Pistol whipping? How much damage?, unarmed or clubs skill? Stun or physical Options

[cutter07]

Would like to hear what people think, havent asked my GM yet

[Connor]

STR+1 or STR+2 Stun, depending on the pistol maybe?

[Austere Emancipa...]

I thought it didn't, but it does actually appear on the Improvised Melee Weapons table on p. 11 of Cannon Companion. Pistol-whipping has a Reach of 0, Damage is (STR + 1)M Stun, and the skill used is Clubs.

While those figures seem rather sensible, as rules for SR melee weapons go, allowing defaulting to Unarmed at a very low TN mod isn't out of the question, or even allowing the use of Unarmed Combat directly.

[Zazen]

And don't forget melee hardening (a gun design option in CC) or dikote. It'll add +1 power and help keep those skull thumps from knocking your gun out of alignment.

[Connor]

d0h, i forgot to add in M :-P At least AE broke out the CC and looked up the right damage codes.

[cutter07]

Thanks Austere Emancipator, I missed that. :dead:

[Austere Emancipa...]

Yer welcome. Anything I can do not to read more Rigger 3. I've got MIJI running out of my ears.

[Arethusa]

I'm just kind of curious: anyone considered allowing them to do physical damage at (Str-1)M, (Str)M with hardening? Perhaps Light, instead? Or, for that matter, allowing full sized weapons to get an additional +1 or +2 power?

(Before you start screaming about how guns aren't lethal in melee, let me just say you have no idea what a solid rifle butt smack can do to a person.)

Just tossing ideas out, in any case. Don't expect solid numbers.

[KillaJ]

Personally I couldn't agree more about the effects of a good butt stroke(hold the sodomy jokes thanks) but iirc virtually every blunt object does stun doesn't it? I suppose there is some game balance thing happening there, rather then real life physics. Just my thoughts however.

[Zazen]

Yeah, there ought to be a way to do physical damage with blunt weapons, but I have yet to hear a house rule for it that I like.

[Luke Hardison]

I typically will let people choose to have a stun weapon do physical at half power. (just like bone lacing) It's not realistic, but I've always found it pretty balanced, gameplaywise.

[Austere Emancipa...]

For house rules, I still like mine, which simply extends Bone Lacing's ability to do Physical instead of Stun at half power. STR 4 guy with a pistol might not crush your skull and kill you easily (5/2 = 2M Physical), but a STR 10 troll with a 5kg modified Warhawk might (6M Physical).

Luke Hardison is a great guy. This message has not been edited.

[Zazen]

Wow, I'd never noticed that about bone lacing. Sounds good to me.

[Arethusa]

Well, holy crap. That gets my vote.

[RedmondLarry]

Getting hit by a pistol should do physical damage. After all, while bullets wouldn't hurt him, a thrown gun would still make Superman dodge. ;)

[xizor]

prehaps the power of the damage has to be greater than body + 1/2 impact armor to do damage code physical
and for those who love equations
(power> body +1/2 impact armor) if true damage is physical, if false damage is stun

just an idea, hit a normal human in the head with pistol and they probably take a M physical wound, hit an average troll in the head with a pistol and the troll will laugh at you, then kill you.

[The White Dwarf]

You know, the sad thing is this is one of the more broken things in the game.

Anyone, particularly and adept, with ambidexterity and 2 pistols, the pistols skill, and the clubs skill doesnt ever have to let go of their weapons to be a whirling blur of death.

Now coming to a game near you... anime characters.

[Arethusa]

A troll will also have no trouble resisting your, at best, 3M physical attack. That is a uselessly complicated mechanic for something already handled elsewhere in the rules.

Anyone think full size weapons should get an additional +2 power?

[edit]

Ain't my fault magic's broken.

[Austere Emancipa...]

I think the (STR + 2)M Stun they're currently at is enough. Although, even a fricken potted plant gets (STR + 1)M Stun, as good as an Extendable Baton.

[Egon]

I think with blunt weapons you are just required to hit them a few more times after they stop moving. :)

[Capt. Dave]

This post has been edited 'cause I can't read... :grinbig:

Thanks, AE.

[Austere Emancipa...]

Apart from Zazen in the fourth message, you're right.

[lspahn72]

[Zazen]

[Deschain]