Motorcycle as a bludgeoning weapon, Troll with a bike Options

[Mr. Smileys]

I have a player who is building a high strength Troll who specializes in motorcycles. (he plans to run people over with them and also pick up the bike and hit people with it) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/spin.gif)

What kind of damage would your average motorcycle in SR do as a club/exotic weapon?
Are there any preset rules in SR for running someone over with a vehicle? If so can you give me a page number? If not what kind of damage do you think it would do?

Edit: He also plans on making the bike a rating 4 weapon focus (he has the restricted gear quality)

[Makki]

-There "are" the ramming rules in the vehicle combat chapter. They are ridiculous. Talk to your player to modify them appropriately.
-a bike is not more than a large blunt metal bat I guess. So range 2, maybe 3. DV +0/+1. definitely a negative modifier for unwieldyness as proposed in Arsenal under improvised weapons.

[Mr. Smileys]

-a bike is not more than a large blunt metal bat I guess. So range 2, maybe 3. DV +0/+1. definitely a negative modifier for unwieldyness as proposed in Arsenal under improvised weapons.

What if said bike also has spikes? (Pimped Ride lvl2)

[Yerameyahu]

It's definitely Improvised or Exotic (and you'd need to do some convincing for Exotic; typically, they're real weapons that are simply rare). Use the rules for Metahuman Body, perhaps (P damage).

Pimped Ride cannot alter the mechanical effects (crunch) of the vehicle.

If you do use ramming: ramming is a vehicle skill action, and the weapon focus wouldn't count. Questions about dual-natured ramming will be answered in an upcoming sourcebook. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[eyeBliss]

I just don't see a motorcycle as a viable (melee) weapon. Even a troll pushing the boundaries of what meta-humanity is capable of (20+ str) can barely pick up a combat bike without a check. I imagine a bike capable of carrying a 10+ body troll is going to weight in at 600+ lbs. It's just not possible to swing something that you an barely pick up. However, if you're going to go the more fanciful route and allow it, make sure that other toons with outrageous attributes/dice pools are capable of pulling off crazy feats of agility, intellect, etc.

[BishopMcQ]

If you modded the motorcycle to have 360-degree rotation in the handlebars, the way BMX bikes do, I could see a trick for slamming the front brakes and spinning the back to hit someone with it. Sufficient speed immediately stopped would bring the tail whipping around rather quickly. This goes to the vehicle skill, rather than any kind of unarmed.

Depending on front wheel traction, you may be able to spin the bike just on the wheel rather than modifying it, but I would imagine that's going to be much more stressful on the frame.

[The Jopp]

I just don't see a motorcycle as a viable (melee) weapon. Even a troll pushing the boundaries of what meta-humanity is capable of (20+ str) can barely pick up a combat bike without a check.

Im not so sure about that.

3 meters tall and packed with muscle should have no problem whatsoever picking up the monocycle (Cyclops) as it is a wheel with a built in electric engine and handlebars.
A -2 modifier for being unwieldly and hard to control as centrifugal force might take over once he starts swinging (the bike is as you say, heavy, but not that hard to lift - swinging it might make it a bit harder to hold on)

[eyeBliss]

Im not so sure about that.

3 meters tall and packed with muscle should have no problem whatsoever picking up the monocycle (Cyclops) as it is a wheel with a built in electric engine and handlebars.
A -2 modifier for being unwieldly and hard to control as centrifugal force might take over once he starts swinging (the bike is as you say, heavy, but not that hard to lift - swinging it might make it a bit harder to hold on)

Hehe, I suppose. But I don't see the cyclops offering much in the way of ramming practicality due to it's low body and armor. Given how ridiculous a troll is going to look on that thing, he'll at least have plenty of opportunities for bludgeoning. I made the following bumper sticker for a friend and unicycle enthusiast after watching an entertaining Demitri Martin sketch, I think it applies here:

Four wheels moves the body
Two wheels move the soul
One wheel moves a guy who's never getting laid

[Udoshi]

If you do use ramming: ramming is a vehicle skill action, and the weapon focus wouldn't count. Questions about dual-natured ramming will be answered in an upcoming sourcebook. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

It does, actually. Ramming is treated like a melee attack. So the weapon focus does work for this purpose.

As does energy aura, if you ever needed to ram people with a flaming bike.

[Makki]

As does energy aura, if you ever needed to ram people with a flaming bike.

Would you ever wanna NOT do that?

[Yerameyahu]

'Treated as' doesn't mean you can use a weapon focus. Honestly, I don't even understand that statement in the rules, because ramming clearly isn't treated as a melee attack. It's treated as a ramming attack, using the DPs laid out under Ramming. It's not like you can Parry it, after all.

[Squinky]

Charlie Sheen can parry it.

[Manunancy]

Considering the weight and size of a motorcycle, it would be even worse than unwieldy - the only somewhat plausible way to use it as a weapon would be to lift it above your head then slam it down on someone's head.

To get a comparison, a caber (the tree trunk used in the scottish tossing game of the same name) is about 80kg. Which should come close to the thrower's body weight, just like the motorcycle would be compared with the troll (keep in mind it's a reinforced, troll-sized bike, not some japanese crotch rocket built as light as possible - and even those ofthen weights above 100 kg when built to human proportions...)

Another comparison would be a sledgehammer - the heaviest one weight up to 10 kg (20+ lbs) - between 10 and 15 percents of the user's body weight - and using them already takes a full-body motion to handle.

[Dahrken]

Lifting it off the ground and slamming it on something static or throwing it a few meters away in the general direction of enemies is probably possible, but I won't call that using it in melee. I'd allow taking a (Motorcycle) specialisation on Throwing, but not on Blunt Weapons. Based on RL bikes, I'd say a Troll-dapted, armored bike with a decent Body would weight at least 200 kg and probably more. It's simply too heavy to be used as an effective melee weapon, even by a 300 kg troll strong enough to carry it.

Think about it another way : the heaviest sledgehammers weights about 10 kg - and that's probably too heavy for a weapon, the maul as a melee weapon is IIRC more in the 5 kg range or even less. Extrapolating from that and a 80 kg human, this would make it about 40 kg for a 320 kg troll, far lighter than any motorbike large enough to carry a troll and sturdy enough to survive ramming.

[Badmoodguy88]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/L75uH.png[/img]

From out of a sunset the color of blood a distant shape appears on on the horizon and quickly gets larger. Gang members lay in ambush at the rendezvous. They watch as the mammoth shape approaching resolves itself a troll straddling an enormous spiked motorcycle, nearly as oversized as its rider.

They grin at each other from the shadows as he stops and gets of the bike. Just a little closer. Anticipation turns to hesitation. The troll picks up the bike by heavy grips welded to the frame.

"What the?!"

Oversized blades of a circular saw jut out from concealment in the back wheel! The troll advances in hast! BzZZZz't BzzZZZZZZZZZzzz't!

[[Sorry I did the math and I am afraid you must allow it because of the rule of cool... The numbers are all right there...]]

[The Jopp]

The rule of cool also allows you do add spikes to the Cyclops and a large chain.

Ball and Chain Spiked Bike
Reach: 2
Hand Requirement: 2
Min STR: Bike BOD X2
Dicepool Modifier: -2D6
Skill: Exotic Melee Weapon

[Makki]

i'm not sure a -2 modifier is enough. A Chainsaw already has a -2 due to it's unwieldyness. A bike might be worse I guess, then again I never attacked anyone with either of those, so I have no RL experience on this topic.

[KarmaInferno]

I am reminded of the scene in The One where bad Jet Li crushes a cop by picking up two motorcycles by their front forks, one in each hand, and slamming them together.




-k

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

I am reminded of the scene in The One where bad Jet Li crushes a cop by picking up two motorcycles by their front forks, one in each hand, and slamming them together.

-k

A very bad movie... But with a few cool scenes in it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

[Summerstorm]

Not that bad... i rather liked it.

To the motorcycle: Yeah -2 is WAY too low for handling something like that. And the needed strength would be MONSTROUS. (Double Bod of the vehicle seems about right, like Jopp said). We all know the carrying rules are whacky, so i ignore those.

And the impact damage... Hard to say, maybe: Attack DP=-6, Damage: Str/2+Bod Stun, half impact? So yeah, not very effective (In proportion to the needed strength and skill). Attacking with something so huge and unwieldy is more of a show of strength and intimidation attempt. That said: i do like the style *g* But i would go more the way of the rocket-hammer or a 200kg steel-bar with handles or something.