A Quick Question on Armor and Cyberlimbs Options

[Volt875]

Hey all was just wondering,

Does the armor enhancement that can be put on cyberlimbs stack with worn armor or is it only for if some one does a called shot to that limb?

If it does stack where does it say it in the book? Been looking but can't find it.

[Whipstitch]

In the SR4A book the page you're looking for is 344, under Cyberlimb Enhancements.

[KarmaInferno]

SR4A Page 344:

"Armor enhancements installed on cyberlimbs are both Ballistic and Impact, and it is cumulative with all forms of worn armor."

Note that "Armor" is not an Attribute, so by strict rules interpretation does not undergo the Attribute averaging rules.




-k

[Volt875]

I take it SR4A is the anniversary edition right? I have just the regular Shadowrun 4th ed book.

On a side not were they're alot of changes in the SR4A from the standard?

[TheOOB]

Here is the main stuff

http://www.shadowrun4.com/wp-content/uploa...R4A_changes.pdf

[Dakka Dakka]

I take it SR4A is the anniversary edition right? I have just the regular Shadowrun 4th ed book.

While there is no explicit mention of stacking in SR4, encumbrance and non-stacking only applies to worn armor. Cyberlimb armor is not worn.

Be careful with the Change document, it is incomplete, and in some places out of date or wrong.

[Blade]

You just have to be careful with that: it can lead to characters with 20+ armor naked or characters who get cyberfeet just to get some armor points...

[Minimax le Rouge]

cyberlimb armor, cyberware/bioware armors are cumulative to worn armor, with no encumbrance.
It can lead to very unbalanced characters indeed.

[Psikerlord]

lot of folks houserule cyberlimb armour, just for this reason

[Dakka Dakka]

There are several discussions about this already.

[Hida Tsuzua]

While it greatly makes people tougher overall, it does give mundanes something over magical characters. Magical characters can get cyberware too, but it's far more pricey for them. It costs a magical character 1 point of magic whereas 1 essence is a small price to pay for a mundane for a full set of cyberhands and cyberfeet with armor 2 or bulky versions with armor 3 for +8-12 armor. Self-possessing mages make out like bandits, but that's almost always going to be the case.

Overall, my issue with this isn't that mundanes get more armor. SnS becomes way more valuable but SnS was already your bullet of choice. My biggest issue is that it makes all the cool defensive cyberware and bioware worthless compared to coming down with a case of cyberleperosy. A set of houserules I'll like to use is to make cyberlimb armor only apply for that location for partial limbs and for the whole body for full cyberlimbs. Then make the defense bonus of defensive ware twice or maybe three times as good. For example, orthoskin gives you +2-+3 armor per rating rather than just +1.

[Aku]

I think the only cyper part that should give full value to over all armor is the torso, as thats where any good shooter would be aiming for anyways

[Medicineman]

....oO(please ,not another Hit Location Discussion)

with a silent Dance
Medicineman

[KarmaInferno]

I think the only cyper part that should give full value to over all armor is the torso, as thats where any good shooter would be aiming for anyways

Which would make sense if Shadowrun wasn't an abstracted system.

An armored limb does in fact increase your overall ability to soak damage.

Now, I would personally discount armor for the torso or perhaps limit the amount that can be applied to limbs, as a house rule, to represent the greater soak effect of armoring the torso as opposed to a limb.




-k

[Aku]

Which would make sense if Shadowrun wasn't an abstracted system.

An armored limb does in fact increase your overall ability to soak damage.

Now, I would personally discount armor for the torso or perhaps limit the amount that can be applied to limbs, as a house rule, to represent the greater soak effect of armoring the torso as opposed to a limb.




-k

Well, u can still abstract it by giving only a portion to total armor

[Dakka Dakka]

Well, u can still abstract it by giving only a portion to total armor

this is not an abstraction, you just make the armor less good than it should be.

[Aku]

u really think 5 points of armor on your hands and feet that cybermagically protect your whole body is a "good" thing?

[Dakka Dakka]

u really think 5 points of armor on your hands and feet that cybermagically protect your whole body is a "good" thing?

Armor only goes up to 4 and some limbs don't have enough capacity for that. partial limbs have less capacity to begin with. If you load up on armor you have no capacity for more important stuff.

[Mardrax]

u really think 5 points of armor on your hands and feet that cybermagically protect your whole body is a "good" thing?

You just watch my cybered up sam with vastly superhuman Reaction kick all those bullets with his armored feet.

And yes. Anyone who's silly enough to max out armor on his limbs, instead of getting Attributes of awesome, I can only laud. Right before watching them go down to stun damage.

[Hida Tsuzua]

You just watch my cybered up sam with vastly superhuman Reaction kick all those bullets with his armored feet.

And yes. Anyone who's silly enough to max out armor on his limbs, instead of getting Attributes of awesome, I can only laud. Right before watching them go down to stun damage.

With full limbs, you can easily get both. With hands and feet, you don't really get anything for high attributes (unless your GM rules that way). Customization isn't that expensive either. This is also disregarding the bulky mod that gives you 2 or 4 extra capacity for a modest fee.

[Sengir]

You just have to be careful with that: it can lead to characters with 20+ armor naked or characters who get cyberfeet just to get some armor points...

Only one person should be careful with that, and that is any player even thinking about bringing this to a sane table (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Aaron]

I think the only cyper part that should give full value to over all armor is the torso, as thats where any good shooter would be aiming for anyways

So what do you think about helmets?

[Aku]

Since helmets are generally only a +1, and since (in fake life simulations aka video games) I've gotten head shots while aiming for the torso and the fact that the hear head is significantly more important to the over all function than a cyber toe, i'm fine with them.

[KarmaInferno]

A lot of GMs don't count armor on partial limbs, unless perhaps someone is specifically aiming at that limb.






-k

[Medicineman]

So what do you think about helmets?

or PSP Shin / Lower Arm Protectors ?

Since helmets are generally only a +1,....

some are +2 and combined with a Facemask they can be +2/+3

with a protected Dance
Medicineman