Anthroforms and Armor Options Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic Download this topic Subscribe to this forum Display Modes Switch to: Outline Standard Switch to: Linear+

[ShadowWalker]

If you have an Anthroform drone. One that is metatype shaped and sized. Would it be possible to put standard clothing, armoured clothing, security armour, etc on it?

[Yerameyahu]

Why would you ask? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

The basic answer is yes, of course. Bleh.

[Squinky]

Yeah.

And you will want it, since it is easier to to heal a person than repair a drone.

[ShadowWalker]

Figured this was the case, but the rules say nothing as far as I can see. Just trying to outfit an AI using an anthroform drone as it's home. Basically an Android.

[Yerameyahu]

The rules seem to get a little messy, though. Vehicles can't 'wear' (benefit from) personal armor; you can't duct tape a flak jacket to any vehicle, drone, whatever, and have it *do* anything. There's no real reason to expect the personal armor that your anthroform totally *can* wear to provide any *protection*.

So, the answer to your question was 'yes', but you asked the wrong question. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Miri]

The rules seem to get a little messy, though. Vehicles can't 'wear' (benefit from) personal armor; you can't duct tape a flak jacket to any vehicle, drone, whatever, and have it *do* anything. There's no real reason to expect the personal armor that your anthroform totally *can* wear to provide any *protection*.

So, the answer to your question was 'yes', but you asked the wrong question. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Because of the layered armor rules sure, I can hang with that. What if you don't have any vehicle armor on the anthroform?

[Yerameyahu]

It's still a vehicle, so it has to use vehicle rules. *shrug*

I'm not saying this is the best way to deal with the vehicle/person crossover; I'm saying that the rules *don't* effectively deal with that issue. A proper house rule would explicitly address it, while somehow dealing with balance. Eclipse Phase, for example, has something attempting (attempting) to address this problem.

[ShadowWalker]

Because of the layered armor rules sure, I can hang with that. What if you don't have any vehicle armor on the anthroform?

Where do you find the layered armor rules?

[Miri]

Where do you find the layered armor rules?

Page 161 4A. Armor and Encumbrance.

[Yerameyahu]

Not that they apply to vehicles or vehicle armor.

[ShadowWalker]

Page 161 4A. Armor and Encumbrance.

That says only the highest value applies. If you use vehicle rules for armor encumbrance. Armor above the body decreases acceleration and speed by 20%.
So having any kind of armor on a Manservant over 3 would decrease the acceleration and speed by 20% or from a 5/15 to a 4/12.

How the heck would you work in cyberlimb armor?

[Yerameyahu]

Cyber armor directly stacks (with personal armor), and counts for total encumbrance.

Cyberlimb armor on a vehicle is never-intended insanity. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[ShadowWalker]

Cyber armor directly stacks (with personal armor), and counts for total encumbrance.

Cyberlimb armor on a vehicle is never-intended insanity. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Mechanical arm does say:

At the gamemaster’s discretion, full arms can be tricked out with accessories just like a full cyberlimb (see pp. 335–337, SR4, and pp. 44–48, Augmentation). The gamemaster has final say over what accessories a mechanical arm can take.

So although it's GM says yes/no, it is still implied as being possible if the GM says yes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Still trying to figure out how much armor to put on a manservant. 3 or more.

Is there anyway to increase the body of a drone?

[Yerameyahu]

If you do allow limb armor, it's still encumbering the drone. Take the hit for each point.

No.

[Squinky]

There was a post about a structural integrity upgrade that allowed body upgrades. It's not official though. Pretty much you are stuck with whatever body you start with. Perhaps cyberlimb body upgrades would help, but not for more vehicle upgrade slots. If you are going with a motorcycle go-bot thing, you can always add a sidecar (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

The Otomo states that it can wear and use most equipment made for normal folk. If you are "modding" a manservant or something else into something similar, I see this a good reinforcement to the idea that man like robots can use armor.

Me, I would go with vehicle armor. If it were an Otomo I would stop at 6, anything past that lowers its speed to "Robo-Cop" levels. It will make most low level threats less likely to ding you up, but not become overpowering and piss off the GM. I wouldn't stack it with cyber-limb armor, my view is that cyberlimb upgrades can be used, but if it is in the vehicle rules you should go that route first.

I've weirdly been statting out a AI that runs around in an Otomo lately, and it does take a lot of research to find the right ways to roll for tests. Good luck.

[Udoshi]

So, the answer to your question was 'yes', but you asked the wrong question. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

What you should be asking is "how many hits on Disguise do i need?"

[Dakka Dakka]

Cyber armor directly stacks (with personal armor), and counts for total encumbrance.

Nope. Cyberlimb armor directly stacks and does not count for encumbrance because it is not worn armor. Encumbrance only applies to worn armor.

[Yerameyahu]

Nope. Because that's awful, and the rules don't actually say it anyway. Given an ambiguity (what FAQ?), I'll take the less broken version.

[Dakka Dakka]

Even though the FAQ seems to be right on this particular rule for a change I was not talking about it. P. 161 of SR4A only talks about worn armor. Cyberlimb Armor is not worn, as you cannot don and doff it. It is installed into the limb. So unless you show me a rule saying cyberlimb armor does count for encumbrance by RAW it doe not. It also stacks for the same reason.

[Yerameyahu]

I don't see why that particular line applies only to worn armor. The first paragraph does, the second might not. Again: if ambiguous, choose the option that's not stupid.

[Dakka Dakka]

What's stupid about a limb that is designed to carry that much armor not encumbering the user? Using cyberlimb mods on a drones full mechanical arms however is only at the GMs pleasure anyways so there you can do whatever you want without creating houserules.

Even going with the weird idea that sentence one applies only to worn armor, sentence two doesn't and the last sentence again is restricted to worn armor only. How do you calculate the encumbrance for the ensemble of cyberlimb and worn armor? Cyberlimb armor is an armor item but not worn. So you do not add it to any worn armor items by RAW.

BTW this ruling would also mean that Mystic Armor (Adept Power) and the Armor Spell encumber the recipient as well. Is that the intention?

[Yerameyahu]

No, the magic ones are specific exceptions; they're not physical.

I'm willing to say that you're wearing a limb, so that's not a problem. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) 'Worn armor' is not my distinction in the first place. I'm not saying the rules for various armor are good, but I didn't write them, and I'd rather avoid a problem than "what does 'is' mean"-lawyer the RAW. As long as we're stuck with crazy cyber armor, we have to deal with its awfulness.

Yes, if we assume the GM will never say 'ok', then this vehicle-arm problem doesn't exist. I think we know we can't assume that.

[Modular Man]

May every group/GM rule that as they/She/he sees fit.
Personally, I'd rather say that an athromorphic drone cannot wear armour on top of maxed vehicle armor... not from my view of the rules, but rather from a point of game balance. You could also apply that "A drone may carry three times its body as armor" to worn armor as well.

[Dakka Dakka]

Yes, if we assume the GM will never say 'ok', then this vehicle-arm problem doesn't exist. I think we know we can't assume that.

But I think we can assume that any GM allowing cyberlimb armor in vehicles will know about the "problem" and will adjust accordingly. BTW it is only a maximum of 8 Armor. and there are other things that might be more interesting to put in a cyberlimb on a vehicle.

You could also apply that "A drone may carry three times its body as armor" to worn armor as well.

Did they really write "carry"? Woohoo, the truck from Arsenal cannot even transport 4 sets of Heavy Milspec Armor (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif) SCNR *hides

[Yerameyahu]

The problem is that it's just dumb. Start with a tank, add a cyberlimb with armor: now your tank is tankier? Ugh. Rinse and repeat with more limbs. Even ignoring balance, it's just bad. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)