Death of a Computer Options

[_Pax._]

Yep. My wonderful, three year old but still gaming-powerful PC, has died. I bricked it, somehow, whl installing the Blu-Ray Drive I got for Christmas. Must have caused a short across the mainboard, and fried the CMOS / BIOS / whatchamacallit-thingie (nope, I'm not a computer guru).

...

Needless to say, I was ... "most displeased", let us say. My glorious 3.2GHz quad-core, NVidia GTX275 - pretty darned nice when it was new, and still decent even now - won't even boot to the point of SHOWING the BIOS. I had planned a replacement ... in exactly three more years, after a lengthy stretch of saving money.

*cry*

Well, thanks to a wonderfully generous family, I'll have a replacement, hopefully within the month (depends how quickly they can get it assembled and out the door) from iBuyPower.

In somewhat brief:

Case: Thermaltake Armor Revo, White
CPU: AMD FX-8350 CPU (8x 4.00GHz/8MB L2 Cache)
System Memory: 16 GB DDR3-2133 (Corsair Vengeance)
Video: Dual AMD Radeon HD 7970, 3GB - CrossFire
Power Supply: 1200 Watt Thermaltake Toughpower
System Drive: 480 GB Intel 520 SSD
Data Drive: 2 TB Western Digital Black HARD DRIVE
Optical Drive: [12X Blu-Ray] LG BLU-RAY Re-Writer, DVD±R/±RW Burner Combo Drive
Operating System: Windows 7 Professional, 64 Bit
Monitor: 32" LCD Sceptre X328BV-FHD

... plus sound reduction, "professional" wiring / wire-sleeving, case lighting, and so forth.

...

So. A serious upgrade. And within what my budget WOULD have been (this is $3500, including delivery ... my budget was $4000 to $4500 ... I'll end up paying $4000 to the family member lending me the money up front).

It's just ... I was really looking forward to NOT needing a loan to buy this computer. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

[ShadowDragon8685]

Um...

You could just get an identical motherboard of the same make-and-model and drop it in. If the mobo was the only thing broken, fixing it shouldn't be too hard. If the CPU went, it'll be pricy, but still not as bad as a whole new replacement.

[_Pax._]

The first problem is, I literally don't know what I'm doing inside a computer case. Especially, I haven't the first clue how to install a CPU ...! The very thought of trying terrifies me.

The second problem is, I killed this one just installing a new optical drive. Plug the power cable in, plug the SATA cable in, and done ... it should have been that easy. In practise .... not so much, it turns out.

Third problem is, without booting up the old desktop ... I literally don't KNOW what the exact model number of the old motherboard. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif) I know the manufacturor, but that's as far as it gets.

Fourth up: I only _think_ that's what happened. All I know for certain is that I can neither boot the system up, nor find a listing of POST codes that includes the two different ones I'm getting when I try to tart it up.

Fifth and final problem: it's kinda too late to cancel the order for the new computer anyway. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[phlapjack77]

I haven't actually tried it, but I bet this is something using reddit would be good for. (fixing problem 3)

Post a pic of your motherboard to r/techsupport or r/whatisthisthing, and you probably could have the answer inside of a few hours.

As to the other problems... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[_Pax._]

The Reddit thing might help. Or I can just take it in to a repair shop, and see if they can do anything with it (I'd intended to pass the computer on to my mother, when I upgraded .... it'd've been unsuitable for games by then, but for Websurfing, email, watching movies ...? Drop in a fresh PSU and it would have been just dandy, for years to come.)

Kicker is, I have the full and EXACT specs up on some hardware site or other, including the motherboard (I'm the one that provided them with the specs for their database, even) ... but the link to that site is, you guess it, on the dead PC. Whoopsie.

[ShadowDragon8685]

The first problem is, I literally don't know what I'm doing inside a computer case. Especially, I haven't the first clue how to install a CPU ...! The very thought of trying terrifies me.

If you have a Computer Guy in your circle of friends, you can probably get him to put it together for a few hundred. Dropping in a CPU chip? Yeah, I won't even try that.

The second problem is, I killed this one just installing a new optical drive. Plug the power cable in, plug the SATA cable in, and done ... it should have been that easy. In practise .... not so much, it turns out.

Yeah, it really should have been. I can't imagine installing an optical drive bricking the system; it's possible (though not likely) that you fucked up the mobo when you tinkered with it. I'd suspect a bad drive, though.

Third problem is, without booting up the old desktop ... I literally don't KNOW what the exact model number of the old motherboard. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif) I know the manufacturor, but that's as far as it gets.

A Computer Guy (or a repair shop) can find that out by pulling the parts from your computer and Googleing them. That simple.

Fourth up: I only _think_ that's what happened. All I know for certain is that I can neither boot the system up, nor find a listing of POST codes that includes the two different ones I'm getting when I try to tart it up.

It's Bricked. If it's that badly Bricked, then either the PSU is bad, the mobo is bad, the CPU is bad, or some combination thereof is bad.

Fifth and final problem: it's kinda too late to cancel the order for the new computer anyway. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Well, nothing I can suggest about that one except cancel it, if there's still time. If not... C'est la vie.

[Stahlseele]

1.) i am not much of a Fan of AMD, but that's your choice.
2.) forget about Crossfire or SLI, it's simply not worth it.
3.) a 1200 Watt PSU is overkill, if you don't do the Crossfire/SLI
4.) use a 256GB Samsung Series 830 or 840 SSD, nothing more.
5.) use a 3TB WD Green as Datastorage.

[_Pax._]

4.) use a 256GB Samsung Series 830 or 840 SSD, nothing more.

The OEM, iBuyPower, doesn't carry Samsung SSDs. The Intel I picked has very good read and write speeds, and the size somewhat future-proofs me.

5.) use a 3TB WD Green as Datastorage.

2TB was the biggest WD of any sort the OEM offers. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Ryu]

My primary advice would be to get a much weaker system, and upgrade more often if necessary.

- I´d start at Tomshardware for CPU choice: here. The cheap one should to the trick (and is cheaper than in the test.)

- The crossfire stuff is not worth it IMO. Power consumption, noise and heat are all serious considerations for such a setup.

- Your system should run fine with 8GB of memory, unless you use that thing professionally. AFAIK memory speed is not important for performance for the i-cores, so maybe reconsider your choice based on CPU. DO CHECK COMPATIBILITY WITH YOUR BOARD! I spend most of last Friday installing Win7 again and again and again, until we had the RAM isolated as troublemaker. Bought memory from the compatibility list, crashes are gone completely.

- I´ll second Stahlseele and suggest a 256MB or smaller SSD.

[StealthSigma]

Yep. My wonderful, three year old but still gaming-powerful PC, has died. I bricked it, somehow, whl installing the Blu-Ray Drive I got for Christmas. Must have caused a short across the mainboard, and fried the CMOS / BIOS / whatchamacallit-thingie (nope, I'm not a computer guru).

Is this factual or an assumption?

Here's some basic troubleshooting steps to make sure you're not committing an ID ten T error.

1. Check to make sure the power supply is plugged in.
* If this is your problem then I shall smack you and tell you to plug it in.
2. Check to make sure the power supply switch (if it has one) is on rather than off.
* If this is your problem then I shall still smack you, just not as hard as if #1 was the problem, and tell you to flip the switch.
3. Check for idle LED light on motherboard while power supply is on.
* If you have no idle light then either the PSU is not getting power to the motherboard or the motherboard has an issue (or your motherboard doesn't have one).

I'm generally leery of any PSU related issues and failures and yours sounds like a PSU failure. It's practically impossible to tell how a PSU failed and when it does it's the single component most likely to damage other components of a computer depending on how it fails. Of course, you can't tell if it damage other components until you get a replacement PSU.

[nezumi]

I'm also kind of curious how installing an optical drive could have killed a computer. When you turn it on, does the fan start up? You didn't drop any screws on the motherboard, did you?

(If the BIOS isn't starting up, it's either the PSU or motherboard. That's pretty easy to diagnose. I'd be surprised if the processor is damaged.)

Building a computer is pretty easy to do. I taught my eight-year-old. The only real important part is de-static yourself and hold everything by the edges where there's no conducting bits.

But it sounds like that's not your cup of tea, and that's fine (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Consider either selling your old components to a local geek who can use them, or donate them. There's a place in my area which rebuilds computers for schools.

What OS are you putting on?

[StealthSigma]

I'm also kind of curious how installing an optical drive could have killed a computer. When you turn it on, does the fan start up? You didn't drop any screws on the motherboard, did you?

Well, it could be that adding the optical drive drew more current than the PSU could handle. Also failing to ground himself while installing could cause damage....

[Bigity]

Ah I remember the days of dropping that kind of coin on a computer.


Then I had kids. And for some reason they insist on being fed and having clothes and toys. Back in my day...!! etc

I'm actually switching to a laptop here in a few months when the old desktop is finally getting replaced. I guess that prevents me from upgrading as often, but the portability will be nice as I travel frequently enough now in my new job that there are times when I want to fire up a game or something from the hotel.

I will say that the 480 gig SSD is alot of money you probably won't get much use out of. By the time you'd need a system drive that big, the price will probably have come way down. I mean, I could load up all of my steam games, pics, and music onto that size SSD and still have lots left over, and putting music and pics on there is a waste anyway.

[Ryu]

Here is a suggestion that even uses the Crossfire stuff.

CODE

Q4 2012 $2,000 PC Components
Processor:    Intel Core i7-3770K (Ivy Bridge): 3.5 GHz Base Clock Rate, 3.9 GHz Maximum Turbo Boost, 8 MB Shared L3 Cache    $320
Graphics:     2 x MSI R7970-2PMD3GD5/OC: Radeon HD 7970 3 GB, In CrossFire    $780
Motherboard:  Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H: LGA 1155, Intel Z77 Express    $150
Memory        G.Skill F3-1600C8D-8GAB: DDR3-1600 C8, 4 GB x 2 (8 GB)    $50
System Drive  Mushkin MKNSSDCR240GB-DX: 240 GB, SATA 6Gb/s SSD    $175
Storage       Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST31500341AS: 1.5 TB, 7200 RPM Hard Drive $80
Optical       Asus BW-12B1ST: 12x BD-R, 16x DVD±R, 2x BD-RE    $80
Case          Cooler Master Storm Enforcer SGC-1000-KWN1    $85
Power         Corsair HX750: ATX12V V2.3 80 PLUS Gold    $145
CPU Cooler    Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo RR-212E-20PK-R2     $35
Total Cost      $1,900

[StealthSigma]

Okay. Let's not forget that he's also paying for the labor to build and test the device. That's easily $500 of the total cost and possibly pushing closer towards $750-$1000.

[Stahlseele]

what? O.o
building such a Computer takes, if you install all the OS-Updates and certain Software, all of 4 Hours.
Even 100 Bucks for assembly is an hourly wage of 25 bucks. 500 Bucks for Assembly and some testing?
Absurd. o.O

[StealthSigma]

what? O.o
building such a Computer takes, if you install all the OS-Updates and certain Software, all of 4 Hours.
Even 100 Bucks for assembly is an hourly wage of 25 bucks. 500 Bucks for Assembly and some testing?
Absurd. o.O

In the US, $50/hr is pretty common for manufacturing. Most computing and technology labor costs are upwards of $120-$150/hr when billed out. Then you have the overhead costs of the business that are also being included on top of it.

[nezumi]

Well, it could be that adding the optical drive drew more current than the PSU could handle. Also failing to ground himself while installing could cause damage....

That was my thought (that and the clue that he can't get to the BIOS screen). Unless the PC was custom-built for expandaibility and gaming, the PSU is almost certainly strained with the default loadout. One more thing ... But a new PSU is $100 and one of the easiest pieces of hardware to install (assuming you don't drop it on said mobo).

Someone showed me a cool doohicky where you install a small SSD literally on top of a standard drive, and it works as a super-fast page file. It was about $150. Looked pretty slick.

I'd also echo the comments that, currently, AMD is probably not the best choice. I love AMD, but Intel just came out with their new Ivy Bridge, and AMD is a little behind for the moment. You might get a price break, but otherwise I wouldn't see much reason to go for the lesser architecture (especially for a gaming machine).

[X-Kalibur]

This is why I build all my computers. I spent around $1500 - $1700 on my last computer (last year) and I've had no major problems, although sometimes the SSDs give me a litle grief... they don't appear to be entirely bug free yet. I'm also running it on a Micro ITX board and in case that is barely larger than my Xbox360. Building a computer from scratch is daunting at first, but once you've done it a couple of times it become relatively easy.

[Ryu]

In the US, $50/hr is pretty common for manufacturing. Most computing and technology labor costs are upwards of $120-$150/hr when billed out. Then you have the overhead costs of the business that are also being included on top of it.

Hereabouts the whole service is available for 100€ if bought from a supplier with competitive component prices. My group of friends did this DIY all the time when we were 18, and it is still a rewarding accomplishment even at our price level. Or said another way: If I could get around $750 for assembling a PC, going to University would have been a great waste of time.

[_Pax._]

My primary advice would be to get a much weaker system, and upgrade more often if necessary.

"Much weaker" wouldn't be what I want.

You're also basically advising the guy who just bricked one computer with a simple install, to build the new one from the ground up. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Is this factual or an assumption?

When cycling the power button, I get two POST codes, alternating, for as long as I leave the device pored on. Two long beeps, followed by two long and one short. In the meantime, nothing appears on the screen, and the USB devices (including keyboard and mouse) receive no power. The fans, and their LEDs, work ... but constantly cycle up, then down, in time with the alternating POST codes.

I'm also kind of curious how installing an optical drive could have killed a computer. When you turn it on, does the fan start up? You didn't drop any screws on the motherboard, did you?

It is entirely possible that the BRD installation was completely coincidental to a failure just waiting to happen. Or, static electricity. Or, I had to disconnect a few power cables in order to get into the case to where I could put the new drive in, and hook it up for power and data; I may have damaged somethign when taking those cables out, or putting them back in. Honestly, I don't know for certain what the ultimate cause is. I only know, that last week it was fine, and this week it's a beeping brick. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Lucky for me, RE: dropping screws, the case has tool-less drive bays.

Building a computer is pretty easy to do. I taught my eight-year-old. The only real important part is de-static yourself and hold everything by the edges where there's no conducting bits.

Your eight-year-old had the advantage of a teacher who presumably knows what s/he is doing. That gives the kid a clear advantge over "I can read up on it over the internet, but that's about it" me.

Consider either selling your old components to a local geek who can use them, or donate them. There's a place in my area which rebuilds computers for schools.

Yep, that's the plan, now. If it'd still been in working condition I'd've given it to my mother, but ... *shrug* ... the BluRay and HDD come out - g/f wants the one, all my shadowrun stuff is on the other. Then I'll donate it, somewhere or other. Windows Serial# included (sticker right on the case has that).

What OS are you putting on?

The new one? Win7 Pro 64.

Okay. Let's not forget that he's also paying for the labor to build and test the device. That's easily $500 of the total cost and possibly pushing closer towards $750-$1000.

Exactly.

what? O.o
building such a Computer takes, if you install all the OS-Updates and certain Software, all of 4 Hours.
Even 100 Bucks for assembly is an hourly wage of 25 bucks. 500 Bucks for Assembly and some testing?
Absurd. o.O

How about taking the extra time to carefully sleeve and route all the power and data cables as neatly and out-of-the-way as possible?

How about installing sound-reduction throughout the case?

And then there's the burn-in and testing time: they install the OS and all relevant drivers, then put the system through it's paces to make sure the install is stable. That's more than an hour's worth of work, for certain.

Building a computer from scratch is daunting at first, but once you've done it a couple of times it become relatively easy.

See, here's the thing. Yes, I just bought a $3500 computer But, I can't afford to completely throw away a thousand dollars, because I bought the wrong parts, or damage them making a mistake during installation. I'd rather pay half that thousand to an OEM, and be sure it works right the first time.





And in the end, I'm really not happy feeling like I have to defend how and where I chose to spend my money. >:(

[X-Kalibur]

We're all just trying to inform you on how to save a buck or two. Take it or leave it. I used to buy pre-built computers until I realized how much less it would cost to do it myself. Because I'm not making enough money for it to not be worth my time. So now I do some research on parts on compatibility and build away, and when I started I read everything VERY closely. I'm far from a tech guru - I'm just a gamer who builds his own rigs.

You don't need to defend your actions and you've already done it anyhow.

[Ryu]

"Much weaker" wouldn't be what I want.

You're also basically advising the guy who just bricked one computer with a simple install, to build the new one from the ground up. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

I had to do some research to find a solution up your alley, and I´m used to much lower assembly prices. And then I enjoy researching new toys. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

The system you ordered is very powerful, and should be able to feed that monster of a display well (another thing you get for the price margin btw). So in the spirit of the season I feel I could maybe allow you to proceed as planned. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Ryu]

When cycling the power button, I get two POST codes, alternating, for as long as I leave the device pored on. Two long beeps, followed by two long and one short. In the meantime, nothing appears on the screen, and the USB devices (including keyboard and mouse) receive no power. The fans, and their LEDs, work ... but constantly cycle up, then down, in time with the alternating POST codes.

various beepcodes ; another list

Could be one POST message from the Award/Phoenix BIOS variant (2-2-1) pointing at the memory. We´d need maker and type of your motherboard to continue. Check if the RAM is firmly in place just to make sure.

[_Pax._]

The board manufacturor is Gigabyte. And what I'm getting, is not consistent with what Gigabyte says their POST codes are: http://forum.giga-byte.co.uk/index.php?PHP...pic,2248.0.html