Chummer Character Generator Options

[Nebular]

Linux and Mac users would greatly appreciate Mono-based builds so this program isn't windows-only. If I had the source, I could (attempt to) make the binaries, if need be.

I've discussed this with a few people through PMs before. I agree that it would be nice of Chummer worked with Mono, but it's a matter of Mono actually being able to support for core functionality that Chummer relies upon. I would need to strip out a lot of functionality to get it to work with the current build of Mono which is something I'm not willing to do, nor do I have the desire to maintain two separate version of the code. There current public build of Mono is sorely lacking a lot of fundamental .NET functionality that causes it to choke on very simple things that Chummer does (it also believe that some things should be rounded up by the Garbage Collector when they're still in scope). I have tried Chummer with GTK# 2.12.10 and MonoDev 2.6.3 (both of which are beta builds right now) and it actually works with them, so it appears that it is more a matter of just waiting for the newest builds of Mono to be released (and believe me, I've been checking that site every day to see if they've finally released it yet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) ).

[Fyndhal]

Me again, with another Load/Save issue.

First, the last one I reported (Essence mysteriously being a full point lower than it should have been) I solved! It turned out to be because at one point, I had taken "Addiction: Burnout" as a placeholder.

Second, I have been playing around with an Adept with both "Way of ___" and Geas. The math seems to reapply each time I load the character, resulting in progressively lower and lower costs for the discounted abilities. I didn't notice it at first, but when Improved Reflexes II cost was down to 0.62 I noticed! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Nebular]

Found a couple of issues with Martial Arts:
- The Martial Art should be called Sangre y Acero not Sangrey y Acero. (Arsenal p. 158)
- The Maneuver should be called Two Weapon Style, not Two Weapon Strike (Arsenal p. 160).

BTW could you add the other Martial Arts as well? While for example Sangre y Acero, Eztlitzli and Ars Cybernetica offer the same bonuses they are distinct Arts and their bonuses do stack, except for +DV which is capped at +3. Also for flavor it may be interesting to have a character skilled in ROSS instead of Krav Maga.

I was wondering if I should have done these when I originally entered 'em and figured I didn't need to. Turns out I was wrong. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) These will be in the next update.

[Nebular]

On a related note, I haven't been able to find the MRSI software from War! anywhere in Chummer. Am I just looking in the wrong places?

It's nowhere. I'll add these in for the next update, along with adding support for the other Software and Nexi Components being able to go up to Rating 10.

[fazzamar]

I have a character with Influence group 4, CHA 7, and Kinesics 3 and all of the skills in the group say 13, yet the tooltip says "Skill Rating (4) + CHA (7) + Modifiers (3)".

[Nebular]

I have a character with Influence group 4, CHA 7, and Kinesics 3 and all of the skills in the group say 13, yet the tooltip says "Skill Rating (4) + CHA (7) + Modifiers (3)".

This will be because you have the Enforce maximum Skill modified Rating option turned on. A Skill's modified Rating (its base Rating + Rating bonuses from Powers, etc.) is limited to 1.5X the current Rating (so Con Rating 4 has a maximum modified Rating of 6). Your 7 CHA is then stacked on top if it which gives you 13.

[Dakka Dakka]

This will be because you have the Enforce maximum Skill modified Rating option turned on. A Skill's modified Rating (its base Rating + Rating bonuses from Powers, etc.) is limited to 1.5X the current Rating (so Con Rating 4 has a maximum modified Rating of 6). Your 7 CHA is then stacked on top if it which gives you 13.

Kinesics does not create an augmented skill rating. It provides Bonus dice. Those do not have this restriction.

[Nebular]

Second, I have been playing around with an Adept with both "Way of ___" and Geas. The math seems to reapply each time I load the character, resulting in progressively lower and lower costs for the discounted abilities. I didn't notice it at first, but when Improved Reflexes II cost was down to 0.62 I noticed! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

That's a bad thing? Increasingly cheap Powers for all! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) This will be fixed in the next update.

[Burrito Al Pasto...]

Actually, looking at the description of Kinesics, it might not be subject to max skill modifiers - 20th says "each level applies a +1 bonus when making or resisting Social skill tests", which sounds like it's not subject to modified rating maximums to me. What did we ever decide about how this works?

EDIT: aaaand I can't find the "delete post" button.

[Nebular]

Kinesics does not create an augmented skill rating. It provides Bonus dice. Those do not have this restriction.

I'm curious as to what actually modifies the Skill Rating itself then to cause the need for the 1.5X thing. Spells add the pool. Powers add to the pool. Even implants (cyberware/bioware) apparently add to the pool. So if everything adds to the pool, what's left to actually create the need for a maximum modified Rating since nothing seems to contribute to it?

[fazzamar]

I'm curious as to what actually modifies the Skill Rating itself then to cause the need for the 1.5X thing. Spells add the pool. Powers add to the pool. Even implants (cyberware/bioware) apparently add to the pool. So if everything adds to the pool, what's left to actually create the need for a maximum modified Rating since nothing seems to contribute to it?

Adept power Improved Ability modifies the skill rating itself....

This power increases the rating of a specific Active skill by 1 per
level. A skill’s maximum modified rating equals its base rating x 1.5.

don't recall any others off the top of my head though.

[SpellBinder]

Some qualities do the same, like Catlike and Linguist.

Basically, in the description of the quality, power, or whatever, if it says it modifies the rating of a skill or attribute it's an augmentation and is limited. If it is described as a bonus to a dice pool, it's not an augmentation and not limited.

[Dakka Dakka]

The MBW adds to the Dodge rating as well.
Enhanced Articulation augments Physical Skills linked to Physical Attributes.

Can't think of any more at the moment.

[Nebular]

Ahh, I see. I had always thought it was just inconsistencies in their writings. I'll add in support for marking data as modifing the rating, then fill in the required info for Qualities, 'Ware, and the like.

[ShadowWalker]

Ahh, I see. I had always thought it was just inconsistencies in their writings. I'll add in support for marking data as modifing the rating, then fill in the required info for Qualities, 'Ware, and the like.

page 188 SR4A - Skill Ratings, 3rd paragraph:

Some abilities and implants (as noted) may increase this rating, creating a modified skill rating. A modified skill cannot exceed the base skill rating x 1.5 (making 9 the maximum possible rating, or 10 with the Aptitude quality).

I have always taken "as noted" to mean that if a quality, ware, power or ability is to affect the skills rating it will be specifically stated that it does so in it's description.

As an example the Reflex Recorder states:

The reflex recorder adds 1 to the rating of a specific skill or skill group (Combat and Physical skills only).

[Dakka Dakka]

Yup that's it, combined with the note on modifiers

The type of modifier in question is noted in the description of each modifier. Should there be any doubt, assume the modifier is a dice pool modifier.

Oh and my bad on Enhanced Articulation. I confused it with the Reflex Recorder. Enhanced articulation gives bonus dice. Sorry.

[ShadowWalker]

I think it would be nice if the character sheet showed the skills listed like:
Name - Base - Skill Modifier - Pool Modifier - Total

On the topic of sheets, it would be really cool if there was a cheat sheet.
Something that listed each action and the various skills and their dice pools.
Maybe with a check list of all the actions and let the user decide which ones to list.

[Dakka Dakka]

You could also go for
AttributeName Name(Specialization) base skill(augmented skill) Modifiers Total

[Nebular]

Build 118

• A.I.s now have their missing Rating, System, Firewall, Signal, and Response Attributes
• A.I. Condition Monitor, Matrix Initiative, and Initiative Passes are now calculated correctly
• Commlink Software Suites, Program Packages, Software Suites, and Skillsoft Clusters now have their Programs added as Gear
• added Martial Art variants from Runner's Companion
• adding missing Software from War!
• added support for Software going to Rating 10 from War!
• added support for Rating 10 Nexi Components
• Nexi Components now populate their Availability when added
• Gear marked as Free! now correctly sets the price to 0 when in Create Mode
• removed Biofeedback Filter and Program Packages from list of Complex Forms
• Vehicle Speed and Acceleration can no longer go below 0
• corrected an error where discounted Adept Powers got progressively cheaper after saving and loading
• there is now a distinction between Dice Pool modifiers and Rating modifiers for Skills with only Rating modifiers being subject to the maximum modified Rating rule
• Skill tooltips now provide a distinction between Rating modifiers and Dice Pool modifiers and report "X of Y" of the character's total Rating modifiers being used because of the maximum modified Rating rule

[Fyndhal]

You know, a guy could get spoiled with this fast of turn around. Less than 10 hours from bug report to new rev for download!

[Nebular]

The code to convert Qualities from the old format to the current one is coming out in the next update, so if you haven't converted some of your characters yet, do it now! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Just open 'em up, click Save, and you're done.

[ShadowWalker]

Build 118

• A.I.s now have their missing Rating, System, Firewall, Signal, and Response Attributes
• A.I. Condition Monitor, Matrix Initiative, and Initiative Passes are now calculated correctly
• Commlink Software Suites, Program Packages, Software Suites, and Skillsoft Clusters now have their Programs added as Gear
• added Martial Art variants from Runner's Companion
• adding missing Software from War!
• added support for Software going to Rating 10 from War!
• added support for Rating 10 Nexi Components
• Nexi Components now populate their Availability when added
• Gear marked as Free! now correctly sets the price to 0 when in Create Mode
• removed Biofeedback Filter and Program Packages from list of Complex Forms
• Vehicle Speed and Acceleration can no longer go below 0
• corrected an error where discounted Adept Powers got progressively cheaper after saving and loading
• there is now a distinction between Dice Pool modifiers and Rating modifiers for Skills with only Rating modifiers being subject to the maximum modified Rating rule
• Skill tooltips now provide a distinction between Rating modifiers and Dice Pool modifiers and report "X of Y" of the character's total Rating modifiers being used because of the maximum modified Rating rule

Resonance should be removed from AIs.
Still can't get an attribute of 6 for the mental attributes.
My guess is that it's because the physical attributes are zero as is their max.

[Nebular]

Resonance should be removed from AIs.
Still can't get an attribute of 6 for the mental attributes.
My guess is that it's because the physical attributes are zero as is their max.

Argh! I thought I removed RES from the A.I. Turns out I just removed the link between it and EDG. Well, the next update will be some time on Sunday, so I'll have the Max Attribute thing fixed up for then.

[ShadowWalker]

Argh! I thought I removed RES from the A.I. Turns out I just removed the link between it and EDG. Well, the next update will be some time on Sunday, so I'll have the Max Attribute thing fixed up for then.

If possible, I would suggest hiding the physical attributes. Having them there adds confusion to the page when the character doesn't have them.

[Dakka Dakka]

Surge Class II at least seems to be a point sink. I made a legal Cahracter, saved it, but when I looad it, I get the message, that I may not spend more than 35 BP on Qualities.
Martial Arts are also gone, weird.

Where are the Sim Modules? Found them. They are only available as Commlink Plugins.

Why do Trodes and Sim Modules have ratings?