Ares Air-Supply Drone from Runners Black Book..., What the....?! Options

[Jonny Reload]

Ok, most of the content in Runners Black Book was kinda meh, but then I see this one "Obsolete" Drone in the "This Old Drone" section called the Ares Air-Supply and this thing is all sorts of wrong.

For starters, I feel guilty for wanting to pick it up for my Technomancer but it's clearly worth the value. But here's where the responsible player/GM in me comes around to beat me upside the head...

Sometimes the art doesn't accurately portray the stats or write up for the drone sometimes but GOOD GOD this thing is huge! Look at the mounted mini-gun in front then compare it to the rest of the mass of the drone. Did the writers just make a new size category for Drones and forgot to tell everyone about it?!

Normally I wasn't even aware Drones could go past Body 4, I thought anything bigger and that's when you move into Vehicle territory, but with a Body 6 (if this isn't a typo), you can upgrade this VTOL Drone to have an 18 Armor.... 18! Most Military Drones can't even get past 12!

Now, this is primarily a Re-Supply Transport Drone that has tons of cargo space so my question at this point is, why would you ever need to buy a Plane or a Helicopter if this Drone could seat you for transport? Most flying vehicles easily break the 100,000 Nuyen price point so while this drone is only 8,500!!! I mean unless your Shadowrunners demand to travel in comfort and style (Which at this point, you should probably have a Luxury Lifestyle if your runner is this picky) why is this series not still in mass production by Ares? Better yet, why isn't in vastly popular amongst Smugglers and Riggers alike?

I mean, this Drones stats and write up literally make no sense in terms with fitting into the Shadowrun universe on an economic, rules, or statistic level at all. Is their an addendum or errata that was released saying "Oh yeah, we forgot 2 digits off the price point" or "Yeah the Body was suppose to be a 4" I mean high-body Drones give you the opportunity to push Armor ratings WAY up and being that it's only 8,500 there's no reason why every Rigger doesn't have at least 2 or 3 of these at their garage.

[CanRay]

Why is it not in mass production by Ares?

Their other lines weren't selling well enough, and have a better cost/profit ratio.

Also, "Tons of cargo space" is still "Supply a platoon with ammo and food for a week" or thereabouts (That's what I figure, at least.). Grunts out there want to shout out on how much that is?

Even so, yeah, it's priced a bit low, methinks.

[Jonny Reload]

Also, "Tons of cargo space" is still "Supply a platoon with ammo and food for a week" or thereabouts (That's what I figure, at least.). Grunts out there want to shout out on how much that is?

Even so, yeah, it's priced a bit low, methinks.

Well ok, let me clarify there's a ton of cargo space for a DRONE, that makes it easily accessible to be a 1-2 passenger flying transport... Priced at 8,500 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohplease.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

At some point, 'drone' doesn't really mean 'drone' anymore. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) The drone body definitions really only apply to the groundcraft we're familiar with, and especially not to autonomous cargo aircraft. It'd obviously be a 'vehicle' that just happens to have no cockpit.

But yes, it's clearly a total error. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Shock!

[CanRay]

Well, easy enough to find out. Figure out who the author is and duct tape him to a chair until he confesses his thoughts.

[ntwi]

Food and Ammo for a platoon for a week?

Figure a case of MRE's is 1 cubic foot and 20 lbs... 40 men to a platoon...
840 meals per week, 12 per case makes it 70 cases of MREs, filling 70 cubic feet and weighing in at 1400lbs.

Ammo is a much bigger question, are we talking small arms, HMG, MK-19 grenade launchers, mortars? And just how heavy is the fighting...

1k rounds of 5.56 comes in around 26lbs
100 round belt of 7.62 is 7lbs, 1k rounds comes to ~70 lbs
100 rounds of .50 is 35lbs
and it just gets heavier from there.

[CanRay]

Say a standard mobile unit in the field (It's not like you'd be able to air-drop supplies to a firebase under siege!), one man per fire unit (squad?) having a M203 and another having a M240/M249 if I recall correctly. It's been a REALLY long time since I looked that up, and my sources were all civilian books, so I could be BADLY mistaken.

Still, that's a LOT of cargo... Yeah, someone didn't think this one through, methinks.

That said, I want five!

[Critias]

Well, easy enough to find out. Figure out who the author is and duct tape him to a chair until he confesses his thoughts.

Just FYI, but like the rest of RBB (each individual PDF and the extra stuff), it's Peter M. Andrew, our e-book line dev. I'm not sure what his DS or SR4 forums name is, off the top of my head.

[CanRay]

Thanks Critias! We'll let him know who ratted him out while he struggles against the tape! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Critias]

I was thinking more along the lines of "shoot him a note and ask," and less along the lines of "tape him to something and beat it out of him," or whatever it is you've got planned. That said, it's just a Canadian making the plan, so I think he's fine. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[pbangarth]

I was thinking more along the lines of "shoot him a note and ask," and less along the lines of "tape him to something and beat it out of him," or whatever it is you've got planned. That said, it's just a Canadian making the plan, so I think he's fine. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Hey! We're the Masters of Duct Tape. Nothing is beyond our sticky talents. Have you never watched Red Green?

[Udoshi]

Still, that's a LOT of cargo... Yeah, someone didn't think this one through, methinks.

I don't think its too bad. Its basically like a slightly bigger Kull airdrop supply drone from Arsenal.


If its toned down to body 4, is it really so broken?

Well ok, let me clarify there's a ton of cargo space for a DRONE, that makes it easily accessible to be a 1-2 passenger flying transport... Priced at 8,500 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohplease.gif)

I would point out that Rigger Cocoons fit on any drone with body 3 or 4. Its no more broken than putting one on an Dalmation.

[Jonny Reload]

I would point out that Rigger Cocoons fit on any drone with body 3 or 4. Its no more broken than putting one on an Dalmation.

.... LOL, dude, a Rigger Cocoon on a Dalmatian is "Ignore the cocoon, shoot the Drone itself and then when it's disabled, go get the blowtorch."
Being IN a Drone that can sustain a beating is a much different story, especially when Vehicle/Drone armor ignored any DV that doesn't even pass it's Armor Rating

If the Air-Supply was Body 4 then obviously it'd be much more balanced.... But as it is in the book, it ain't (IMG:style_emoticons/default/indifferent.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

Just because a rigger cocoon 'fits on something' doesn't make it okay. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Body 6 is an issue, but it's in conjunction with that price, and the (apparently?) huge size.

[CanRay]

I was thinking more along the lines of "shoot him a note and ask," and less along the lines of "tape him to something and beat it out of him," or whatever it is you've got planned. That said, it's just a Canadian making the plan, so I think he's fine. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

I was thinking something more along the lines of doing it appropriate to Shadowrun. Get someone to dress up as an Ork, someone else as an Elf, find a Dwarf, and there you go.

The next April Fool's Movie. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[KarmaInferno]

When I think of a rigger cocoon on a medium drone, I think of this.

"On" being the operative word, rather than "in".




-k

[Yerameyahu]

Yeah, except it's more like a strong large duffel bag. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Method]

I don't know if the art was changed in the print version of RBB, but the image shown for the Air Supply in the .pdf version of This Old Drone is a re-hash of a drone from SR2/3, which was called the Aeroquip Redball Express (not sure why the name change).

Anyway I always pictured the Redball as approximately the size of a small car. While large enough to carry a meta-human the design might preclude that in the same way as a human can fit in a wheelbarrow but a wheelbarrow isn't an effective means of transportation. Maybe the storage space isn't amenable to human passengers (multiple small cargo compartments or one compartment that's too narrow or shallow). Sure you might be able to squeeze in, but its not going to be a comfortable ride.

Plus the real question is whether the cargo compartments are pressurized or environmentally controlled. You could of course upgrade the thing with Living Amenities or a Rigger Cocoon, but as is I would say the thing just isn't designed to carry meta-human passengers.

[KarmaInferno]

You could just rig it while sitting gecko-gripped on top of it's hull.*

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)



-k

* - I may or may not have done this in Missions.

[Yerameyahu]

Yeah, Method, you'd think a cargo supply drone would just have a rack for attaching multiple small (even air-droppable) containers. For foot and ammo, there'd be no reason to deal with the engineering constraints of making it a flying truck.

[nightslasthero]

I was going to suggest perhaps the department isn't pressurized or environmentally controlled and lacks a bathroom and other functions which would be required for a human occupant.

[KarmaInferno]

Assuming they don't have to go to the bathroom on the run, one or two guys wearing life-support gear could probably be transported in the drone in a pinch, although they'd be uncomfortable.

I can see the drones being used to get a couple of HALO jumper operatives over their target area. They'd already be wearing gear to operate unprotected in high altitude environments. You'd probably want to stealth up the drone a bit for that, though.




-k

[Draco18s]

I was going to suggest perhaps the department isn't pressurized or environmentally controlled and lacks a bathroom and other functions which would be required for a human occupant.

Both of which are easily ignored.

For the first problem: "Bundle up and grab an oxygen tank, we're going to be in the air for two hours out and two hours back."
For the second problem: "Why didn't you go before we left?"

[Yerameyahu]

I wouldn't say that's 'easily ignored', just because it can be dealt with. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Sengir]

Sometimes the art doesn't accurately portray the stats or write up for the drone sometimes but GOOD GOD this thing is huge! Look at the mounted mini-gun in front then compare it to the rest of the mass of the drone. Did the writers just make a new size category for Drones and forgot to tell everyone about it?!

Normally I wasn't even aware Drones could go past Body 4, I thought anything bigger and that's when you move into Vehicle territory, but with a Body 6 (if this isn't a typo), you can upgrade this VTOL Drone to have an 18 Armor.... 18! Most Military Drones can't even get past 12!

Congratulations, you just figured out the problem with using one stat as a catchall for a vehicle's size, survivability, and modifiability (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)