[X] My Assistant

[All4BigGuns]

I'd kind of like to see the playtest stuff.

[_Pax._]

Dude, Arthritis? That's so ... pre-awakening. Seriously, they make replacement parts for a reason, you know! ;D

[All4BigGuns]

Dude, Arthritis? That's so ... pre-awakening. Seriously, they make replacement parts for a reason, you know! ;D

*hefts a sledge hammer* Want I should help you know how he feels? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[_Pax._]

Eh, I could already use some rplacement knees and maybe hips, myself. And shoulders. My eyes aren't what they used to be either. And the ulnar nerve in my left arm has been acting up lately.

...

Aw heck, I need a full-body replacement job, who'm I kidding? Someone got forty million nuyen and the number of a good Delta clinic, they can give me? ^_^

[All4BigGuns]

Eh, I could already use some rplacement knees and maybe hips, myself. And shoulders. My eyes aren't what they used to be either. And the ulnar nerve in my left arm has been acting up lately.

...

Aw heck, I need a full-body replacement job, who'm I kidding? Someone got forty million nuyen and the number of a good Delta clinic, they can give me? ^_^

Right there with ya. With my back, I could use a cyber torso, and with my kneecaps that can slide out of place all the way toward the right, I could probably use the legs as well. Not to mention my right eye being ninety different shades of effed up.

I feel old at times...especially since I saw on Facebook that a girl I graduated with was asked by her niece if we had trampolines when we were kids.

[CanRay]

*hefts a sledge hammer* Want I should help you know how he feels? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

*Looks at my shattered elbow* Not as funny as it used to be...

[Sengir]

Dude, Arthritis? That's so ... pre-awakening. Seriously, they make replacement parts magical cure-all nanotech for a fraction of the price for a reason, you know! ;D

I'm sure there is some, brave new SR...

[Larsine]

My wishlist is small too.

5) Be aware of what has come before. This is probably the hardest. The way Shadowrun works, is that the Metaplot keeps going. Every book it inches forward. I'm sure somewhere over there, they have a 'setting bible' that they can reference to see what's been WRITTEN about XY nd Z and what they KNOW about XY and Z.. Don't forget that. (( and if there's not, god take a few weeks and make one.)) Don't suddenly have char's changing personality out of the blue to do things they'd never do, don't have them contridict their own pasts, ect. That deep "History" and metaplot is a huge draw of the game.

Do you seriously know how big that 'setting bible' would be?

As a proofreader I ofter refer to old books, and I'm sure the writers do aswell, but even with access to everything published, things still fall through the cracks, and we do everything we can to avoid it. But thinking it would take a few weeks to make a 'setting bible' is just silly.

[sk8bcn]

Well, at least, following one a little bit could be nice. Ancient History's site was a jewel IMO.

[Pepsi Jedi]

Do you seriously know how big that 'setting bible' would be?

As a proofreader I ofter refer to old books, and I'm sure the writers do aswell, but even with access to everything published, things still fall through the cracks, and we do everything we can to avoid it. But thinking it would take a few weeks to make a 'setting bible' is just silly.

*Holds up his thumb* Probably about this big? Thumb drive size?

If even that big and not a file that could be transferred or mailed 100% digitally? I've about 600 to 700 RPG PDF's on both my Ipads and my desk top. If my Ipads can hold that many (each), transferal of information isn't THAT hard.

I'll guess you mean 'how much information would need to be in it'. To answer your question. Yes. I have an idea. I have about 95.. 96% of the published (English) Shadowrun books, both hard copy and the ones that are just digital. I'm further aware of the few I don't physically or digitally possess. I'm aware that there's been alot that's come before. Yes as you say somethings still fall through the cracks.

I'm saying try and keep that at a minimum. If you're writing along and are going to use Kane, Devgirl, Bull and Frosty, take a bit of time to check into the characters. Do word searches in the PDFs to see when their names come up and read their posting style and where they've been and what they've done. Be aware of the big points in the metaplot. Check dates. ect. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Clearly you can't reference 100% of the books for every single thing you write, but if you're writing on a topic, you can go and see what was written on that topic hither-before now, and incorporate it, or build off of it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I also said this would be one of the hardest things to do, but from a customer/player/fan's standpoint. It's important to me. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that it's important to others. Some of us have been at this for years and years, some of the 'characters' in these books have 'grown up' with us. lol They're almost like old friends (( And enemies.. ohhh I wanna kill Clockwork so bad...))

[nezumi]

A good number of Shadowrun books are not available in a searchable format. And even if they were, what that leaves you with is a stack of 60 pdfs. So every time you're going to do something on insect spirits, what are you going to do? Search 'bugs' across each book and see what sticks?

I do agree with you that a giant cross-indexed wiki, or at least a reference list, would be pretty handy. You're working on Insect spirits? Check the list and it tells you which books to read. A reference list like that would take at least 2-3 weeks, and it will always have gaps. The wiki would be a labor of love. It would likely take years, especially given the poor condition of most 1e and 2e books.

[sk8bcn]

So true, but it would be so nice!

[Pepsi Jedi]

A good number of Shadowrun books are not available in a searchable format. And even if they were, what that leaves you with is a stack of 60 pdfs. So every time you're going to do something on insect spirits, what are you going to do? Search 'bugs' across each book and see what sticks?

I do agree with you that a giant cross-indexed wiki, or at least a reference list, would be pretty handy. You're working on Insect spirits? Check the list and it tells you which books to read. A reference list like that would take at least 2-3 weeks, and it will always have gaps. The wiki would be a labor of love. It would likely take years, especially given the poor condition of most 1e and 2e books.

Do you have to go through them all? No, but you really want to look at ones that pertain to your topic, like bug city, etc. If you're writing for publication in the Shadowrun world you should have enough of a grasp of what's come before that you at least have a hint that you should look in Bug City and such instead of Rigger 2 and Rigger 3, or Celtic Double cross. I.E. No you don't HAVE to look through EVERY book, but you should look through the ones with bug stuff in them. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

The other option is add hoc just writing stuff and crossing one's fingers that it doesn't directly contridict what's come before. Something I think we can all agree is not what we want in our 'new' published materials.

[nezumi]

Do you have to go through them all? No, but you really want to look at ones that pertain to your topic, like bug city, etc. If you're writing for publication in the Shadowrun world you should have enough of a grasp of what's come before that you at least have a hint that you should look in Bug City and such instead of Rigger 2 and Rigger 3, or Celtic Double cross. I.E. No you don't HAVE to look through EVERY book, but you should look through the ones with bug stuff in them. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Well that's a question of hiring experienced freelancers, and a quality line developer. I agree 100% with that, even WITH a Shadowrun lore bible.

Ultimately, a lore bible really would be a good investment. If Shadowrun survives another ten years, it will be hurting.

Honestly, the best solution may be to put some more resources into filling out the Sixth World Wiki. Fans will do a lot of work for you, with very little reward, and what's already there is great.

[Patrick Goodman]

This would seem an appropriate time for you to pimp the URL of the 6th World Wiki.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

This would seem an appropriate time for you to pimp the URL of the 6th World Wiki.

I'd buy that for a Dollar. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[nezumi]

https://www.google.com/search?q=sixth+world...amp;ie=&oe=

[Draco18s]

https://www.google.com/search?q=sixth+world...amp;ie=&oe=

The top result is the wiki on Wikia, which is awful. The one that was hosted on Dumpshock was amazing, but it is currently offline.

[Bull]

My only complaint with the DUmpshock WIki was that there was no oversight. People were adding in their own home-brewed information without marking it as such. I did a search on there a few years back about Miami, I think it was, an area that got briefly touched on in Cyberpirates I believe, but wanted to see if there were references from other books I should check out. Instead, the WIki had a TON of information, but none of it came from any official source material that I could find, and some of it outright contradicted what little info I was aware of.

So if a Wiki is suspect on one front, you have to assume it's suspect on all fronts. And that makes it completely unreliable. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

Me, I have every SR book available on PDF, a few that officially aren't (mostly non-OCR ones), plus a near complete library ona shelf next to my desk. Any time I work on a project, there inevitably ends up being a half dozen books stacked up next to my keyboard. Right now, I have Target: UCAS, Bug City, Feral Cities, Neo-A's Guide to North America, Conspiracy Theories, SHadowrun 2050, Arsenal, Artifacts Unbound, and Anarchy Subsidized all piled up next to me, for example.

Bull

[Sengir]

The English wiki is pretty messed up...the German one is far better maintained, but that won't help most freelancers...

[Bull]

I've used teh German one on occassion, though Google Translate only gets me so far (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) But mainly I use it to see if I can find book references to help me narrow down searches. There's some very odd places that info can be tucked in at. My prime example is when I wrote up Kane's bio for Street Legends Supplemental. I dug through every book I had trying to find any info on him, and it turned out that the biggest source of backstory was a book I would have NEVER thought to look in, because I'd completely forgotten it even had Shadowtalk: the Shadowrun Companion for 2nd Edition.

Thankfully Fastjack over on the official boards has a PDF compilation that lists every Shadowtalker and page references for all their comments. That was a HUGE help.

(And as a note, we do have a Freelancer Shadowrun WIki we use. But it's not really that extensive, sadly. Some of us add to it when we can, but between life, day jobs, and freelancing, it's tough to find the time to do much.)

Bull

[Pepsi Jedi]

My only complaint with the DUmpshock WIki was that there was no oversight. People were adding in their own home-brewed information without marking it as such. I did a search on there a few years back about Miami, I think it was, an area that got briefly touched on in Cyberpirates I believe, but wanted to see if there were references from other books I should check out. Instead, the WIki had a TON of information, but none of it came from any official source material that I could find, and some of it outright contradicted what little info I was aware of.

So if a Wiki is suspect on one front, you have to assume it's suspect on all fronts. And that makes it completely unreliable. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

Me, I have every SR book available on PDF, a few that officially aren't (mostly non-OCR ones), plus a near complete library ona shelf next to my desk. Any time I work on a project, there inevitably ends up being a half dozen books stacked up next to my keyboard. Right now, I have Target: UCAS, Bug City, Feral Cities, Neo-A's Guide to North America, Conspiracy Theories, SHadowrun 2050, Arsenal, Artifacts Unbound, and Anarchy Subsidized all piled up next to me, for example.

Bull

See!! This is -exactly- what I meant! If you're gonna work, make sure you see what's come before so you don't screw up new stuff. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[nezumi]

I don't think anyone questioned Bull's qualities as a diligent freelancer (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Bull]

I don't think anyone questioned Bull's qualities as a diligent freelancer (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

You might be surprised. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

There's an old maxim that says you don't work in the gaming industry to make money. This is closely followed by "Don't work in the gaming industry unless you can take unfounded, uninformed abuse." (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

For me, the tears of fanboys are sweet, sweet nectar. So it works out.

Bull

[Patrick Goodman]

You might be surprised. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Might?

For me, the tears of fanboys are sweet, sweet nectar. So it works out.

I'm not there yet, but I certainly understand the sentiment.