Dronomancer, Or, My Player's sheet glitched and I think he's underpowered a Options

[sabs]

20x Centipedes 4 1K each
1 x Armadillo 12F 20K
1 x Nimrod (if you can) 18F 75K (post char gen)
1 x Crimson Samurai 10R 9.5K
3 x Micro-Tapper Bug 8 1K each
2 x Repeater Drone 6 3K each
3-5 x MCT Fly Spy 6 2K each
1 x Lockheed Optic-X 6 1.7K
2 x MCT-Nissan RotoDrone 6 2K each
2 x GM-Nissan Doberman 6 3K each

That is a nice drone setup. Lots of tools, for lots of options.

[Sengir]

Which would imply that' it's expected a Sprite/Agent/AI/Pilot(For a different vehicle) cannot normally "Jump in", otherwise why pay BP for the ability to do so?

Maybe Machine Sprites have that quality built in, because their job is controlling drones.

As for using Command...well, how does a Sprite control a Roto-Drone then? Or anything else requiring a vehicle skill that can't be defaulted on? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
Having the Sprite replace the Pilot (and use the Autosofts from provided by its skill) is the most hassle-free way and also works fine with fluff. You just need to decide whether a Sprite shall be allowed to use normal Autosofts.


@Ascalaphus: As written above, my suggestion is the Doberman + Armour + White Knight LMG and the FlySpy with R6 sensors and various vision enhancements. Also interesting:
- That police drone from Arsenal
- RM Wolfspinne (German Arsenal, can be found in DK's character generator)
- Stormcloud (eye in the sky)
- Larger combat drones IMO do not make much sense, of course also depends on the style of your group

[Ascalaphus]

I'm just very interested in what other people consider to be useful drones, and why.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

I'm just very interested in what other people consider to be useful drones, and why.

Well...

Most of the drones my CyberLogician uses are there for Observational/Surveillance purposes.

FlySpys
Optic Xs
DragonFlys
Centipedes
Crawlers
Stormclouds

I use the following for Combat purposes

Rotodrones
Heimdalls
Dragonflys
LEBD-1s
Dalmations

There are also several I use from "This Old Drone," Mainly because they are fairly easy to come by, if a bit outdated.

Predators
Wanjida

Probbaly does not help a lot, but those are my choices.

[Yerameyahu]

Sengir, that's not really Machine Sprite's job, though. They're just the closest. As for controlling a roto-drone or any other with Command… it's all Command, all the time. That's already how it works for everyone: Command does everything, regardless of any circumstances. (Yeah, it's kinda stupid-good, except for that one 'all actions are Complex' drawback.) Having the vehicle skill is another source of DP, but it's the same as any Drone without a Maneuver autosoft.

[ggodo]

So, the consensus is Sprites Command via Command? That is their only method?

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

So, the consensus is Sprites Command via Command? That is their only method?

Well (IIRC), unless a Sprite is in a Resonance Realm Chillin', or on a Remote Task, it MUST be in the same node as the Technomancer. So yes.

[ggodo]

Awesome, glad that was hashed out.

[PoliteMan]

I personally love Ford LEBDs. Probably the ultimate multipurpose drone: it flies, it shoots, and it has a mechanical arm for non-combat stuff.

[longbowrocks]

I personally love Ford LEBDs. Probably the ultimate multipurpose drone: it flies, it shoots, and it has a mechanical arm for non-combat stuff.

And it doesn't just barely fly either. It actually has decent stats across the board.

[Sengir]

As for controlling a roto-drone or any other with Command… it's all Command, all the time. That's already how it works for everyone: Command does everything, regardless of any circumstances. (Yeah, it's kinda stupid-good, except for that one 'all actions are Complex' drawback.) Having the vehicle skill is another source of DP, but it's the same as any Drone without a Maneuver autosoft.

Programs replace attributes in the Matrix (SR4A, p.226: In Matrix tests, the attribute portion of the test is replaced with a program or Matrix attribute). So if you default on a skill, you default on the program rating instead - the typical script kiddie thing, I have no clue but a program to do the job. But if a skill can't be defaulted on, the greatest program becomes useless.

And unregistered Sprites CAN be sent on a remote task, it just costs all remaining owed services. Which doesn't really matter if the Sprite was only compiled to control that drone (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Faraday]

And it doesn't just barely fly either. It actually has decent stats across the board.

Make it look like an eyebot and I'm sold.

[Stahlseele]

That's what pimped out ride is there for, isn't it? O.o
Also, swarms of FlySpies with AntiTheft SafetyMeasures that can deal enough electrical stun damage attacks to power seattle for a week or so . .

[Sengir]

Make it look like an eyebot and I'm sold.

Me too, because the only problem I have with the LEBD is that it has a (rather large, judging by the illustration) rotor. Kinda sucks if you need it indoors, hence I prefer walking drones with Gecko Tips


Another idea I had was using a Blimp mounting an internal turret with a huge sniper rifle as remote-controlled "death from above". Problem is, the Stormcloud is too small and the Zeppelin too big, so you have to mod something. But a car on a blimp frame is not exactly inconspicuous...so I'm still waiting for something lighter than air and with a Body somewhere around 8...

[Falconer]

Programs replace attributes in the Matrix (SR4A, p.226: In Matrix tests, the attribute portion of the test is replaced with a program or Matrix attribute). So if you default on a skill, you default on the program rating instead - the typical script kiddie thing, I have no clue but a program to do the job. But if a skill can't be defaulted on, the greatest program becomes useless.

And unregistered Sprites CAN be sent on a remote task, it just costs all remaining owed services. Which doesn't really matter if the Sprite was only compiled to control that drone (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

And if I read the rules correctly... sprites are still limited by the response of the node they're in.

So compared to the normal low-cost pilot 3 program, you're not going to get a huge increase from a sprite unless you're spending the big bucks on response upgrade chips.

[Sengir]

Each sprite has a rating that is equivalent to the Pilot rating of an agent and determines its other Matrix attributes. A sprite’s Matrix attributes are independent of the attributes of any node in which it is running; it runs on other, inexplicable resources.
SR4A, p.240 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Falconer]

Thank you for pointing that out, I was trying to find that.

But still it doesn't address another potential problem I see. "equivalent to the pilot rating of an AGENT"

The sprite would not replace the pilot rating of the drone as best I can tell. It would simply run in the drones node in addition to the 'drone-specific' pilot program which replaces it's OS. Otherwise it would be akin to saying a sprite in a commlink replaces the OS and system... and you couldn't crash the node w/o crashing the sprite which doesn't make sense. Nowhere can I find anywhere that a sprite can use software/autosofts loaded into the drone. Only thing I'm sure of is it can use it's own complex forms.

To be viable for a combat drone though it strikes me at a minimum you'd need a rating 6 machine sprite (command CF, then two autosoft CF's). One manuever and another gunnery autosoft. Though the use of it's diagnostics power to someone actually rigging the drone and maybe even to the drones inherent pilot OS might be usefull.

I'm sounding this out to make sure I have the right of it....

[Udoshi]

I'm just very interested in what other people consider to be useful drones, and why.

I'm a fan of the Dragonfly. Sure, the weapons suck, but its a small easily concealable hoverdrone. In my last game, the team rather liked using Disguise skill to work it into clothing. Not because its a hidden weapon, but because our rigger had ones with good sensors.
Also, the dragonflies price makes MUCH more sense when you realize its description says it comes with Ultrasound, which cost a 1000Y (Since drone statblocks don't include sensor loadouts, the only place it can go is on its Camera, hence the huge price).

The Crimson Samurai is notably hilarious becuse its armor/body/speed ratio is such that it works with a Ram Plate out of the box, doing no damage it itself. Haven't used it in play, though.

Micro-tapper bugs from Arsenal, with some gecko tips are rather excellent for what they do. Paired with some Myomeric rope from the main book, fiberoptic cable, duct tape, and a microcamera you suddenly have a remote controllable snake cable. I would however, consider giving it a Toolkit via special machinery(like the mister fixit drone)

The LEBD-1 is excellent, though the Hawker-Siddley Mixcoatl from Milspectech deserves an honorable mention: Its like a rotodrone except better, and more expensive.

For whats its worth, during the finale of my last game, our team got a ton of use out of some heavily modified Dalmatians.(not doberman). Because they're flying urban police drones, we modified them to accept a pilot(rigger coccoon), chameleon coating and spoof chips, backed that up with some hacking to make sure they wouldn't be noticed, and used them to ferry the team around in plain sight. I mean, its just a drone going somewhere. There's no way a person could be inside, right?
The hard part was fitting the ejection seat inside.

[Yerameyahu]

I think people assume a person couldn't be inside because a person *can't* be inside them.

[longbowrocks]

I think people assume a person couldn't be inside because a person *can't* be inside them.

I don't understand. The dalmatian is not a minidrone or microdrone. It's a medium drone. The rigger cocoon is a standard mod, so it fits. A person goes in the rigger cocoon. What am I missing?

[Yerameyahu]

It's a Large drone, but it's a drone.

Large Drones (Body 4): These drones range from the size of a motorcycle to a small car. With the exception of medical drones, they are typically not designed to carry metahumans and lack passenger compartments, though a metahuman (other than a troll) could potentially ride on top of one or be carried by one.

It's a lightweight vec-thrust surveillance drone (it also costs freaking nothing), so there's even less reason to assume it could accomodate a passenger. Unless otherwise noted, drones don't carry passengers, and there's no reason to assume they'd have any internal space for them. At best, you're duct-taping a person to the bottom.

The rigger cocoon is an armored bag/seat that fits where a seat usually does; a replacement. It doesn't create a new seat from nothing.

[longbowrocks]

It's a Large drone, but it's a drone. It's a lightweight vec-thrust surveillance drone (it also costs freaking nothing), so there's even less reason to assume it could accomodate a passenger. Unless otherwise noted, drones don't carry passengers, and there's no reason to assume they'd have any internal space for them. At best, you're duct-taping a person to the bottom.

The rigger cocoon is an armored bag that fits where a seat usually does. It doesn't create a seat.

My bad, I was looking at the doberman.
As for seating:
"It consists
of a seat completely surrounded by fire-resistant ballistic cloth,
reinforced by metal plates to prevent someone from merely
sticking a sword through it, and including cushions and harnesses
to keep the rigger from rattling around."

I read this as adding a seat, since building it around a seat would create too many weak points.
If built into a vehicle, it would have to take out a seat. On a drone, I see it as looking like it does on a Tachikoma (Ghost in the Shell, not Shadowrun).

The quote on large drones mentions that they are typically not meant to have passengers, and this is the only thing I could think of that could create that implied exception. The exception is definitely intentionally implied, because the paragraph above that on medium drones says that "They are unable to carry
an adult metahuman".

The metal plates on the cocoon should give it enough structure to be riveted onto a drone. As for the question of weight, I dunno. I imagine a rigger cocoon might make up the difference between the weight of a normal metahuman, and a troll, which would be bad as per the example in your quote.

"Microdrones can only be equipped with microdrone modifications; minidrones can
only be equipped with microdrone and minidrone modifications;
all other drones and vehicles can only be equipped with
standard modifi cations"AR131
Just quoting this for the heck of it. I'm aware we're discussing whether the rigger cocoon is a specific exception.

[Yerameyahu]

You're right: *when* "built into a vehicle, it would have to take out a seat". It replaces it, or fills a large available empty space (like in a truck). It definitely doesn't mean 'create a new space inside a no-passenger drone for an armored seat'. You can't base your reasoning on 'the general rule doesn't say I can't'. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) That's called a loophole.

The bit I quoted clearly explained that a Large drone could *maybe* carry someone on top or as external cargo.

(While it's not a question of structure—we're talking about a seat already—, I understand the metal plates to be armor, not structure. If you're 'riveting' seat *onto* a drone, that's external; hardly a way to "ferry the team around in plain sight".)

Tachikomas are built from the ground up to have a passenger option. They have a large empty space, and moving parts to accomodate entry. Honestly, I'm fine with attaching a chair to the top of a drone (I'll bet it flies well that way, hehe). It's just the idea that you can magically fit a whole person (plus an armored chair) *inside* a drone that's a problem. Usually, people at least have the shame to specify that the loophole is only for pixies. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[longbowrocks]

You're right: *when* "built into a vehicle, it would have to take out a seat". It replaces it, or fills a large available empty space (like in a truck). It definitely doesn't mean 'create a new space inside a no-passenger drone for an armored seat'. You can't base your reasoning on 'the general rule doesn't say I can't'. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) That's called a loophole.

C'mon, a drone doesn't need all those useless things like energy sources, weapons, motors, logic circuits, and internal structural supports. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)
Seriously though, I was talking about adding the cocoon on, not putting it inside.
Not like it needs to be inside with 20 armor, 10 structure, and 5 bonus dice against crashing and loop-the-loops.

(While it's not a question of structure—we're talking about a seat already—, I understand the metal plates to be armor, not structure. If you're 'riveting' seat *onto* a drone, that's external; hardly a way to "ferry the team around in plain sight".)

Dang, I forgot he was trying to be unobtrusive.
As for the metal plates, I guess that would be right. When I originally saw rigger cocoons, I just skimmed over that and read it as a metal frame. On that last post, I interpreted the high structure and armor as rigidness. Oh well, you can still duct-tape it on. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Tachikomas are built from the ground up to have a passenger option. They have a large empty space, and moving parts to accomodate entry.

That's the sort of look I was talking about though. A big passenger compartment that doesn't fit in the body, but rather just stuck on the back.

Ah well. You guys win.

[Golgoth]

Just a quick reply on all this but... Why not have a Machine Sprite run Diagnostics on the drone that the TM is jumped in to? Unless you're hoping to have multiple drones do awesome things, then how about a couple of registered sprites run Diagnostics for the Pilot system of Drone X?