as has been proven by the number crunchers here, you can basically take nearly unlimited amount of free time for almost no money, which basically means you simply go "I have free shit and you don't, neener neener". It's not really fair to the sammies, mages, and riggers who can't create their own cyber, foci, spells, and drones for free.

That and I've always been a fan of pointing out that if you're going to make your own items, why the hell are you shadowrunning? At that point, open a shop and sell your shit and make the same money or more without the risk of getting shot. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I should add that in a home game, the GM gets to set certain balances on the game by controlling downtime. Things happen on his timetable, and the world turning around you. Enemies won;t wait for you to code things. Important jobs that you can't afford to turn down come up. Things will interfere, when they interfere, if the GM doesn't want to let you spend infinite downtime coding and whatnot. Missions doesn't have that luxury, which is why I note that cost is one of the balance factors.

Bull

[Wraith235]

thanks for the answers bull

I agree with you on every point made

[Fauxknight]

I see you hit Day Job, but Trust Fund looks like its still legal. Play one game, take 40 years off, rake in a half mil, go back to running?

[Hida Tsuzua]

I think those rulings are fair in the Missions context and I voiced my opinion on the 5 year programming plan hacker. However I'm not sure I like the "why would they be a shadowrunner if you could make and sell X?" argument. It runs too close to the whole "why not just steal cars?" issue Shadowrun butts into every so often for my taste.

I will also point out that isn't anything inherently bad with the military programs in War! (especially if they don't degrade) but the price is way out there. I'll suggest deep discounts on programs (and other ex-craftables) to be a good faction reward option.

Now the question is, what can you now do in downtime? My thoughts:
1.) Bind and Register Spirits/Sprites (on a related note, you buy hits here for both summoner and spirit right?)
2.) Find Stuff (it can take a while to find high availability & price stuff)
3.) Collect your Trust Fund monthly paycheck (I must admit I'm ashamed to even bring this up)
4.) Train pets (Are the Running Wild rules optional? I remember seeing an Untrained Bandit as a faction reward once)

[Wraith235]

I think those rulings are fair in the Missions context and I voiced my opinion on the 5 year programming plan hacker. However I'm not sure I like the "why would they be a shadowrunner if you could make and sell X?" argument. It runs too close to the whole "why not just steal cars?" issue Shadowrun butts into every so often for my taste.

his argument is that Coding and enchanting is basically a "License to print money" which I understand completely

[Bull]

Note that was also my personal POV on item creation within a game. Especially because it's legal and incredibly easy to do, relatively speaking.

For Missions, it's more of a balance issue, since certain "classes" cannot create their own gear, and with the more open system of Missions and the nebulous "Downtime", at a certain point it renders money moot.

Bull

[Wraith235]

however ... I COULD Understand modifying Programs ... as that sort of falls under "Modifying existing gear"

CAN I MODIFY GEAR BETWEEN ADVENTURES?
Yes, you can modify weapons and vehicles yourself during downtime. You must purchase the materials using the cost and availability
listed in Arsenal, and have the appropriate tools for the modi cation.
Use the thresholds from Arsenal. Per p. 129, Arsenal, weapon modifications have an interval of 2 hours and vehicle modifications will have an
interval of 6 hours. If you have purchased the appropriate tools, you
must have a lifestyle with enough space (Middle for a shop and High
for facility).
As there are no rules for modifying armor yourself, armor modi-
 cations must be bought when the armor is purchased, and cannot be
applied later.

maybe at a limited rate of 1 option per mission