HMHVV and You, Joining the Ghoul Horde Options

[Hida Tsuzua]

How does HMHVVIII (the type that turns you into a ghoul) work in SRM? At first I thought that infection during play was simply not allowed. However in the Missions FAQ it's mentioned that the rules from Augmentation of "Diseases, Pathogens, and other Conditions" are used. Since the Runner's Companion "Infection in Play" section is based off that section, does that mean that runners can be infected? Or is entire infected section ignored?

If a runner becomes infected, what happens? Are they still eligible to be played as ghouls or must they retire (since infected are not allowed)?

Normally I would say "don't worry about being ghouled" as a GM, but missions takes a very RAW approach so I want to make sure what that is in this case.

[BishopMcQ]

Has Season 4 included any encounters with Ghouls? If not, it's probably as simple as "there won't be a chance for Infection" in the base scenario.

[UmaroVI]

In the interest of minimizing spoilers: at least one mission from seasons 2-4 (The season 2 mission Tunnel Vision) does.

The way the rules are written, if a ghoul makes skin contact with you, the only way to prevent yourself from turning into a ghoul is O-Cell nanites; there's no way to get anything remotely like the mid-thirties dicepool you'd need to beat the disease. I sort of assumed this was a "sweep the terrible rule under the rug and avoid the issue" deal in Missions.

[Hida Tsuzua]

Has Season 4 included any encounters with Ghouls? If not, it's probably as simple as "there won't be a chance for Infection" in the base scenario.

That may or may not stay the case. Or you might play an old CMP or something where they hang out. Ghouls show up from time to time in Seasons 2 and 3 so there's a chance they might show up in 4.

Edit- Typo

[Bull]

For older adventures, I'd say "Don't worry about it". The infection rules are very, very poorly worded. The Ghoul strain of HMHVV is supposed to be transmitted through bite or other "contact" that involved body fluids (I mean claws cutting into you, you perverts!). Plus, the infection rules are just a mess, and the power vector for Ghouls is ridiculous.

Bull

[LurkerOutThere]

I'll resist the urge to laugh maniacally now.

[Dakka Dakka]

The way the rules are written, if a ghoul makes skin contact with you, the only way to prevent yourself from turning into a ghoul is O-Cell nanites; there's no way to get anything remotely like the mid-thirties dicepool you'd need to beat the disease. I sort of assumed this was a "sweep the terrible rule under the rug and avoid the issue" deal in Missions.

There is another way: Burn Edge to achieve a critical success. With 4 net hits over the threshold of 8 on the first roll, you beat it easily. I agree though that the infection vector shoud have been Injection instead of contact.

[UmaroVI]

Even with edge, you still need an unattainably high 28 dice to have a better-than-even chance of critical success (factoring in the Penetration). In addition to being Injection, it really also should have a sane level of power and penetration.

[Dakka Dakka]

I said burn Edge not use Edge. With it you can ensure a Critical Success end up with your permanent Edge one lower.

[Wasabi]

Smart! That way you arent removed from the scene like someone using the Hand of God rule.

[Stahlseele]

HMHVV and you: "Om nom nom nom!"

[Bull]

Like I said, the descriptions of the contraction vectors for disease are... lacking. And limited. Especially since everyone seems bound and determine to play by the absolute letter of the rules rather than just playing the damn game and using common sense on those occasions when it warrants it. *sigh*

Anyway, for past Missions, my suggestion is don't worry about it. Unless a player goes out of his way to deliberately get the disease, have them get checked by a street doc at the end of the run and say "Wow, you got lucky! You're not infected!"

If they do go out of their way... Let them contract the disease, and then take away their character sheet. They just became a disallowed character type, and thus became an NPC. If that character is playing in the Seattle Missions, drop me a line. Maybe I'll put their Ghoul version in a future run as an NPC, for shits and giggles. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

For Season 4 and onward, if we do put in anything like ghouls or bandersnatch that have HMHVV II or III, characters that can spread the infection through "contact", we'll be sure to cover the situation. Both of these are particularly dangerous and nasty, and could very easily be a game wrecker, so we'll tread very carefully, spell out guidelines for how GMs should handle it (If at all, it may end up simply be a case of "Hey, you got lucky!" to make life easier), and probably provide ways for players to resist the effects so that we're not just killing players out of the campaign for no good god-damn reason.

That said, we may use HMHVV I critters on occasion. These have the Infection critter power, and only Infect deliberately, rather than incidentally. Which means that we can use them to beat up PCs without fear of killing them via biological weapons of mass destruction (i.e., I don't plan to ever have Vampires deliberately trying to infect players.)

Bull

[Hida Tsuzua]

Like I said, the descriptions of the contraction vectors for disease are... lacking. And limited. Especially since everyone seems bound and determine to play by the absolute letter of the rules rather than just playing the damn game and using common sense on those occasions when it warrants it. *sigh*

Anyway, for past Missions, my suggestion is don't worry about it. Unless a player goes out of his way to deliberately get the disease, have them get checked by a street doc at the end of the run and say "Wow, you got lucky! You're not infected!"

If they do go out of their way... Let them contract the disease, and then take away their character sheet. They just became a disallowed character type, and thus became an NPC. If that character is playing in the Seattle Missions, drop me a line. Maybe I'll put their Ghoul version in a future run as an NPC, for shits and giggles. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

There's enough issues in SR that just using common sense can lead to problems. But the main reason I asked is to have some argument to a missions GM who might want to hit players up with HMHVV. It's unlikely such a GM exists or I'll run into it, but it's nice to be prepared.

However, now I almost want to make a missions character for Seattle Missions just to get infected and NPCified. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)