Daredrenaline and Drain Resistance Options

[Xahn Borealis]

So, yeah. Does Daredrenaline geneware contribute to Drain Resistance Tests with it's +1 Qillpower?

[Xahn Borealis]

+1 Willpower, even.

[Mäx]

I would say yes, considering it also works for spell resistance.

[Xahn Borealis]

This was probably a waste of a topic. Maybe I should just add one thread for all my questions?

[Kerenshara]

I disagree. It's not "WILlpower-linked tests" and it's not "+1 WILlpower". Fear is a WILlpower-only test (with some unusual modifiers), and so is Spell Resistance (where Counterspelling is more of a modifier). Drain Resistance is a [Drain ATTribute + WILlpower] Test so I would say it's not affected. Otherwise, it would be OP as hell. Every Magician or LOGic-Tradition caster would take it and Alpha-grade Cerebral Boosters and overcast everything. I'm pretty sure that's not what the Dev's had in mind.

That's my opinion, anyhow. Your actual kilometrage will of course vary.

-Kerenshara

[Xahn Borealis]

I suppose it depends on whether you think "greater mental alertness" would add to a certain test. The description sounds like it should be doing something to Initiative, anyway.

[Kerenshara]

I suppose it depends on whether you think "greater mental alertness" would add to a certain test. The description sounds like it should be doing something to Initiative, anyway.

Initiative isn't really about noticing danger or even just reacting (without panicking) quickly; it's about the ability to act in a controled fashion somehow. Realizing you're about to be attacked and not pissing yourself is a good start, but that doesn't mean your body and the action-oriented part of your mind are immediately up to the challenge. Put another way, this piece of 'ware is passive, not active. Now, if you wanted to argue it offered its bonus on Surprise Tests or maybe certain Perception Tests, then you'd be on a lot better grounds.

-Kerenshara

[Glyph]

The RAW is fairly clear on this one. "Willpower tests" means exactly what it says. So you don't get to add +1 to Drain resistance, survival tests, or anything other than what it says. Braveheart, on the other hand...

[Mäx]

[font="Lucida Console"]I disagree. It's not "WILlpower-linked tests" and it's not "+1 WILlpower". Fear is a WILlpower-only test (with some unusual modifiers), and so is Spell Resistance (where Counterspelling is more of a modifier). Drain Resistance is a [Drain ATTribute + WILlpower] Test so I would say it's not affected. Otherwise, it would be OP as hell.

I wouldn't really call being able to resist 1/3 point of drain more "OP as hell", more like "mildly usefull, should think about getting this if your getting some ware anyway and have essence to spare"

But on second read, i do agree with it not adding to drain resistance, forgot that spell resistance is actually a pure willpower test at its core.

[Xahn Borealis]

Seems strange from a fluff perspective. "I have enhanced adrenaline so I'm better at shaking off mind control and the like"?

[Xahn Borealis]

It's not an issue any more. I've swapped it for PuSHeD.

[Yerameyahu]

There's really no need to munchkin a caster in SR4. They come pre-OP. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Xahn Borealis]

Tbh, there's really no need for me to build him legally with 400BP, it's just a reference for a fanfic character.

[Yerameyahu]

OH! In that case, he can also be a technomancer, and a dragon. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) The rules don't apply. Good luck, though.

[Fortinbras]

Would you say Daredrenaline helps with Black IC and Dumpshock?

[Kerenshara]

Would you say Daredrenaline helps with Black IC and Dumpshock?

Those are straight WILlpower Tests (with Feedback Filter mods) for the IC and straight WILlpower for the DS check, right? Then yes. And I had forgotten those... Thanks!

-Kerenshara

[Summerstorm]

Hm, i just got interested in this. Read a bit over the whole thing... but isn't a dumpshock (or Black-IC attack) not just damage resistance tests?

I know they are not worded like that in their own description (Apart from "Resist Dumpshock damage with willpoer + biofeedback filter ...")

But if this improvement works there, it should work against drain too. And if it doesn't work at ALL those applications, why would it work for spell and power resist (and only there)? Should it work on composure tests? Well, it at least sounds as it should. But if it works (as i somehow think it is) with ALL of the above... what is the difference with a +1 to willpower. HMPF this description CONFUSES AND INFURIATES ME *g*.

Hm, judging from the price and from the essenceloss (only 0.1, but one hefty drawback) i think it of course should NOT be a effective +1 die (Qualia for example uses 0.4 essence for a +1 to tests)... but PuShed on the other hand... GRAH.

Ah to hell with it, Willpower already is the hardest attribute to raise and augment effectively. I would just give it to all tests.

[pbangarth]

Drain Resistance is a [Drain ATTribute + WILlpower] Test so I would say it's not affected.

Your argument seems to be based on the fact that the 'Drain Attribute' is the primary Attribute in Drain Resistance Tests because it is listed first before Willpower. Strictly speaking, this is not so. Drain Resistance Tests in SR4A are described as "Willpower + the attribute appropriate to the tradition". See pages 184 and 188.

Seeing as Willpower is listed first and is the only constant Attribute in Drain Resistance Tests, it should be considered the primary Attribute. This would suggest that Drain Resistance Tests are Willpower Tests, and that Daredrenaline should apply.

[Fortinbras]

I think what is trying to be said is that Daredrenaline applies to Willpower Tests alone, and not Willpower based tests that involve another attribute or skill. Thus Drain, being a linked test would not apply.
Spell resistance and Dumpshock, on the other hand are Willpower Tests alone. They are modified by extenuating circumstances, such as Counterspelling(not always the case) and Biofilter(which is not always running and, if it were, would impose a consequence upon the hacker.) Much the same way dodging bullets without taking a Full Dodge is a Reaction Test, yet modified by the circumstance of cover.
Drain can never be a Willpower Test, because it always involves another attribute, no matter what that attribute may be. One's Drain Attribute is never 0. Drain Resistance can never be a Willpower Test alone, without other attributes coming into play. Neither can Composure. Whic is the "primary attribute", whatever that is, is irrelevant.

[Yerameyahu]

I blame the writers for inventing these kinds of bonuses. The whole mess with Enhanced Articulation, PuSHeD, GymDodge, etc., feh.

[Summerstorm]

Ok, i have checked up on the whole thing again. And i have decided (for me of course) to really use it as a +1 die to ALL rolls involving willpower.

One thing which further strenthened my decision was: The Genetic Infusion "Braveheart" is described as "Daredrenalin" and "Double Elastin", both in overdrive as it seems (As the double Elastin now provides two points armour instead of one"But the daredrenalin flatout part provides a +1 willpower). Sure they are not the same (and the infusion is more dangerous and potent - dulls your senses too) But the intention is clear.

[Yerameyahu]

The only intention that matters is your GM's. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) It's unseemly to try and read the tea leaves of these crazy books. So, go with your decision and don't look back.

[Kerenshara]

Ok, i have checked up on the whole thing again. And i have decided (for me of course) to really use it as a +1 die to ALL rolls involving willpower.

One thing which further strenthened my decision was: The Genetic Infusion "Braveheart" is described as "Daredrenalin" and "Double Elastin", both in overdrive as it seems (As the double Elastin now provides two points armour instead of one"But the daredrenalin flatout part provides a +1 willpower). Sure they are not the same (and the infusion is more dangerous and potent - dulls your senses too) But the intention is clear.

Well, it doesn't matter a wit if you're not playing with caps, but with us it would and here's how I would go if you plan to use it with all WILlpower tests:

• Daredrenaline provides a +1 modifier on all Willpower linked tests.

That way it counts under "maximum modifiers" to (help) keep things from getting silly. It also keeps it from increasing stats while astrally projecting for example since we're talking about the Awakened here...

-Kerenshara