Evil NPC's (?), Who deserves a bullet? Options Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic Download this topic Subscribe to this forum Display Modes Switch to: Outline Standard Switch to: Linear+

[Stormdrake]

Am expanding on the metaplot for my game and am trying to remember some of the truly deserving amoungst Shadowruns evil(?) shadow dwellers. Richard Villiers comes to mind as does the cabal of vampires running around Europe (I forget what they are calling themselves). Can anyone suggest others?

[Ascalaphus]

Am expanding on the metaplot for my game and am trying to remember some of the truly deserving amoungst Shadowruns evil(?) shadow dwellers. Richard Villiers comes to mind as does the cabal of vampires running around Europe (I forget what they are calling themselves). Can anyone suggest others?

The vampires are the Ordo Maximus. I vaguely recall Augmentation mentioning they'd fallen on hard times due to GD intrigue though.

You should take a look at Threats and Threats II maybe?

[CanRay]

If we put a bullet into the head of every evil NPC that was in Shadowrun, we'd run out of ammo damned quick, and Ares stock would soar at purchasing new stock for what we're expected to need.

There's also the fact that a lot of the people you're talking about would only see a bullet to the head as an inconvenience.

Finally, as we found out, Richard Villiers isn't evil, he's just a Corporate Suit Extraordinaire. And a douchebag.

[hermit]

Can anyone suggest others?

- Puck
- Netcat
- Mr Cline
- Larry Zincan
- Buttercup
- Hestaby
- Ghostwalker
- Any and all AI
- Damien Knight
- Andrea Colloton
- everybody working at GENOM Corp. of Basels, middle management and up
- Alachia
- /dev/grrl

[CanRay]

Netcat, really? You'd cap a pregnant woman/new mother. Cold, Hermit, damned cold!

[Stormdrake]

I don't know about Hermit but as Rimmer once said "I would gladly shoot him in his sleep if I could".

Any one remember what the group of nuts who wanted to overthrow the UCAS and CAS governments and then declair war on the NAN nations was called?

[hermit]

Netcat, really? You'd cap a pregnant woman/new mother. Cold, Hermit, damned cold!

Moral decisions, anyone?

Also, she's certainly evil, pregnancy or not.

Any one remember what the group of nuts who wanted to overthrow the UCAS and CAS governments and then declair war on the NAN nations was called?

New Revolution. And they tried to overthrow the Sioux too. That's why Colloton is on my list, because she is among their leaders.

[BishopMcQ]

Out of curiousity, what put NetCat into the truly Evil, instead of part of the lesser forms of filth that make up most shadowrunners?

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

Moral decisions, anyone?

Also, she's certainly evil, pregnancy or not.

I wouldn't label her Evil. But possibly a pawn of something bigger.
Then again, I'm on Clockwork on this. All TM's should be put to the wall and gain a leaded kiss and the AI's should all be deleted as soon as possible.

Now, Kane is truly a son of a female dog...

[Wakshaani]

What's the beef with Villers? I'd have thought Damian Knight would be higher on people's lists than Vilers, who ... doesn't really get talked about all that much.

He was a third of Fuchi, pulled out to make his own corp, wound up crying as he had to sell off big chunks of it so he wasn't a full-on CEO like he wanted anymore, and, since then, has just, you know, done CEO things. He isn't launching kittens out of cannons or offering teenaged Orks ten grand if they'll undergo sterilization proceedures or the like.

Then again, I'm stunned to see Larry Zincan on somebody's list as well.

Can we get some specifics on why these people are loathed?

[Irion]

I neve got the impression that Netcat was meant to be evil.
On the other hand the "moral" compass of some fiction writers is "strange" to say the least.

[Adarael]

I'm also curious why "any and all AI" is "evil". Surely a suddenly awoken Pilot-origin program whose driving nature is to make Gridguide work better isn't evil.

Edit: I also question why the entirety of the New Revolution is "evil", or at least any more evil than anyone, anywhere, which has an ideology. Individual members and their actions notwithstanding, they do not seem particularly more evil than any other revolutionary group.

[CanRay]

Now, Kane is truly a son of a female dog...

You do realize he just changed the direction his blimp was headed and is going to "Discuss" things with you.

I expect a chair, ropes, a straight-razor, and "Stuck In The Middle With You".

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

I'm also curious why "any and all AI" is "evil". Surely a suddenly awoken Pilot-origin program whose driving nature is to make Gridguide work better isn't evil.

Edit: I also question why the entirety of the New Revolution is "evil", or at least any more evil than anyone, anywhere, which has an ideology. Individual members and their actions notwithstanding, they do not seem particularly more evil than any other revolutionary group.

Deus comes to mind. And that other AI who took over a military satelite with WMD, forget his name.
Now, you might say that th whole Deus crysis was put under the carpet but people talk and eventually it becomes a conspiracy theory with a LOT of thing that actually makes it believable.
Besides, Free Spirits have more chance to correlate with us than an Artificial Intelligence.

[Fatum]

In Shadowrun, the question is not "who deserves a bullet". It's "who doesn't?"

[hermit]

I wouldn't label her Evil. But possibly a pawn of something bigger.

She's the new Pax.

I'm also curious why "any and all AI" is "evil". Surely a suddenly awoken Pilot-origin program whose driving nature is to make Gridguide work better isn't evil.

Since the Singularity is effectively the final occurrence in Neuromancer, where Neuromute explodes because it downloads an .exe from alpha Centauri, runs it and explodes, all the small AI are shards of Deus. So yes, an awakening pilot program effectively is a pilot program that is controlled by a part of Deus. That makes them evil. All of them.

Now, you might say that th whole Deus crysis was put under the carpet but people talk

And write school research papers about it. So much for swept under the carpet.

I also question why the entirety of the New Revolution is "evil", or at least any more evil than anyone, anywhere, which has an ideology. Individual members and their actions notwithstanding, they do not seem particularly more evil than any other revolutionary group.

By general convention in estern culture, fascism is more evil than other evil ideologies.

[Irion]

@Brazilian_Shinobi

Now, you might say that th whole Deus crysis was put under the carpet but people talk and eventually it becomes a conspiracy theory with a LOT of thing that actually makes it believable.

Thats like saying it would have been possible for the US to talk 9 11 down. You can't do shit like that today. To the beginning of the centurie yes. No problem.
But with sellphones with video?
And now imagine a World where a lot of people got this shit in their brain/eyes.

[Fatum]

She's the new Pax.

Far as I remember, Pax is a Deus otaku, a double traitor, and a dissonant.
Netcat is none of those, is she?

Since the Singularity is effectively the final occurrence in Neuromancer, where Neuromute explodes because it downloads an .exe from alpha Centauri, runs it and explodes, all the small AI are shards of Deus. So yes, an awakening pilot program effectively is a pilot program that is controlled by a part of Deus. That makes them evil. All of them.

Uh, any source on current-gen AIs having anything to do with the Great AIs, except for speculation? Besides, why Deus, of the trinity?

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

@Brazilian_Shinobi

Thats like saying it would have been possible for the US to talk 9 11 down. You can't do shit like that today. To the beginning of the centurie yes. No problem.
But with sellphones with video?
And now imagine a World where a lot of people got this shit in their brain/eyes.

The Renraku Arcoloy was closed for what, almost two years? There wasn't the wireless matrix yet. So, you had to jack in somewhere and try to contact the outside world. I'm pretty sure Deus was monitoring all the possible ways of comunicating with the outside world, if not closing every single possibility from the start.

Also, 9/11 was in the open for anyone to see. We are talking about a building the size of a small neighborhood who locked out from the outside. People didn't know what happened until UCAS sent the Army to liberate it. And yes, it was said from the beggining that the truth never came out. /dev/ grrl write a school paper about it just gets me irritated, so forgive me if I try to forget that EVERY time it is mentioned.

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

Far as I remember, Pax is a Deus otaku, a double traitor, and a dissonant.
Netcat is none of those, is she?

She was her friend.

[hermit]

Far as I remember, Pax is a Deus otaku, a double traitor, and a dissonant.
Netcat is none of those, is she?

Pax started out as an Otaku who willingly joined with Deus. She became dissonant when she started fading, and became a double traitor at the same time. Netcat serves the Deus Pragon and is "inhuman and alien" in her thoghts according to the description of the character in the shadowtalkers list. Do the math.

Uh, any source on current-gen AIs having anything to do with the Great AIs, except for speculation? Besides, why Deus, of the trinity?

Deus won the about compiling over Megaera. And there were hints about *something* entering programs and awakening them. Also, Deus now is a Paragon.

The Renraku Arcoloy was closed for what, almost two years? There wasn't the wireless matrix yet.

Wireless Matrix existed since 2059 (Matrix sourcebook). AR wasn'T there yet. Copious cellphones have been with the setting ever since the first rulebook.

Also, 9/11 was in the open for anyone to see. We are talking about a building the size of a small neighborhood who locked out from the outside.

Uhm, it's a building 1 km high and around 1 km at each side of the base. It's like the Burj Chalifa covering half of outhern Manhattan. That's not small. You could put several WTC towers into that building.

/dev/ grrl write a school paper about it just gets me irritated, so forgive me if I try to forget that EVERY time it is mentioned.

Totally pisses me off too, but .... there were TV shows about the matter, there was a reality show in the Arcology (must've been like Aperture Science TV), there were numerous references to it pre-SR4, and even with Emergence's clusterfuck of a retcon there's the monument to the victims. I truly hate to say it, but the /dev/brat bit makes more sense than the it's all seekrit part.

[Sengir]

I neve got the impression that Netcat was meant to be evil.

Guide to understanding Hermit:
1.) Pick arbitrary set of characters- TMs, Ghouls, non-awakened non-emerged humans with average stats, you name it
2.) Interpret each and every line of rules text for your chosen set in the most broken and munchkin-ish way possible
3.) Interpret each and every line of fluff text for your chosen set in a way which makes them seem like Hitlers evil twin. All of them, and just for the heck of it
4.) Complain that the rules are broken and the characters so evil that they should be put down on sight
4.1) Any other interpretation of the rules means that the writer has no clue or is a shill for CGL

PS:

Netcat serves the Deus Pragon

Eh, Prime Runners is out already? Together with Unwired Anniversary Ed., which introduced a new paragon? Good to know...

[hermit]

Guide to understanding Hermit:
1.) Pick arbitrary set of characters- TMs, Ghouls, non-awakened non-emerged humans with average stats, you name it
2.) Interpret each and every line of rules text for your chosen set in the most broken and munchkin-ish way possible
3.) Interpret each and every line of fluff text for your chosen set in a way which makes them seem like Hitlers evil twin. All of them, and just for the heck of it
4.) Complain that the rules are broken and the characters so evil that they should be put down on sight
4.1) Any other interpretation of the rules means that the writer has no clue or is a shill for CGL

Guide to understanding Sengir:
1) watch him troll you.
2) report post.

Eh, Prime Runners is out already? Together with Unwired Anniversary Ed., which introduced a new paragon? Good to know...

Well, find out what Deus' Icon in the Matrix is, and then compare to the existing Paragons. Be surprised ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Fatum]

Pax started out as an Otaku who willingly joined with Deus. She became dissonant when she started fading, and became a double traitor at the same time. Netcat serves the Deus Pragon and is "inhuman and alien" in her thoghts according to the description of the character in the shadowtalkers list. Do the math.

I beg your pardon, where can I find info on that "Deus paragon"?

Deus won the about compiling over Megaera. And there were hints about *something* entering programs and awakening them.

He never did. Neither was he able to defeat Mirage. The whole thing went down the drain when the three were still in the middle of the fight.
So, it could be Mirage, for all I can tell. I like Mirage.

[Seriphen]

In Shadowrun, the question is not "who deserves a bullet". It's "who doesn't?"

When reading the OP, this is the first thought I had. If you look hard enough at any of the characters in Shadowrun its starts to appear this way. It depends on what viewpoint you want to take on their actions. One man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.