Chummer Character Generator Options

[Nebular]

I am creating a "cyber blogger" who has cyber eyes and cyber ears with all sorts of mods added. When I save the new cybersuite then reload it, I only get the cybereyes and ears without all the extra add ons.

Well that was smart. I apparently forgot to put in the code that actually writes out the plugin information, so it was only ever recording the base Cybereyes piece and nothing else. This will be fixed in the next update (you'll need to re-create the Cyberware Suite once the update is available).

[Nebular]

C] Is it possible to / How would I change the "Starting BP", "Max avail" and "Ignore Character Creation rules" settings when a character is allready being created, without recreating him from the begining ? Even a dirty solution (notepad++) would be nice because I couldn't figure out how.

You can modify the save file to update these values. Starting BP is found in the <bp> tag. Max Avail is <maxavail>. Ignore Rules is a special tag that only exists in the save file if it is turned on. Place <ignorerules>True</ignorerules> between <playername> and <karma> to enable it.

[Jazz]

I'd really like to update Chummer to work with multiple languages, and I've been getting more and more requests to translate it to German. Everyone has been asking for the source code though which isn't a feasible solution as there would then be different versions floating around - English version is at build Y, meanwhile the German version is updated independently and is only at version X

We agree and we came with a solution that overrides that problem.

because it takes a while for translations.

Yes and no. As I said, we've got access to an offical french xls master file.

When you write rpg, the main editor always have a file like this to show the official names they invented. In french rpg edition, these are usually called "bible".
Shadowrun is being translated by a french team. Each time they have to translate a gameplay element, they got used to put their translation in a single file like that.

We have this file, it's a xls. If we want a french.xml with "<English>Edge</English><Translation>Chance</Translation>", it's a matter of 10 minutes.

"If I were the german editor", I would have the same file somewhere.

What I'd like to do instead is put all of the language strings into a language-specific XML file. This would mean that only a single version of the application would need to exist, and people just need to provide translations for new strings as needed (with it falling back to English if a translated version isn't available).

We came with the same conclusions.

There are a few big problems with this.


1) There are a large number of strings in the application and pulling them all out, indexing them, and dumping them into an XML file is going to take a long time (and is about as fun as watching paint dry). This would also hold up any other updates as this is an all-or-nothing sort of change and cannot be released half-done. There are no critical bugs right now, so perhaps this is the best time to do it.

As I said, I only see some small problems coming with the indexation.

In this files there's indexes, but not Chummer's.
More like : found in "Arsenal", it's an "Equipement". Not a very precise Arsenal p.53 and it's a Weapon upgrade thingy like in chummer.

Maybe we could cross-reference chummer's xml with our xls. It should be easy if you have chummer's xlm in xls form.

2) This only addresses the application. The data files and character sheet files would still be in English. I don't know if that would be a problem or not, but I have no idea how to handle this if they would need to be in another language as they're replaced with each data/character sheet file update. My first thought is to provide identifier keys for all of the items, but that is a massive amount of work, would require a lot of stuff to be re-written, and would break every save file, so it's not really a solution as far as I'm concerned.

I don't really understand the problem as I'm not in Chummer's secrets.

We had the idea of having a second parser after Chummer's main parser.

When Chummer read in a xml in the purpose of affiching a value, it makes his job as usual but before affiching he use a/our translating module. The translating module would be the same as your main reader module, but he would search in french_gear.xml or german_gear.xml instead of searching in gear.xml for exemple. Then he returns the name to affich or work with.

translating module : input = the name to search, the language

French_gear.xml only contains the names in english, the supplement names, the reference and the names in french, no stats. Stats of items only exists in gear.xml

To summurize, you would have to do this second parsing (ie translate) each time you are not writing in a datafile. that way : When I create a charcter in my french language, the character is saved in a format that a user in english or a user in german can read and affich.

And the same if an english super cool man wrote a character megapack with new super awesome equipement. French/german would still be able to read it and use it, since that megapack (maybe it's allready made) have english data in it.

Of course, custom item would still be in english, but "who cares for a few items when you have 90% of them listed rigth as you want" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

And also, of course, the notes would still be in french, no magic here.

Omae service itself shouldn't be a concern. It doesn't return any strings, only a status which the application interprets into a message, so those would be a part of the translated strings. The only snag is things like Qualities and Metatypes, if translated into another language, would not be translated back to English when someone searches.

Again, I don understand very well because you're the only to be in Chummer's dirty secrets (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (and we don't want to interfere)

[Jazz]

(double post)

[Jazz]

Also, look, we found differences in a few more xml items :

CODE

        <quality>
            <name>Adept</name>
            <bp>5</bp>
            <category>Positive</category>
            <bonus>
                <addattribute>
                    <name>MAG</name>
                    <min>1</min>
                    <max>6</max>
                    <aug>6</aug>
                    <val>1</val>
                </addattribute>
                <enabletab>
                    <name>adept</name>
                </enabletab>
            </bonus>
            <forbidden>
                <oneof>
                    <quality>Magician</quality>
                    <quality>Mystic Adept</quality>
                    <quality>Technomancer</quality>
                </oneof>
            </forbidden>
            <source>SR4</source>
            <page>90</page>
        </quality>

=>
* we would want to translate Adept to Adepte (since it's displayed)
* also categories migth be something we'd like to translate (since it's in the search drop boxes)
* Source aswell (since some book have different names, like Street Magic which is "La Magie des Ombres" in french (Shadows' magic). SM got translated by MdO (see below, it's not entirelly the same books)
* Page : Something can be for exemple in Arsenal in english @ page 100 and in french or german at page 105 (we've got the german stuff + french extras like french cities (for exemple Marseille, where one of the biggest VIP of SR lives (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) ) or extra scenario in Ghost Cartel + sometimes some pdf in our books (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) + erratas since the english book is out...

I think the french edition is the most complete edition ever (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) ... The price ? In autumn we'll be having Running Wild :/

We have also supplements that you english guys don't have : S.O.X., and the "Shadowrun Vintage" books, which are a translations of the best extracts of old SR1/2/3 stuff which have never found a translation in french.
I don't remember if the playing stuff in them have been adapted for SR4 (my reading is late of lots of books).

[Nebular]

For now, at least, I'm going to limit it to just translations of application strings themselves. Data is a seperate beast entirely and introduces a larger number of problems (and a lot of stuff is keyed on this like Category names and Grade name). Once piece at a time. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Nebular]

Build 184

• corrected an issue with Spirits and Sprites that had any Attribute, Skill, or Complex Form with a Rating expression that involved division
• window contents should no longer be affected by the selected text size in Windows
• setting a Credstick's Rating to 0 no longer throws an error
• added support for specifying Program Options for Complex Forms to metatypes.xml and critters.xml
• added support for specifying a Program Category for Optional Complex Forms to metatypes.xml and critters.xml
• plugins are now saved when creating a custom Cyberware Suite

[Labrada]

I'm not sure if I quite understand what you're asking for... It sounds like you just need an option to reduce the Essence cost of a piece of Cyberware or Bioware by 10% on an as-needed basisc. Is that correct?

yes that's it...do you think it's possible easily?
thanks

[Nebular]

yes that's it...do you think it's possible easily?
thanks

I think so. It will be a little while before it gets put in though. I've started working on translating the interface and there's really no turning back from that, so all of that needs to get done before I can make any other changes.

[Labrada]

oki, your work is awesome and i'm really glad too for the translation (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[baronspam]

I tried to download this twice today and I got about 2/3 of the file and it stalled out. Any suggestions? Is there a better link than the one from the start of the thread?

[ShadowWalker]

For now, at least, I'm going to limit it to just translations of application strings themselves. Data is a seperate beast entirely and introduces a larger number of problems (and a lot of stuff is keyed on this like Category names and Grade name). Once piece at a time. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

yeah, you would end up having to change to a category id and a display name, or something like that.

[baronspam]

oki, your work is awesome and i'm really glad too for the translation (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Never mind, third time was the charm.

[Jazz]

I've started working on translating the interface and there's really no turning back from that, so all of that needs to get done before I can make any other changes.

You do speak french/german or you are "xmling" the text of menus ?

[Nebular]

You do speak french/german or you are "xmling" the text of menus ?

All of the strings are being moved to an XML file. The basic structure will be

CODE

<string>
   <key>Label_Metatype</key>
   <text>Metatype:</text>
</string>

where key is the internal identifier that cannot be changed, and text is the literal value for the given language. If a language-specific version of a string isn't found (for example new strings that have not been translated), the application falls back to English for it. This will apply to all Window titles, Labels, Checkboxes, Buttons, Menus, ToolTips, and TreeView root Nodes. The XML file has comments to indicate that a given section of strings applies to a particular Window and I'm trying to make the keys fairly self-documenting. A number of the strings will contain C-style slugs like {0} and {1} to act as placeholders for values. For example, a ToolTip for improving an Attribute would be written as "Improve to {0} for {1} Karma", and the app would replace {0} and {1} with the appropriate values (so it would be displayed as "Improve to 4 for 20 Karma" for example).

[Jazz]

Ok, that's great !

When you will have the definitive version of this xml, you'll have a french language version within a few days (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

When you'll attack the datafile can-of-worm, the same few days, without pages, indexing and so on in a first version (so, yeah, you'll want the "if something isn't found in the language translating file, get english'" condition).

If you want info on the "bible" file we have acess to, here's the structure of it and some few exemples just for you to make an idea :

CODE

VO                    VF                                        Catégorie        Sous-catégorie        Sous-sous-catégorie    Livre
Adept                Adepte                                        trait            avantage            -                        SR4
cyberarm            bras cybernétique                                équipement    cyberware            somatoware                SR4
Cyberarm Gyromount    monture gyroscopique pour bras cybernétique    équipement        -                -                        SR4

Another question : do you have international character support ? Characters like é à è ë ä ï ç â ê î ô û for french for exemple ? Or german or japoneese charcters ?

[Nebular]

Another question : do you have international character support ? Characters like é à è ë ä ï ç â ê î ô û for french for exemple ? Or german or japoneese charcters ?

Yup, everything should support Unicode characters. There are a few item names with those accents and a couple of character in Omae that use Kanji (one of the Japanese character sets), so everything should be OK.

[Overture]

I signed up just so that I could thank you for this. This program is absolutely amazing (and pointed out a few errors I made in bookkeeping by hand!) Thank you SO much.

[KeyMasterOfGozer]

I know you have your hands full with the Multi-Language thing, but I have a few minor requests to add to the list.

1) Initiative and IP for a Magician with the spell Increased Reflexes should probably have an Augmented note showing like Inititative: 9(13) IP: 1(4)

2) This is a House Rule, but if it would be possible to accommodate, I would appreciate...
We add cyberware and racial bonuses after we purchase attribute points. So, for instance when you start a Human, you get a bonus +1 to Edge. According to RAW, if you want to buy one more point of Edge, you have to pay 15karma (going from 2->3). The way we play it, you would only pay 10karma (as if going from 1->2). This means it is the same difficulty for a Troll to put 6 points into STR and for a Human to do so, then Troll gets his +4 after (plus 'ware and stuff). I'm not sure if I'm explaining this well, but I think it is a pretty common house rule.

[KeyMasterOfGozer]

Ok, another request for the Options...

You have an Optional Rule "Metatypes cost Karma equal to their BP"....
Normally 1 BP is about equivalent to 2 Karma.
We have always used "Metatypes cost Karma equal to twice their BP".

I have only made Humans thus far in Chummer and didn't notice the difference before.

[esprism]

The actual rule says 1BP=1Karma for metatype (karma creation from Runner's Companion, maybe there's an errata in English version).

[Humbug Hermit]

Ok, another request for the Options...

You have an Optional Rule "Metatypes cost Karma equal to their BP"....
Normally 1 BP is about equivalent to 2 Karma.
We have always used "Metatypes cost Karma equal to twice their BP".

I have only made Humans thus far in Chummer and didn't notice the difference before.

The default Karmagen rules in the English version of the Runners Companion say that a players metatype costs nothing when using karmagen.

The optional rule comes from the German errata where BP cost for metatype is equal to Karma cost at a 1:1 ratio.

p.41 Karma Character Generation Table
The Karma Cost for Metatype (shapeshifter type, etc.) should be “As BP*.”
The Karma Cost for improving an attribute by 1 should be “New rating x 5.”

p.42 Step 1: Choose Your Metatype or Other Character Race Option
The first paragraph should read:
“First you must choose metatype or other alternative character concept (i.e. shapeshifter, AI, sasquatch, etc.); the Karma cost for metatype or race is equal to the BP cost for that metatype or option (i.e. if a race costs 10 BP, in Karmagen it costs 10 Karma); the BP cost should be noted as it is important for Step 3. The Metatype Attribute Table (see p. 70 and p.73, SR4) or the relevant table in the section describing the new character races in this book provide your character’s starting and maximum attribute ratings.”

p.42 Step 5: Convert Your Karma to Nuyen
The second line should read:
“A maximum of 100 Karma may be converted to nuyen in this fashion, or 120 if the character has the Born Rich quality (p.96).”

p.43 Focus Bonding Table
The Karma Cost for weapon foci should be “3 x Force.”

[KeyMasterOfGozer]

The actual rule says 1BP=1Karma for metatype (karma creation from Runner's Companion, maybe there's an errata in English version).

The default Karmagen rules in the English version of the Runners Companion say that a players metatype costs nothing when using karmagen.

The optional rule comes from the German errata where BP cost for metatype is equal to Karma cost at a 1:1 ratio.

Correct. This is why I am asking for our house rule to be implemented as an option, which I think is better than these other 2 options.

[EpicSpire]

a friend of mine just downloaded Chummer and installed the program. When he opened the program it looked like this:

[IMG]http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1593/srchargenissue.gif[/IMG]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

the circled parts are cut off. It works fine on my computer, but he has problems with it. he wanted me to ask if there is anything he can do to fix this. Does Chummer use Java or Flash or anything that he may need to update or if anyone else has had this problem and managed to fix it.


Thanks

EDIT: i apparently can't post images on this forum, sorry.. the link is to my image shack account.

[ShadowWalker]

a friend of mine just downloaded Chummer and installed the program. When he opened the program it looked like this:

[IMG]http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1593/srchargenissue.gif[/IMG]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

the circled parts are cut off. It works fine on my computer, but he has problems with it. he wanted me to ask if there is anything he can do to fix this. Does Chummer use Java or Flash or anything that he may need to update or if anyone else has had this problem and managed to fix it.


Thanks

EDIT: i apparently can't post images on this forum, sorry.. the link is to my image shack account.

check the display settings and see what the text size is set to.