Empathy software plus optimization, am I going to far? Options

[Chance359]

"Empathy software is designed for use with standard video/trideo cameras, carefully analyzing the behavioral patterns of the subject to ascertain mood, interest, and so on. Empathy soft ware can be used to make a Judge Intentions Test (see p. 130, SR4) for emotional status using its rating as the dice pool. It does not detect falsehoods; that’s the realm of lie detection soft ware. Empathy soft ware can be discreetly used in real time during negotiations or social interactions, adding its rating as a dice pool bonus to the character’s Social skill tests."

Optimization
This modification optimizes the device’s processor and components to enhance one particular program, applying a +1 dice pool modifier for all tests using that software. Each device may only be optimized once.

So my semi muchikin question is can I optimize my comm link for empathy software to get an extra die for my social skills? I never have a commlink capable of running rating 5 or 6 software, but I keep getting drafted to be my tables face I'm looking for a way to increase my social skill pools.

[KCKitsune]

So my semi muchikin question is can I optimize my comm link for empathy software to get an extra die for my social skills? I never have a commlink capable of running rating 5 or 6 software, but I keep getting drafted to be my tables face I'm looking for a way to increase my social skill pools.

Why get the Commlink mod when you can get Optimize rating 2 and run rating 5 Empathy as if it was a rating 3 program? Add in Ergonomic and you can run Empathy 5 and it doesn't count as a running program when calculating Processor Limit.

[longbowrocks]

Add ergonomic to make running easier? Did you say that solely for the pun? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

[DWC]

Getting the commlink optimization for Empathy is probably well worth it. Mix it with the Optimization program option and you can get your 7 dice out of an R3 commlink.

[Chance359]

I know how much GM feels about empathy software so i dont want to push it to much.

[Udoshi]

The Commlink Mod does work.

however, program mods on Sensor Software do not. Its not Common Use, so it has no available options.(Sad but true)

[KCKitsune]

I know how much GM feels about empathy software so i dont want to push it to much.

I don't think GM's give a flying fig about the Empathy software because it's expensive. I think what has a GM's shorts in a knot is the Emotitoys.


@Udoshi, where do you get that info?

[CanRay]

I don't think GM's give a flying fig about the Empathy software because it's expensive. I think what has a GM's shorts in a knot is the Emotitoys.

As a GM, I don't hate Emotitoys. Of course, I like explosions, so... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Chance359]

My GM and I have agreed that with cybereye's built in camera linked to my comm link I can run empathy softtware with out an emo toy.

[Udoshi]

@Udoshi, where do you get that info?

Well. Basically, options are available for specific categories of software. You can find the list in the options section, but i'll save you the trouble. Common Use, Hacking, Autosoft, Simsense.

These are all regular program types available in the core book.

The problem is, unwired adds all these options, but doesn't give any support for the -new- program types it -also- offers.

Sensor Software(such as empathy) is incapable of taking Program Options because it is not Common use, or Hacking. Its not an autosoft, nor a simsense(BTL, activesoft, skillsoft are available types). Its a unique different category of software with its own cost and availability called Sensor Software.
And sensor software doesn't have any compatable options. Therefore, it can't take any.
This also applies to other types of software, such as Agents/IC,(though their Payloads may have options) Tactical, Telematics Infrastructure, etcetera.

.... its a stupid rule and I, personally, belive Common Use options should apply to pretty much everything.

The Commlink Modification, Optimization(unwired 198) - not to be confused with the Common Use Program Option called Optimization - is far more compatable with any program. Make the mod, pick a specific program, get +1 dice pool modifier to all tests involving that program.

[DWC]

Sensor software also doesn't have an entry for writing your own, or anything in WAR about acquiring it in ratings higher than 6. It seems more symptomatic of the sloppy nature of Unwired and WAR! than any intent for Sensor Software to not follow the rules that all the other software in the game falls within.

Mentally, I guess I'd always handled it as overpriced Common Use software, since it has no legality restrictions.

[Udoshi]

Sensor software also doesn't have an entry for writing your own, or anything in WAR about acquiring it in ratings higher than 6. It seems more symptomatic of the sloppy nature of Unwired and WAR! than any intent for Sensor Software to not follow the rules that all the other software in the game falls within.

Mentally, I guess I'd always handled it as overpriced Common Use software, since it has no legality restrictions.

My emphasis on quites.

Actually, it does. unwired 119. There's 9 program types, before expansion books, and options only apply to 4 of them.

But yeah, i believe it touched upon said sloppy nature of unwired's new software categories. The whole thing is not very integrated with its own rules, and it should be. Sloppy design.

However, I do agree with your solution.

[Yerameyahu]

For many people, it's a waste of that one Commlink Optimization 'slot', but sure, you can do it.

[Whipstitch]

I don't think GM's give a flying fig about the Empathy software because it's expensive. I think what has a GM's shorts in a knot is the Emotitoys.

That hasn't really been a safe assumption in my experience and personally I don't allow them at my table at all since 6 dice is just too high to mesh with what I want from my games. At a potential 6 dice, Empathy software is simply too damn powerful to ignore so I'm rather loathe to prevent the "middle management" types of the shadowrunning world have at least mid-rating or higher via emotitoys. Problem is, that just leads to near ubiquity and just giving everyone X bonus dice in every situation accomplishes little more than giving characters with low social skills a big ol' buffer against glitching. And personally, I really like social glitches. They can be fun as long as everyone's got a good attitude and the GM remembers that non-critical glitches are more of an inconvenience than a disaster.

[Yerameyahu]

There've been lots of threads about 'fixing' Empathy soft, though. I think the simplest is to use the mechanic of other sensor softs (Lie Detection, maybe?), and roll the Rating as a DP that grants a +dice equal to hits (no Edge). That way it's variable, and about half on average. This would be even more okay with the proposed commlink Optimization (+1/3 instead of +1).

[noonesshowmonkey]

They can be fun as long as everyone's got a good attitude and the GM remembers that non-critical glitches are more of an inconvenience than a disaster.

Anyone running electronic Social augmentations in any of my games Glitch on 1s and 2s. You get more dice, but you are way more likely to say the wrong thing at the wrong time or otherwise offend someone. The human animal is eerily capable of sniffing out a machine, Voigt-Kampf style.

Further, Emotitoys do not exist in the SR universe that I run in.

<3

[CanRay]

There's also the fact that it's damned hard to pin down human emotions from, well, anything. Culture shift is a major problem for humans, forget computer code.

EDIT: Good example? Voice. Most Voice Recognition Software in North America is made in the USA, and is set for an accent that I have no idea what it is. My "Northern Ontarian" accent was enough to cause the system such conniption fits that it doesn't even come close to funny. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

That's a pretty coarse way of dealing with it, though. If Empathy software still exists, then someone would invent something like an emotitoy. Maybe it would be more expensive, maybe it would max out at lower ratings, but someone would put it together. Besides, that's only a small part of the problem: yes, emotitoys are too cheap, but Empathy software—period—is the problem. Runners tend to have the good comms and available sensors to run it on, toys or no.

Better solutions are to limit the impact (reduced max Rating, or the suggestion I made above), make it unreliable (above), increase the cost, make it dependent on various sensors (like TacNets), etc. (Incidentally, the roll-and-add-hits idea also has the benefit of being a higher-rating program, which means higher System/Response requirements.) All of these (and many other) ideas can be found in the various threads about it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) It's almost always better to tweak than just delete.

[Whipstitch]

about half on average.

Yeah, that'd be fine. I just removed both the toys AND the software for my own convenience, really, since I feel that it doesn't make much sense to have one but not the other available, although admittedly the price disparity is wonky. If someone really loved the idea of having a li'l drone with 'em all the time I'd be willing to meet the player halfway and nerf emotitoys and empathy software down into Smartlink territory. That way I'd feel less compelled to make them a more common part of the setting and when they did show up they wouldn't single-handedly bootstrap Joe Wageslave up to 5+ dice (and rarely glitches) territory.

[Irion]

Allow it only to read emotions. Square and fair.
(May be give it a +1 to any kind of social interaction.)

[Chance359]

I should have mentioned that this would be used in a Missions setting.

[Yerameyahu]

Ha! Yeah. The way you mentioned GM feelings confused me, cuz they obviously don't matter in that case. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[KarmaInferno]

For many people, it's a waste of that one Commlink Optimization 'slot', but sure, you can do it.

Eh. Commlinks are cheap. Run it on a dedicated commlink. Problem solved.




-k

[Yerameyahu]

They're *not* cheap, if you're running anything good. That only multiplies the System/Response cost, but yes. I said, 'for many people'. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Fortinbras]

There's also the fact that it's damned hard to pin down human emotions from, well, anything. Culture shift is a major problem for humans, forget computer code.

EDIT: Good example? Voice. Most Voice Recognition Software in North America is made in the USA, and is set for an accent that I have no idea what it is. My "Northern Ontarian" accent was enough to cause the system such conniption fits that it doesn't even come close to funny. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

Most Voice Recognition Software is formulated to the Standard American or Standard Speech accent. This accent isn't used by anyone except people who have spent an excessive amount of time and money to learn how to speak properly.
I don't know anyone besides myself who uses a palatial glide(or ju glide or y bridge) when saying words like "new" or "Tuesday."