Exo-skeleton rules Options

[James McMurray]

Attitude has the Iron Will exo-skeleton, a Body 6 Armor 4 suit that gives you 8 strength at the cost of 1 agility and can be upgraded like it was a vehicle. I can't find rules for exo-skeletons anywhere though. Are they treated as armor, a vehicle (anthroform?) or something else altogether?

If they're just a vehicle that you wear it seems they make it really easy to get hardened armor 12 and a huge strength boost.

[longbowrocks]

Do you think it grants you the armor? It looks to me like the whole thing is just a skeleton, so its defensive stats should only apply when someone attacks it.

On the other hand, I can see you getting vehicle turrets to it. Or adding a rigger's cocoon to basically make you a metahuman sized engine of destruction.

On the cocoon, the only question is whether people consider that remote piloting.

[CanRay]

Yeah, but can you fist-fight Xenomorphs with it?

Or Spirits that look like Xenomorphs (Toxic Beast Spirits? Insect Spirits? Toxic Insect Spirits? ... That last one scared me a lot.)

[Udoshi]

Its not any more abusing than making a budget battlesuit out of an up-armored Evo Orderly, now is it?

But still, powerloader. Two things come to mind: Passenger Protection seems to the the most useful, since it helps YOU soak damage. And a Mechanical Arm using the optional-rule for Cyberlimb Capacity should let you squeeze 3 more strength into the Iron Will with Enhancements, for a total of 11 strength.

Which isn't bad at ALL.

[CanRay]

Or "The Horseman Of The Apocalypse".

[Udoshi]

Actaully, canray, i think the hardest part would be statting up the Xenomorphs to fight it.

I'm sure there's something in Running Wild that would do the trick. Chimeric critters, maybe.

[longbowrocks]

Its not any more abusing than making a budget battlesuit out of an up-armored Evo Orderly, now is it?

But still, powerloader. Two things come to mind: Passenger Protection seems to the the most useful, since it helps YOU soak damage. And a Mechanical Arm using the optional-rule for Cyberlimb Capacity should let you squeeze 3 more strength into the Iron Will with Enhancements, for a total of 11 strength.

Which isn't bad at ALL.

Wow. But as far as I can tell, the Evo Orderly doesn't carry passengers. It looks like a sapient drone that cares for the elderly.

[CanRay]

Wow. But as far as I can tell, the Evo Orderly doesn't carry passengers. It looks like a sapient drone that cares for the elderly.

Until a Technomancer or Feral AI eats it's OS and suddenly you have a Bad Day.

...

Damn, I sound like Clockwork.

[Udoshi]

The orderly is a medi-bed. One person can lay on it.

Its kind of like how the book says drones can't have passengers, but they the crashcart is a drone, and the transys wheelchair is a drone... and any Standard Vehicle, which happens to be Small Drones and up can take a rigger cocoon, which carries a person.

[Yerameyahu]

Only because the rules are wrong. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[longbowrocks]

Alright. I actually looked at the picture this time. It is indeed some kind of medi-bed.

[KarmaInferno]

The irony is that originally the Orderly was statted up as a humanoid drone and the text had no indication that it could carry any passengers at all.

I suspect that there was a disconnect between the author and the artist. The author had in mind a humanoid helper for the elderly, and the artist got the impression that it was some mobile Valkyrie unit.

Later they realized the conflict and the errata solved the problem in the simplest way possible, by deleting the word "humanoid" from the description.




-k

[CanRay]

Wait... There's Errata for something?

[Rasumichin]

Yeah, but can you fist-fight Xenomorphs with it?

Or Spirits that look like Xenomorphs (Toxic Beast Spirits? Insect Spirits? Toxic Insect Spirits? ... That last one scared me a lot.)

The thing with toxic insect spirits is that insect spirits are so alien in the first place that we probably couldn't tell the difference between the toxic and normal varieties.
But they'd probably be the closest you can get to xenomorphs in SR. You would have to houserule the acidic blood, but that wouldn't be a problem if you follow the rules for Corrosive Spit/Corrosive Secretions.

If simply looking like a xenomorph is enough for you, though, that has been done already with custom-looking cyberware (even though it only happened in some German sourcebooks, namely the expanded Hamburg chapter in Runner Havens and the Munich sourcebook).
It's not that hard if you can afford full-body replacement with Raptor Legs, Balance Tail and a Cyberskull with maximum Increased Capacity.

[Summerstorm]

If simply looking like a xenomorph is enough for you, though, that has been done already with custom-looking cyberware (even though it only happened in some German sourcebooks, namely the expanded Hamburg chapter in Runner Havens and the Munich sourcebook).
It's not that hard if you can afford full-body replacement with Raptor Legs, Balance Tail and a Cyberskull with maximum Increased Capacity.

Aye... we had one playing such a "dude" in out SR3 campaign a few year back. SCAAARY Motherfucker. (He also had cyberskates and once hunted hobos through some tunnels... just for the hell of it *g*)

Back to Exoskeletons: Convert the JIM-Exoskeleton from Arsenal 2060 to SR4. I think i have done so in one of my post a few months back... eh. Can't find it.
That thing is awesome (And Rigging it with your matrix speed/enhancements is totally powerful). It also was pretty cheap.

EDIT: Wait... i can just search for it:

http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...p;#entry1000459

Ah there it is:

Well... i think they never retconned anything from previous versions, right? So technically the JIM-Exoskeleton (Arsenal 2060) still exists, just isn't converted. Which i am going to do now. Hm, let's see:

Standart JIM
Body: 5
Armor: 9
System: 1
Sensor: -
Handling: -1
Accel/speed: Like pilot.
Standard Upgrades:
Sealed, Life Support 2 (20 Hour air supply) , Extreme Environment Mod (pressure safe to 600 meter), Mechanical full arms/legs
Avail: 12, 20000 NY

Upgrade JIM
Body: 8
Armor: 9
System: 1
Sensor: -
Handling: -1
Accel/speed: Like pilot.
Sealed, Life Support 2 (20 Hour air supply) , Extreme Environment Mod (pressure safe to 600 meter), Mechanical full arms/legs, Rigger Adaptation.
Avail: 14, 32000 NY

Done. At least that was the thing our rigger ran around with *g*. And it should be available since it DOES serve a purpose. (Underwater exploration and construction). Also... can't you just ask your gm to get you something, Why do you need to modify some existing vehicle.( I know it is just for comparisons in ratings/values) But can't you just make something up? The modification rules are too rigid. Just use your own creativity. (Or use the vehicle design rules from 3rd edition and then convert it to fourth).

[James McMurray]

Do you think it grants you the armor? It looks to me like the whole thing is just a skeleton, so its defensive stats should only apply when someone attacks it.

It's statted up like a vehicle. You operate it by getting inside. People inside a vehicle benefit from the vehicle's armor. I don't see how it can't grant you the armor.

[Dakka Dakka]

Yup and only FA bursts damage the passenger as well as the vehicle.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Yup and only FA bursts damage the passenger as well as the vehicle.

Logically, though, only if the rounds penetrate the armor to start with. Technically Not RAW, but makes absolutely no sense any other way. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

Funny old RAW. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Unless the exoskeleton is a complete shell, people can always elect to shoot the passenger *instead* of the vehicle, and they're at a -2 to dodge, naturally. It's probably a mistake to use any part of the existing vehicle rules for something like this.

[sabs]

But they get the armor of the vehicle added to their armor. The vehicle rules have issues.

[James McMurray]

It's probably a mistake to use any part of the existing vehicle rules for something like this.

This is why I was hoping there were rules for exo-skeletons. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

Indeed. I wish I was surprised that they threw a new piece of technology into the game without bothering to integrate it or consider rules interactions.

[Jhaiisiin]

Yeah, the exo-skeleton is the first instance in SR4 of such a piece of gear, and it doesn't quite fit in any specific category. Big blunder by the devs on not giving a clear indication on how it should be handled.

[Yerameyahu]

For starters, I can't think of a good reason to give this thing any vehicle upgrades. If anyone else *can* think of a good reason, then they should individually allow each upgrade on a case-by-case basis.

Honestly, I'd just use the existing mil-spec 'powered armor' rules… with appropriate modifications, of course. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[longbowrocks]

Are there any rules for shooting through rolled down windows? Because The iron will is like one big rolled down window, without the glass.
In other words, realistically it shouldn't provide you with any cover. In fact, the rules only say it's treated as a vehicle for upgrades.