Regeneration and object repair: can a regenerating, spirit fix an object by possessing it? Options

[pbangarth]

So, the Fix spell can use magic to repair a broken object. can a Possession Tradition spirit use its Regeneration Power to do the same thing? We know it works on living things, but does it work on objects, in a fashion similar to the Fix spell?

[Yerameyahu]

AFAIK, yes. I've never seen this actually happen, of course. Possession sux.

[Adarael]

I would rule not, unless the spirit was an Ally Spirit which permanently inhabited the vessel. Reason being that mechanical stuff is different enough from meat to suffer problems in terms of how regeneration works, and how to bypass said regeneration - there's no "Damage overflow" for a vehicle, say, it's simply destroyed. And since damage to the "brain and spinal cord" bypasses regeneration, you'd have to adjudicate where the brain and spinal column is for every object. For a car it might be easy - the engine and driveshaft. But what about a gun? A table? A printer? A fireplace?

I'd just say "No, regeneration only works on biological hosts, not inanimate ones."

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Indeed... No is the best answer to this question. Anything else generates a mess of other questions. Besides, why WOULD a non-biological object benefit from a biological process? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Hamsnibit]

Indeed... No is the best answer to this question. Anything else generates a mess of other questions. Besides, why WOULD a non-biological object benefit from a biological process? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Its friggin magic.
Maxied up with physics.
Served chilled with ice cubes.

[Yerameyahu]

Doesn't the book specifically say this works for dead matter (wood)?

Though, I may indeed be thinking of Inhabitation. Anyone got the books handy?

[Hamsnibit]

SM is telling us in the inhabitation chapter that a dead inhabitated (i think this will work for possesing too) body with continoue to rot until all physical attributes are dropped to 1 (you loose 1 point per week if i remember correctly) unless you got regeneration.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Its friggin magic.
Maxied up with physics.
Served chilled with ice cubes.

So.... Your Point?

[Hamsnibit]

So.... Your Point?

Magic doesnt always make sense (see movement power and weight vs body) so i wouldnt be surprised if mechanical bodies actually would regenerate somewhere in RAW. Although i agree this would be somewhat stupid, deltaware implant in shifters and vampires still need their maintenance session and ammo supply.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Magic doesnt always make sense (see movement power and weight vs body) so i wouldnt be surprised if mechanical bodies actually would regenerate somewhere in RAW. Although i agree this would be somewhat stupid, deltaware implant in shifters and vampires still need their maintenance session and ammo supply.

At which point, why even consider it, especially if you deem it stupid, and the rules have nothing to say about it? Regeneration is generally covered for Biological Systems, not your Car.

[Hamsnibit]

I thought this topic was about possesion/inhabitation spirits with regeneration powers in electronic devices?

[Yerameyahu]

I think the point is that we don't know. I, for one, want to know the answer, and in what cases the answer applies. Inhabitation of a never-alive object by a Regeneration spirit? Of a previously-living object? Etc. Magic is arbitrary, so we don't know until we do. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[pbangarth]

My point in the original post is that we have precedent for magic repairing non-living objects. So I'm interested in whether the magic of regeneration applies as well. So far, as far as I know, the following points pertain to the question:

1) Magic is capable of repairing objects. An example is the Fix spell, which has limitations including a) mass of the object, b) presence of all the parts, and c) how much damage it can repair.

2) All descriptions of Regeneration I can find refer to it working on living or once-living vessels. No mention of non-living objects.

3) The possessed vessel and the possessing spirit are considered one, dual-natured entity. Both vessel and spirit share damage. If they share damage, why would they not share healing?

4) If a character with mechanical implants takes damage, the implants do not necessarily do so as well. Conversely, if an implant is specifically targeted/damaged, it does not add damage boxes to the character. So possessor and possessed object may not be linked enough to share damage.


Anything else?

[KarmaInferno]

Indeed... No is the best answer to this question. Anything else generates a mess of other questions. Besides, why WOULD a non-biological object benefit from a biological process? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Christine has an answer.




-k

[pbangarth]

Cool! I'd forgotten about her.

[Adarael]

I would argue that Christine simply had Fix as an innate spell, since it happened in a burst rather than as a constant effect. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[pbangarth]

But a Power can be turned off or on, so maybe she was waiting for the right moment; the right man.

[Irion]

As we are at it, could somebody please state where those rules are to be found? And how powers react to wards? Or is it just GM fiat?

[Neraph]

Indeed... No Yes is the best answer to this question. Anything else generates a mess of other questions. Besides, why WOULDN'T a non-biological object benefit from a biological magical process? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Neraph]

A more detailed reply:

Possession and Vessels, page 102, Street Magic, Dead or Inanimate Vessels:

While the spirit may use all of its powers on the physical plane through such a vessel...

Critter Powers, page 204, Running Wild, Type:

Powers may be either mana (M) or physical (P), just like spells (see p. 203, SR4A). Mana powers do not affect nonliving targets, whereas physical powers cannot be used in astral space or affect astral forms.

Regeneration, page 215, Running Wild:

Type: P... A critter with Regeneration rapidly heals any Physical damage. At the end of a Combat Turn, make a Magic + Body Test.

As a physical Power, it can affect anything that is not astral, including vehicles, drones, commlinks, guns, ect. Since vehicles have a Body attribute and the spirit has a Magic attribute, they can make the Test for Regeneration.

EDIT: This works equally with Possession (as the OP asked) or Inhabitation.

[Yerameyahu]

I still don't think Vehicle Body is related to Critter Body, but oh well. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I agree anyway: magic is magic, possession is magic, regeneration regenerates any vessel… in theory. In practice, does everything even *have* a Physical damage track to heal? It still works for vehicles, of course, but other things? The rules simply never dealt with these eventualities. I blame Possession.

[Neraph]

I didn't know that Body had a distinction between critter, player, or vehicle. I thought it was just Body. Any further stipulations are preconceptions you bring to the table.

[Yerameyahu]

That's what I just said, 'I think'. And I was including 'player' in critters, because there are no 'players' in the world of SR. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

It's pretty clear that they're different things, though, confusingly given the same name. That's why the cyborgs break the vehicle Body numbers so badly.

Anyway, since you refuse to let me agree with you: hooking up the critter power with a possessed vehicle just because the resulting mess randomly happens to have two correctly-named attributes is a complete kluge. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

I didn't know that Body had a distinction between critter, player, or vehicle. I thought it was just Body. Any further stipulations are preconceptions you bring to the table.

So a Body 6 Character can permanently mount two Weapons Mounts on his shoulders with no essence loss? Really? Body of Vehicles and Body of People are not the same, even if they uses the same terminology.

[Neraph]

So a Body 6 Character can permanently mount two Weapons Mounts on his shoulders with no essence loss? Really? Body of Vehicles and Body of People are not the same, even if they uses the same terminology.

The modification rules presented below are specifically designed for weapon and vehicle modifications, but they can also be applied to any sort of gear modifications (such as armor or commlinks) if the gamemaster so desires.

No, People cannot take Vehicle modifications.

It occurs to me that my response, due to the internet leaching out all inflection, may have come across a little rough. Sorry, Yeryameyahu.