Let's Get Gritty, Low Power Chicago, Survival is Harder than you Think Options

[Seth]

Extreme survival is OK if you want a game about fleeing from trouble whenever you see it, and desperately trying to get out of trouble. Think Poseidon adventure. . I have played in a few games like that and enjoyed it: but the normal bad guys are other people who are in a similar position, or mutant animals. A single force 4 flesh form insect spirit will kick serious butt, if not kill us all if we are not equipped correctly in a low powered world with high background counts. Almost all of the threats in the Feral cities are such that high powered, well experienced shadowrunners experience problems and/or die when they enter the city. So I would propose that if you want an extreme survival game, don't base it there.

Example:
Fleshform 4 spirit in a body that has 3 or 4 in all stats is rolling around 12 die for everything and has 8 points of hardened armours, and is rolling 16 die to soak most damage. The players are typically at -4 to -8 on all actions they do. In an extreme survival game they start with about 8 die. This battle is only going one way. And that was a very very minor encounter in Chicago.
A Fleshform 6 spirit has 16+ die, the players are at -6 to -12 and a handful of these can take out a small army of people equipped with low powered gear.

So I really fancy playing a game in Chicago. I have GMed quite a few scenarios against the insect spirits, and they are one of my favourite monsters. I haven't played a character in a game with them yet.

To make the game actually about the Feral Cities we have to be able to survive in a way that isn't just "survivor bias" i.e. we got lucky in the past and avoided all contact (kindof like the little girl or the cat in "Aliens"). Low powered shadow running might work out ok. A 600 karma mage can do things about that spirit (if the background count is low). So we have to stay out of the high background count areas and avoid any serious threats. But unless we all want to be low powered mages (or adepts or mystic adepts) then the cyber characters have to be able to compete. Hence my earlier comments about availability

[mister__joshua]

It depends a lot also on where in Chicago you set it. The middle of Chicago is a real no-go for even experienced shadowrunners (fluff wise, that is) and people avoid it at all costs. The Corridor around the city, where most people live, is more akin to a campaign in the Redmond Barrens, only without access to some of the things that even Redmond's residents can get, eg the constant struggle for clean water and food. When people do have to run through the z-zone it's for something specific; usually to get to the other side with it's completely unregulated docks and black market

Without meaning to hijack this game (as your ideas may be completely different to mine), this is what I was thinking of running for my Chicago game. It may be useful, you may hate it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

The players are a group of characters living in the corridor. They aren't a shadowrunning team, but a small community brought together by necessity (like for eg the towns in Fallout:New Vegas, where you have a small community of 5 or 6 people looking out for each other against the wastes). The whole campaign is the characters striving for something better, taking risks and being forced into desperate situations. No-one who lives there actually wants to, but where do you go with no money and no SIN. Oh, the dream of getting to the city and living the life of a wageslave!

To this end characters would be low BP, would be limited to AT MOST squatter lifestyle (making finding basic necessities and sustenance a priority) and the BP spent on gear would be greatly reduced. Anyone who's character has grown up in chicago and has some fancy gear needs a good story about how they got it and where they learned to use it.

Plot hooks in this setting are plentiful. The characters can be forced into defending their mini-community from outside threats, they could make a run to steal water from another community, or to tap electricity from the corps on the edge of town. Alternatively, people in this desperate a situation would do anything for the chance of a better life.

Anyways, those were my ideas. Take from it what you will. I know some people will have a completely different view at the opposite end of the scale but there you go.


Also, Blackhat mentioned there was a community errata for the karmagen system? Could you post a link cheers? I read karmagen the other day and thought it needed a little tidying (no cost for metatype?!) so would be interested in reading that before I attempt to do my own

Cheers

[BlackHat]

Also, Blackhat mentioned there was a community errata for the karmagen system? Could you post a link cheers? I read karmagen the other day and thought it needed a little tidying (no cost for metatype?!) so would be interested in reading that before I attempt to do my own

I'll see if I can dig it up. The main thing I took away from it was the no-cost-metatype thing turned out to be a really bad idea if you allowed non-standard metatypes that get cool powers/abilities along with stat boosts and which are not already qualities (AIs, free spirits, etc). It also addresses the karma cost for attributes changing in SR4A (or was that earlier) to New Rating x 5.

Here is the post: http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...mp;#entry948067

I guess this is planned errata which was addressed in the German version of RC (why has the English one not been touched? No idea)

[BlackHat]

-Players are either completely new to the zone, or thats all they know.
-Cyber is restricted to just about that. If you've been here, all you're going to have is cyber. Bio and Nano just aren't in production in the Zone.
-Magic is restricted in the way where, abusing your magic is dangerous, but used when needed nothing (probably) will go wrong.

Seems like if players were new to the zone, I wouldn't bother with restricting gear, since newcomers could bring in anything that normal shadowrunners could get their hands on (including bioware, nanoware, etc.) Of course, once they start living in Chicago, they'll have a hard time getting restocked or having maintenance done. If the zone is all they know (like the PCs grew up in the area), then restricting gear makes sense, but probably will end up influencing the sorts of characters people make (whether intentionally, or not). I don't think that is necessarily a bad thing, as long as we know about it up front and there are still players interested, but I generally agree with whoever posted that restricting gear tends to lead people to create magical characters instead.

[Seth]

I generally agree with whoever posted that restricting gear tends to lead people to create magical characters instead.

I was (overally) outspoken on this topic, mostly because of the "law of unintended consequences". If tech is reduced then magic is more attractive and we end up running magic-run. If we reduce magic as well then we end up running mook-run. I have played mook-run in the fast (we played the red shirts in Star Trek) and it can be good.

While I prefer games with a wide range of character types, it is possible and often fun to run a game in which we are all the same.

[Tanegar]

I'm interested. I think this would be a neat setting for the urban shaman concept I've had kicking around for a long time.

[BlackHat]

...it is possible and often fun to run a game in which we are all the same.

I doubt we will end up all the same, in any case. Besides, it looks like there is already enough interest that Belvidere would have his choice of a number of characters to make sure the team has an interesting mix. If I am counting right, we've had nine people at least pipe up as interested.

[sabs]

I actually have a 399 BP character that i could tweak that would be really interesting.

Although the character is dependent on Availability 19F Restricted Gear (with the appropriate quality) so.. not sure how that would work.

But he's an ex-corp turned organ legger turned shadowrunner.
Stealth/Wheels/Skillwires (move by wire 2) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

A surprisingly fun character.

[Fyndhal]

The character I was thinking of is a SURGE III human who grew up here. Infiltration, Survival, a few Adept abilities -- but uneducated, illiterate and unfamiliar with the world "outside."

[Belvidere]

Wasteland. That's what they call it now. Chicago that is. They say that nothing is worth a damn thing anymore. They say that the if the bugs don't frag ya, then the radiation will. They say the only people left there are the crazies and those lookin' to no be found. But what most don't know. They're right. Containment Zone, Wasteland, Drekhole, Abyss. Oh I've heard all the names. My favorite name of all, Home.
Believe it or not, there are some of us who love this place. It's the only thing we know, and it's ours. No corp is going to try and claim this place and only the crazies go into the truly dangerous places. So I ask you, are you up for it? Cause you know what they say chummer. Only roaches and twinkies can make it in a place like this. Care to prove'em wrong?

Thus far, the lines laid down for the game are going to be as follows.
-300BP character creation
-Standard restrictions on gear, but I'm going to trust my players to get gear that makes sense for their characters. I reserve the right to say "no"
-Your characters can either be born and raised in Chicago, or recently in the Zone. If you're new to the Zone, I need a damn good reason for you to be there.
-I'm going to be using the advanced medtech rules for massive damage, and glitches and critical glitches.

I'm only excepting four characters at the moment. So any who are interested, go ahead and post a paragraph, selling me your character to the setting. Any other than the four I choose will be on a reserve list.

[BlackHat]

How long will you be accepting before you pick your four? or is it first come first served?

[Belvidere]

I'll be accepting profiles until probably the end of the weekend. Maybe a bit longer.

[BlackHat]

Also, is there a list of approved or forbidden books?

[Belvidere]

Anything but Attitude. I'm waiting for it to come out in print.

[Mickle5125]

Hank swears he's not compensating for anything. He just likes his guns long and hard hitting. Doesn't stop the others from giving him drek for it, but he sticks by his story. And everyone who gives him drek is more than willing to cut the crap when one of his "big stick" rounds splatters a low-level bug all over the place. As for where he came from... Well, he was one of the lucky ones. Living on the outskirts of the city, he wasn't caught in the mess when things were going bad. Unfortunately, when the wall went up, his family was on the wrong side of the street. Guards didn't take kindly to Hank's dad trying to cross over to safety. His mom gave up shortly after, wasting away. Said she didn't have anything to live for, now that her love was dead. Hank was lucky enough that the owner of a nearby gun shop was passing by and heard the then-bratty Hank crying and decided that another body protecting the area was worth feeding the extra mouth. Since then, Hank has been learning the trade, picking up on how to survive in the hellhole that was Chicago.

Hank:
Primary focus: Longarms street sam
secondary: stealth
tertiary: social or survival

metatype: Undecided (ork maybe?)

[mister__joshua]

Here's my bid to join

[ Spoiler ]

The first thing Jim can remember is the Orphanage in Southside. He was told he was picked up downtown during the
time of the CZ. When the walls came down we was taken to the orphanage. As a youth he was snatched from outside
the orphanage by a ghould raiding pack dragged into the Zone. That he escaped was nothing more than chance as his
captors met with a FAB-III cloud and perished, leaving him stranded in the zone alone. Over a few weeks he
managed to make his way out of the zone, laying low and eating anything he could find, not really knowing where
he was going and having to grow up real fast. He finally came upon the Survivalist communities on the Southside
CZ border and set up a squat there. Since that time, now some 7 years ago, he has made his home in the community,
venturing out to find food and water, sometimes to hunt and trading Chicago Hours for necessities. Living each
day as it comes, just finding enough and trading enough to keep his weapon maintained and his squat livable, this
is the only life he has ever known, and to him as long as he's alive it's going well.

Name: Jim
Age: Early 20s
Metatype: Human (0bp)
Nationality: Chicago born and bread
Appearance: Long unkempt hair and a survivalist beard

Stats: (150bp)
Body: 4
Agility: 3
Reaction: 4
Strength: 2
Charisma: 2
Intuition: 3
Logic: 2
Willpower: 3

Edge: 4 (20bp)
Initiative: 7
IP: 1
Essence: 6

Qualities: (+10bp)
Positive
Outdoorsman
Juryrigger
Latent Technomancer

Negative
Illiterate
Computer Illiterate
Uncouth

Skills: (130bp)
Active
Outdoors (group): 4
Athletics (group): 2
Long Arms (Spec. Sports Rifles): 4
Perception: 2
Dodge: 2
Blades (Spec. Knives): 2
Armourer (Spec. Firearms): 1
First Aid: 2
Infiltration: 2
Shadowing: 1

Knowledge
Chicago Safe Havens: 5
Chicago Streets: 3
Chicago Black Market: 2
Chicago Barter Methods: 2
Chicago Ecology: 3

Gear: (1bp)(5000¥)
Advanced Lifestyle: Squatter with Street Entertainment and Security
Paid up for 1 Year (3600¥)
Knife (20¥)
Ruger 100 Sports Rifle (900¥)
Ammo 100 Rounds (200¥)
Survival Kit (100¥)
Warm Clothing (Rating 1 Insulation) (180¥)

Contacts: (9bp)
Chicago Southside Survivalist Communities
Group Contact (Loyalty 3 Connection 1(2) (+1 for Membership)
Calumet Harbour Black Market Smuggler (Loyalty 1, Connection 3)

[Seth]

Here is my bid to join: A Rat shaman that is on a vision quest to Chicago.

Umbra's den was off a main storm drain that led into Lake Michigan. While messy, it had everything that Umbra needed: a stash of food, a place to keep a few spare clothers (needed when meeting posh folks), and a nice safe place to hide Umbra's small set of treasures.

Rat wasn't the easiest totem to follow. Sometimes Rat put Umbra in danger. It was safer outside Chicago, but Rat said there were things here that had to be done. It wasn't easy to get inside the wall, but Rat knew a way. There were others dangers too: there were other people living near here, and there were predators that preyed on them. Rat didn't like that, and Umbra had to do things about it. Sometimes Rat was greedy and Umbra had to go and get some treasure. Still Rat was helpful, and had taught Umbra lots of tricks.

Some of the people above don't like anyone. Once Rat told Umbra to stop some raiders. That didn't go too well: the raiders had radar and grenades, and Rat's tricks were not enough to save him. The doctor saved most of Umbra, but couldn't save his arm. Rat really isn't an easy totem to follow. One day Umbra will be able to leave Chicago and get a new one.

Some of the people above don't like Umbra. It wasn't his fault that he was very big and little bit slow. They used to pick on him, and Umbra would run away. Once they didn't let him run away and he had to hurt them. Umbra hurt one of them so bad that he never walked again. Rat taught him "always run from a fight, but if you cannot then finish it". Umbra doesn't like to fight but sometimes you need to. The people above don't mess with Umbra anymore.

Rat has told Umbra that he needs to grow. Umbra is a person and the people above are people. Umbra needs to learn to be with people. So Umbra is now spending more time upstairs, and is learning about people.

Umbra:
Primary focus: Infiltration
secondary: probably melee combat and social (learning about people)

Metatype: Something goblinoid i.e orc or troll.

[Belvidere]

I love the ideas so far folks! As I said, I'll probably keep it open until the end of the weekend. But if you have any questions, feel free to ask me via PM or right here. More conversation will keep this thread near the top, so more people will see it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

[mister__joshua]

Here is my bid to join: A Rat shaman that is on a vision quest to Chicago.

Haha. Reading your story made me think of Minsk and Boo from the old Baldurs Gate game (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Jimson]

Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYES!!!!!

Edit: Don't think I'll be participating. Just in case work picks up again, I probably should stay focused on my Eclipse Phase game here.

[Seth]

Wow thats a blast from the past. I spent so many hours playing that game.

I haven't played a rat shaman...but if there is ever a place where he would feel at home it's Chicago. I quite like the idea of playing a coward with "combat monster" (thats kind of how I read the rat shaman fluff).

[Belvidere]

Wow thats a blast from the past. I spent so many hours playing that game.

That is one of those games you play, you love, and somehow it slips your mind forever, then you bust it back out and cry over the nostalgia. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

[Mickle5125]

Is a fake SIN going to be necessary for this game, or are we likely going to be staying in the hellhole for a while?

[Belvidere]

Is a fake SIN going to be necessary for this game, or are we likely going to be staying in the hellhole for a while?

That's totally up to the characters really. But just think in character. Getting a fake SIN within the CZ is gonna be tougha nd getting out of the CZ without one is next to impossible.

[Tanegar]

Do we also have the previously-mentioned option of 600-point karmagen? I'd like my character to start as an experienced shaman with at least one initiation under his belt.