IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

2 Pages V  < 1 2  
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> The Big Rig, Need help
ShadowDragon8685
post Jun 9 2012, 04:11 AM
Post #26


Horror
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,140
Joined: 15-June 05
From: BumFuck, New Jersey
Member No.: 7,445



QUOTE (_Pax._ @ Jun 8 2012, 10:09 PM) *
Well, bloody hell! Why in the nine did they do THAT?!? There was existing, ordinary-18-wheeler art for SR already, they could have used for the Zugmaschine ... which is definitely not statted as a "moving office block", like the Bergen was.

...

Respect for Catalyst: dwindling.


Talos heretic!

Just kidding. Fuck the Thalmor, seriously. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)


Anyway, I have no idea. If I had to guess, someone had a huge folder full of images bereft of context, saw it, didn't 'get' the ladder was a ladder up to a massive vehicle's cab, and thought it was just as big rig with an unusual, cool look they could use.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
CanRay
post Jun 9 2012, 05:06 AM
Post #27


Immortal Elf
**********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 14,358
Joined: 2-December 07
From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Member No.: 14,465



Take into consideration a lot of the old art and items have gone through, what, three companies? More?

Lots of stuff being packed up and mislabeled in boxes and such.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ShadowDragon8685
post Jun 9 2012, 11:49 AM
Post #28


Horror
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,140
Joined: 15-June 05
From: BumFuck, New Jersey
Member No.: 7,445



QUOTE (CanRay @ Jun 9 2012, 12:06 AM) *
Take into consideration a lot of the old art and items have gone through, what, three companies? More?

Lots of stuff being packed up and mislabeled in boxes and such.


Isn't that exactly what I said?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
CanRay
post Jun 9 2012, 03:55 PM
Post #29


Immortal Elf
**********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 14,358
Joined: 2-December 07
From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Member No.: 14,465



QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685 @ Jun 9 2012, 06:49 AM) *
Isn't that exactly what I said?
Yeah, but I get the feeling some people need things spelled out with all the...

Never mind, I shouldn't be posting right now. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Falconer
post Jun 9 2012, 04:23 PM
Post #30


Neophyte Runner
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,283
Joined: 12-October 07
Member No.: 13,662



I disagree strongly with Pax... a standard box trailer would only have 6 body. Body does not only indicate size but also how tough something is build... a structure built out of metal will have a much higher body score than an equivalent structure made out of wood.

It's little more than sheet metal plus some framing... they're not exactly the most rugged structures on the road... compared to the cab with it's engine, transmission, etc. they're tinfoil.

If you wanted something more, at that point you're more or less building your own trailer from scratch. Your better route would be to do something like take a citymaster as a template, give it 'limited maneuverability' since it doesn't move on it's own but instead is drug behind the zugmachine. I'd still consider a seperate vehicle for damage purposes and NOT lump the two into one for balance reasons and problems within the RAW.

You could even end up with a flatbed carrying another vehicle.

It's probably best in all situations to not consider the combined tractor trailor a single unit except for maneuverability and speed restrictions. Damagewise... probably best to consider them two seperate targets and vehicles.

Here's part of the reason why... you have a zug + trailor... you consider them a single target... target is attacked and takes damage... you now take off that trailer and put on another one... where is the damage? There's no rules to handle how each of them take damage or how it's split between the two.

On the other hand if they're two vehicles which only share a maneuverability/pilot response for the defense test to avoid getting hit but soak damage independently... it makes a lot more sense... as it's possible to trash the trailer and it's cargo without trashing the tractor unit... or vice versa (if you're trying to hijack the cargo). You know exactly how the damage is split between them at all times as well.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ShadowDragon8685
post Jun 9 2012, 05:35 PM
Post #31


Horror
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,140
Joined: 15-June 05
From: BumFuck, New Jersey
Member No.: 7,445



QUOTE (Falconer @ Jun 9 2012, 11:23 AM) *
I disagree strongly with Pax... a standard box trailer would only have 6 body. Body does not only indicate size but also how tough something is build... a structure built out of metal will have a much higher body score than an equivalent structure made out of wood

<Snip much awesomeness.>


You're talking smart, real smart, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter. You're also pretty damn spot-on about splitting damage and counting the trailer as a limited maneuverability unit.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
The Jopp
post Jun 9 2012, 06:12 PM
Post #32


Runner
******

Group: Members
Posts: 2,925
Joined: 26-February 02
Member No.: 948



QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685 @ Jun 8 2012, 04:22 AM) *
So, we have normal sea pirates, sky pirates, submarine pirates, and now, land pirates.

Yarrrrr, matey!


Wait, where are the space pirates?

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Critias
post Jun 9 2012, 06:22 PM
Post #33


Freelance Elf
*********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 7,216
Joined: 30-September 04
From: Texas
Member No.: 6,714



QUOTE (The Jopp @ Jun 9 2012, 01:12 PM) *
Wait, where are the space pirates?

In space, presumably.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
CanRay
post Jun 9 2012, 08:37 PM
Post #34


Immortal Elf
**********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 14,358
Joined: 2-December 07
From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Member No.: 14,465



QUOTE (The Jopp @ Jun 9 2012, 01:12 PM) *
Wait, where are the space pirates?
There's been Matrix Pirates for years. It's the ASTRAL Pirates you have to watch out for.
QUOTE (Critias @ Jun 9 2012, 01:22 PM) *
In space, presumably.
Here's their captain.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ShadowDragon8685
post Jun 9 2012, 10:01 PM
Post #35


Horror
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,140
Joined: 15-June 05
From: BumFuck, New Jersey
Member No.: 7,445



QUOTE (CanRay @ Jun 9 2012, 04:37 PM) *
There's been Matrix Pirates for years. It's the ASTRAL Pirates you have to watch out for.


Here's their captain.


You mean the Space Pirate's captain, right? Because he doesn't seem like an Astral Pirate, much less an Astral Pirate captain.


... What do Astral Pirates steal, anyway?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Tymeaus Jalynsfe...
post Jun 9 2012, 11:05 PM
Post #36


Prime Runner Ascendant
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 16,580
Joined: 26-March 09
From: Aurora, Colorado
Member No.: 17,022



QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685 @ Jun 9 2012, 04:01 PM) *
You mean the Space Pirate's captain, right? Because he doesn't seem like an Astral Pirate, much less an Astral Pirate captain.


... What do Astral Pirates steal, anyway?


Astral Loot?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
_Pax._
post Jun 9 2012, 11:42 PM
Post #37


Neophyte Runner
*****

Group: Validating
Posts: 2,492
Joined: 19-April 12
Member No.: 51,818



QUOTE (Falconer @ Jun 9 2012, 11:23 AM) *
I disagree strongly with Pax... a standard box trailer would only have 6 body. Body does not only indicate size but also how tough something is build... a structure built out of metal will have a much higher body score than an equivalent structure made out of wood.

I never said the trailer should have more actual body ... just, more room for modifications.

QUOTE
It's probably best in all situations to not consider the combined tractor trailor a single unit except for maneuverability and speed restrictions.

SR4 however, does exactly that. The Trailer doesn't have a separate body of 6. Instead, it ups the Tractor's body by 6.

I agree with you that it's not a good approach. Unfortunately, it is the RAW's decision.

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
CanRay
post Jun 10 2012, 04:08 AM
Post #38


Immortal Elf
**********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 14,358
Joined: 2-December 07
From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Member No.: 14,465



QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685 @ Jun 9 2012, 05:01 PM) *
... What do Astral Pirates steal, anyway?
Souls. Karma. Emotions. Luck.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
The Jopp
post Jun 10 2012, 06:18 AM
Post #39


Runner
******

Group: Members
Posts: 2,925
Joined: 26-February 02
Member No.: 948



QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685 @ Jun 9 2012, 11:01 PM) *
You mean the Space Pirate's captain, right? Because he doesn't seem like an Astral Pirate, much less an Astral Pirate captain.


... What do Astral Pirates steal, anyway?


Ok, if that's the space pirate captain we have nothing to worry about. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
The Jopp
post Jun 10 2012, 06:20 AM
Post #40


Runner
******

Group: Members
Posts: 2,925
Joined: 26-February 02
Member No.: 948



QUOTE (CanRay @ Jun 9 2012, 09:37 PM) *
There's been Matrix Pirates for years. It's the ASTRAL Pirates you have to watch out for.Here's their captain.


They do have a funky theme though

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkjWyPC9Sm4
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Falconer
post Jun 11 2012, 04:57 AM
Post #41


Neophyte Runner
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,283
Joined: 12-October 07
Member No.: 13,662



PAX,

RAW or not... the combined vehicle rules for any tractor-trailer are woefully incomplete.... that's all I'm saying.

The rules for any kind of trailer are pretty bad or nonexistent... excepting sidecars for bikes.


If you hitched a uhaul trailer behind your Rover 2068... it wouldn't make sense to treat them as a combined vehicle. There is no RAW to say how exactly that's handled with a tractor-trailer combo.

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
kzt
post Jun 11 2012, 05:20 AM
Post #42


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,529
Joined: 27-August 06
From: Albuquerque NM
Member No.: 9,234



QUOTE (Falconer @ Jun 10 2012, 10:57 PM) *
RAW or not... the combined vehicle rules for any tractor-trailer are woefully incomplete.... that's all I'm saying.

The rules for any kind of trailer are pretty bad or nonexistent... excepting sidecars for bikes.

The vehicle rules are pretty much uniformly "pretty bad or nonexistent". Just another group/GM decision.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
_Pax._
post Jun 11 2012, 06:11 AM
Post #43


Neophyte Runner
*****

Group: Validating
Posts: 2,492
Joined: 19-April 12
Member No.: 51,818



QUOTE (Falconer @ Jun 10 2012, 11:57 PM) *
PAX,

RAW or not... the combined vehicle rules for any tractor-trailer are woefully incomplete.... that's all I'm saying.

The rules for any kind of trailer are pretty bad or nonexistent... excepting sidecars for bikes.

Yes, I was agreeing with you.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Krishach
post Jun 11 2012, 08:22 PM
Post #44


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 310
Joined: 26-August 10
Member No.: 18,972



QUOTE (_Pax._ @ Jun 8 2012, 01:16 AM) *
Not so, a full sized trailer. A trailer that could hold two Body-10 cars (e.g., Mercury Comets), just by loading them nose-to-tail, with room to spare.

still not as big as a tree. Certainly not as long, and I doubt the plant is purely linear. Western Red Cedars, which are native to places like Seattle outreaches, grow to up to 200 ft long and 20ft spread. Body determines carry, if I recall. Also, the space needed for lift is dependent on the gas, assuming gas is the only variable for lift at that.
As has been said, the rules for 4th ed are pretty nondescript. We back-referenced 3rd ed vehicle books for similar items in our group. As it appear you have? a roadmaster and tractor-trailer, have you considered a small plane? You can get a Tundra-9 if you truly break the bank at character creation, or you can get a yellow jacket without having to use Born Rich and In Debt.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
almost normal
post Jun 11 2012, 08:50 PM
Post #45


Running Target
***

Group: Banned
Posts: 1,105
Joined: 23-August 10
Member No.: 18,961



(IMG:style_emoticons/default/twirl.gif)

I just wanted a decent rig. If I wanted the best min/max possible, I wouldn't be playing a fucking mechanic.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
_Pax._
post Jun 11 2012, 09:26 PM
Post #46


Neophyte Runner
*****

Group: Validating
Posts: 2,492
Joined: 19-April 12
Member No.: 51,818



QUOTE (Krishach @ Jun 11 2012, 04:22 PM) *
still not as big as a tree.

So what?

I'm talking about "volume in which to put vehicle modifications". Not whether or not ic can carry a full-blown fraggin' redwood.

Body is not SIZE. Body is structural resilience and strength.

Honestly, modification limits should NEVER have been tied to Body. Never, ever, ever.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ShadowDragon8685
post Jun 11 2012, 09:41 PM
Post #47


Horror
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,140
Joined: 15-June 05
From: BumFuck, New Jersey
Member No.: 7,445



QUOTE (almost normal @ Jun 11 2012, 04:50 PM) *
I just wanted a decent rig. If I wanted the best min/max possible, I wouldn't be playing a fucking mechanic.


The group already has a big rig. If you want something unique, perhaps the Mostran KVP-27T? It's on Page 111 of Arsenal, and it's.....

Wait, what? Body 8? Did they mis-type "18," there, because if a Hermes delivery van, which from all appearances is smaller, slimmer, and less sturdy, is Body 17, then that big beefy hovervan - described as a combination of a delivery van and mobile general store for wilderness areas - should be at least an 18.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
kzt
post Jun 12 2012, 12:20 AM
Post #48


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,529
Joined: 27-August 06
From: Albuquerque NM
Member No.: 9,234



QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685 @ Jun 11 2012, 03:41 PM) *
Wait, what? Body 8? Did they mis-type "18," there, because if a Hermes delivery van, which from all appearances is smaller, slimmer, and less sturdy, is Body 17, then that big beefy hovervan - described as a combination of a delivery van and mobile general store for wilderness areas - should be at least an 18.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ShadowDragon8685
post Jun 12 2012, 01:33 AM
Post #49


Horror
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,140
Joined: 15-June 05
From: BumFuck, New Jersey
Member No.: 7,445



QUOTE (kzt @ Jun 11 2012, 07:20 PM) *


Well, that's nice and enigmatic...

I think I'm gonna have to say that the hovercraftvan is Body 18. It makes it a sane purchase for a Shadowrunner.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

2 Pages V  < 1 2
Reply to this topicStart new topic

 



RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 26th October 2014 - 06:01 AM

Topps, Inc has sole ownership of the names, logo, artwork, marks, photographs, sounds, audio, video and/or any proprietary material used in connection with the game Shadowrun. Topps, Inc has granted permission to the Dumpshock Forums to use such names, logos, artwork, marks and/or any proprietary materials for promotional and informational purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not affiliated with the Dumpshock Forums in any official capacity whatsoever.