[X] My Assistant

[Yerameyahu]

That'd be fine, except you're not affecting the sensor. You're affecting the drone. Is the argument, anyway. I don't care, because it doesn't really affect the game.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

That'd be fine, except you're not affecting the sensor. You're affecting the drone. Is the argument, anyway. I don't care, because it doesn't really affect the game.

No need to go back into the aruments again... It never gets solved. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[KarmaInferno]

I have a tendency as a player to build assuming the most conservative interpretation in mind.

So, if I have a character that is likely to be throwing spells at drones, I'll build him with enough dice pool to compensate for a 5-6 Threshold.*

So if I'm wrong in how the rule will be interpreted, I'm going to be at worst pleasantly surprised.





-k

* - This also has a nice side effect of being really useful against stuff that doesn't have a threshold. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[longbowrocks]

radar is a sensor
improved invisibility works against sensors.

Radar uses sound. Improved Invisibility bends light.

[Rubic]

Radar uses sound. Improved Invisibility bends light.

Radar uses radio waves (electro-magnetic). Sonar uses sound. And sharks use frickin' laser beams!

[longbowrocks]

And what's wrong with Levitate-ing them into the ceiling? If they're moving fast enough already, won't that be a crash test? Seems to me that most drone enemies can be defeated with proper application of the Levitate spell in combination with crash damage or fall damage (though it's all crash damage if you look at it the right way).

I appreciate the faith in crash tests, but the drone would need to be moving at supersonic speed to die from one crash test. For example, a medium drone would need to move in excess of 200 meters per second (600 meters per turn) to score 12 DV on that test. This results in a reasonable chance of one-hitting it. For certainty, you would need it to move at 2000 meters per turn (about double the speed of sound).

[longbowrocks]

Radar uses radio waves (electro-magnetic). Sonar uses sound. And sharks use frickin' laser beams!

Derp. Got me. Luckily there's still ultrasound (Somewhere).

[Rubic]

Derp. Got me.

easy enough mistake to make; they work off similar principles, and it's not as if nobody's countered anything I've brought up in forums. Oversights are the work of the devil, and friends distracting you, and lack of sleep, and poor reading comprehension... and stuff...

[CanRay]

And tinfoil can be used to foil both of them. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Headshot_Joe]

I appreciate the faith in crash tests, but the drone would need to be moving at supersonic speed to die from one crash test. For example, a medium drone would need to move in excess of 200 meters per second (600 meters per turn) to score 12 DV on that test. This results in a reasonable chance of one-hitting it. For certainty, you would need it to move at 2000 meters per turn (about double the speed of sound).

So you just have to Levitate them really, really fast.

[Mayhem_2006]

Radar uses radio waves (electro-magnetic).

Which is just another frequency of light.

[Fikealox]

I'm no scientist, but I think it might be more correct to say that both light and radio waves are electromagnetic energy, differentiated by frequency. In any case, radio waves are not part of the visible spectrum (as understood in a post-metahuman world), and are therefore not affected by Invisibility. 'Invisibility makes the subject more difficult to detect by normal visible senses (including low-light, thermographic, and other senses that rely on the visible spectrum).'

[Aerospider]

So you just have to Levitate them really, really fast.

Which, for 600 metres per turn, would require something like Force and net hits to be in the mid-twenties!

Two things I now notice about Levitate - it doesn't seem to use OR where one would assume it should and there is an opposed test for (unwilling) living targets which means a drone gets no opposing roll. Oh how I hate this spell.

[longbowrocks]

Which is just another frequency of light.

Which was his point. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Udoshi]

Radar uses radio waves (electro-magnetic). Sonar uses sound. And sharks use frickin' laser beams!

And this is why the BEST thing you can do for your Imp Invis spells is Street Magic Spell Design it to Multi-Sense.
Problem solved.

Also, the humble Ice Sheet spell forces crash tests and doesn't need to bother with object resistance. Drones don't tend to have the best dice pools for that. And a rigger can only rig one at a time.

[KarmaInferno]

Drones don't tend to have the best dice pools for that.

Pilot 6 + Maneuver 4 + Tacnet 3 + Fuzzy Logic 2 = 15 dice to crash test.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotate.gif)




-k

[Headshot_Joe]

Which, for 600 metres per turn, would require something like Force and net hits to be in the mid-twenties!

I didn't say you wouldn't have to be a dragon...

[Hound]

Also, the humble Ice Sheet spell forces crash tests and doesn't need to bother with object resistance. D

doesn't ice sheet only work on a surface? How would this help against a rotordrone? (the OP's example.)

[Udoshi]

Pilot 6 + Maneuver 4 + Tacnet 3 + Fuzzy Logic 2 = 15 dice to crash test.

A pilot isn't going to get the fuzzy logic, because it likely won't have a readied action to make use of it. Fuzzy logic isn't free dice, remember? It takes actions to power.

For comparison, the starting limit on pilot is 4 - thats availability 12. A maneuver autosoft only goes up to rating 4, but most drones only come with a pilot of 3.
So that is 6-10 dice before a tacnet.
If they don't have a maneuverability autosoft, they can't make the test.

Thats a pretty crappy dice pool to be betting against the hits of a decent mage's spellcasting pool. And, unlike a drone, the mage has edge.

doesn't ice sheet only work on a surface? How would this help against a rotordrone? (the OP's example.)

The ice can be created over an area - it doesn't have to be a a flat surface, only within the area of effect(Force in Meters, per Area Spell). Presumably, you could use it to ice up gunports, sensors, moving parts. Not sure how that applies to a rotodrone, specifically, within the rules, but aircraft icing is a pretty standard weather obstacle for airlines, isn't it?

[LurkerOutThere]

Ice sheet creates an ice sheet on a surface, it is not ice object.

[PoliteMan]

Let me back this up a bit,

You're having a hard time dealing with drones. That's good, mages are supposed to have a hard time with drones. Mages have a ton of advantages but if there's one thing mages should have a problem dealing with, it's highly technological remote controlled robots. You can't win at everything and drones are (and should be IMO) one of those things.

What should you do? Ask the hacker to help you out, he should be able to shred their firewall and take control. Your hacker is probably really good at that. Call your Street Sam friend with the big gun. He should be shooting something big enough to wreck their armor without too much trouble. He's probably really good at shooting big guns.

So use some teamwork. When you get attacked by drones, call your teammates to help you out. Then when you have to fight spirits or mages, things you're good at, your friends will need you to help them.

[Psikerlord]

this is why I was thinking of researching my "crusher" spell ... to try and take care of drones. It's the clout spell but physical damage, ie an indirect combat spell that causes physical damage, single target, but without the extra drain you get from an elemental effect ... drain being F/2+1. Should be a pretty good drone killer, in the scheme of things... Course summoning a bad ass spirit works too! I also agree with PM above however that mages should have trouble with drones.

[Elfenlied]

Well, they do still have problems. All of the spell and spirit summoning solutions advocate F6+ vs lowly, non-milspec rotodrones (I guess Ford LEBD?), which is like smacking a fly with a rocket launcher.

[StevenAngier]

Radar uses sound. Improved Invisibility bends light.

nope. This physics bogus with Imp. Invisibility bending light is gone. It just affects nonliving objects in addition to living objects. No Predator stealth mode.
And I appreciate the Crush spell (even for simplicities sake I dubbed it "Improved Clout" for my character).

[Irion]

Mhm, kind of tricky since there is no spirit with the combination of elemental aura and natural weapon. Making it hard for spirits to hurt drones.
You could go with elemental attack. Or augment the spirit with an elemental aura(spell).
Or just go with the electric elemental aura and hope for a lucky roll.