[X] My Assistant

[Mantis]

So I was thinking about just how long various bits of gear characters carry about last on a single charge and wanted to know what others thought. Now I know in a city environment this isn't usually a big deal as you can generally find a place to plug in. But what happens when you are out in the wilds or the arctic or a really nasty bit of the Barrens where there is no place to plug and charge? Vehicles and drones have a standard power cycle of 6 hours unless you upgrade it but what about your commlink or smart gun? Medkits and their autodoc, area jammers and all sorts of gear need to be powered so it can certainly be a non-trivial issue in the right environment. Thoughts?

[_Pax._]

Portable solar charging station.

Also, given the general trend ... batteries may last MONTHS on a single charge by the 2070s. Some devices may not even use batteries, they may instead use teeny fuel cells, or even a microturbine generator (fuel getting low? break out the eye dropper).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micropower

[Medicineman]

Thoughts?

No need for Micromanagement and/or Hartwurst

HougH!
Medicineman

[Mach_Ten]

also, in the current decade we have devices that can draw power wirelessly from overhead powerlines ...

add half a century and I bet PO-WiFi ™ would replace batteries

and battery efficiency has increased exponentially in past months ... again .. in time the developments may mean an iPhone that can go longer than half a day !! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotfl.gif)

probably....

[Lionhearted]

They just need to find a way to upsize clock batteries

[_Pax._]

in time the developments may mean an iPhone that can go longer than half a day !! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotfl.gif)

probably....

Okay okay, that's enough of that. Try and keep your science fiction at least SLIGHTLY realistic, would you kindly?

;D

[Lionhearted]

Why are you... never mind.
Mach, you might want to cut back on the plasmids... Just saying.

[Falconer]

I'd go with using the drone rules as a basis. 6 hours of operation... before needing a recharge.

Unless you're in the barrens constantly or the wilderness... I'd probably avoid most of this as extra book keeping and hassle and irrelevant to the game. I'd only worry about it again if you're going to be away from civilization for a reasonable length of time such as a week/month in the wilderness/barrens.


For most mobile devices I'd up that to something simple like a day between recharges. Allow options like extra battery or economy like are available for drones... to up that.

For stuff like commlinks... you might treat it more based on their physical matrix attributes... like say 30 hours - response - signal. For a stock DR3 standard average link that comes to 24 hours == 1 day. Explanation: faster chips need more power, and if you're putting out signal 8 power levels!! you're going to need some juice! Maybe more complication than is called for... but just trying to model reality a bit. Overall that doesn't give much variability though so I'm not a big fan of that particular math...

Maybe (Response + Signal)/6 == days... (3+3)/6 == 1 day... that works a lot better. Really cheap low power crap like disposable phones which don't run much would go for 2 or 3 days... while your tricked out 6/6 commlink would go for 12 hours... 24 if you tossed in an extra battery or economy device upgrade.


As far has how to recharge... suncell isn't all that hard to go with. Simply plugging into a vehicle/outlet for a few minutes... (look at how fast stun batons or flash paks charge). Gridguide I'll address below.

I take the view that stuff like cyberlimbs does something akin to 'potato power'... it uses the chemical energy in your blood to recharge itself constantly... so the limb actually gets power from your digestion and normal body energy cycle just as if it were a meat limb. But that's another option right there... the datajack is sort of like a USB port... fiber optic with a little bit of power to recharge/run small toys. That energy isn't free... it's simply reflected in your food budget instead of an electric bill.



I'd be careful with the inductive charging techniques... wireless power and all works to a degree.. but you can generally only pull very small amounts of energy out of the ether. Enough to run a digital watch or some other micropower system... not much more unless you're right under a power line. (and then power companies have come and sued successfully for stolen power, they're not in the business of selling unmetered power).

That said... grid guide is an excellent example of inductive power... they put the power lines under the street and electric cars inductively power themselves off them... the grid guide can meter how far you've gone and bill electricity accordingly based on knowing your auto's location and localized power draws. It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to state that many low power accessories simply steal power off grid guide.

[Mantis]

Cool. I was more looking at this from a lost in the wilderness sort of idea. Many of those sort of stories become, at least somewhat, about resource management. I would see this issue showing up with a team that needs to choose just what sort of encounter justifies using their smartlinks and tacnet and other toys they usually take for granted. Sort of another way to remove toys they rely on all the time without having to actually take them away, at least for one adventure.
I don't want to micro-manage this of course and like I said, it isn't an issue in cities for the most part. I had been reading David Weber's Prince Roger series and a big issue they had through out was keeping their high tech gear in working shape for the final encounter. This is what got me thinking about power and perhaps doing a much shorter adventure with those books as a source.

[KCKitsune]

If you're not completely opposed to WAR allow the mage of the group to learn recharge. Problem solved.

[_Pax._]

Well, if they KNOW they're going to be away from a reliable power grid, and have any common sense whatsoever, then reasonably speaking they should know to bring along a solar charging unit or two. IRL, right now, they even have backpacks with solar panels built-in, specifically so your devices can charge while you walk or hike during the day.

[Mantis]

The idea is an unplanned stay in the wilds rather than having time to prep for everything. I've done the solar cell back up before and if the mage thinks to pick up the recharge spell that would nicely solve everything. Lets say prep and the spell aren't an option.

[SpellBinder]

also, in the current decade we have devices that can draw power wirelessly from overhead powerlines ...

...

And to think Nikolai Tesla was working on this about a century ago...

[_Pax._]

And to think Nikolai Tesla was working on this about a century ago...

Actually ... not so much. He wanted to broadcast that power wirelessly, through the air, over distances of MILES. Not one of his better ideas - and hey, even supergeniouses like him, can have a brain-failure now and then.

[SpellBinder]

Hey, gotta start somewhere. First it's meters, then then dozens of meters, and soon we'll be well into kilometers. Just look at computer storage space now. Thirty years ago 5GB was huge, now it's nothing. Then battery life for a cell phone was maybe a day, now my own (and old model) lasts a week between having to be charged.

If in shadowrun you can use your own body's bioelectric field to network your PAN, why not have it be able to power or augment the power supply of small devices?

[_Pax._]

No, it won't be "well into kilometers". The laws of physics preclude it. Push that much power into the atmosphere, and do you know what the result is?

Lightning. Lots of lightning. Lightning all over the place.

[Jaid]

Actually ... not so much. He wanted to broadcast that power wirelessly, through the air, over distances of MILES. Not one of his better ideas - and hey, even supergeniouses like him, can have a brain-failure now and then.

i wouldn't say it was a bad idea. frankly, it's a great idea.

he just neglected to look as closely at the math involved as he should have, and may have just possibly missed by an order of magnitude or two.

but hey, the idea wasn't a bad one. it's just those pesky physics getting in the way.

(and in any event, who's to say it couldn't eventually become possible? i know i've seen research on making a device that wirelessly electrocutes people at a few hundred feet by charging a pathway through the air... although, they always claim that it's gonna be "real soon now", and that was quite a while ago, so i imagine they've hit a few technical snags (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) )

[Novocrane]

Thermal difference, kinetic energy and static electricity are all ways to recharge devices in SR, right? I don't see why devices that have all three should ever run out of juice, unless you leave them in a controlled set of circumstances with the aim of draining the battery.

[Pepsi Jedi]

I think in game terms, it's not something you have to worry about unless you're in the desert or middle of the ocean or something with out any sources of power what so ever. Batteries are growing bigger and bigger, tech is shrinking smaller and smaller. The Comlinks and such probably do have some sort of limiting factor but it's going to be large enough to the point where you don't worry about it. Charging for an hour once a week or once a month type of thing. So unless you're in an "Unusual circumstance" and purposefully are denied any sort of power source to recharge it, I don't think it'll come into play. Even in the middle of the desert or Amazon or something you're likely to have a vehicle or something where you could plug in and recharge.

I personally have two Ipads, a cell phone, an Ipod, and a laptop. I don't think I've ever, in my life, had any of the above drain all the way to 00.0%. My laptop got down to 7%.. maybe 5% once when I was on it playing wow for hours in bed, and it was simple to just plug in the cord. I carry chargers with me in my EDC bag or Tactical go bag too, and a small power strip (( Makes BUNCHES of friends at airports.)) Car, or anyplace with power and I'm good to go.

Yes shadowruns are likely to take you into less savory places, but places with absolutely no power or no way to recharge? You gotta think those are going to be few and far between. You gotta think even in the middle of the desert or something you're not going to be a weeks walk from your 'base' or 'vehicle'. Nor in the jungle. If you ARE going to be on foot, more than a week from a vehicle or base of operations, you know such and you bring a recharge or full battery.

You're more likely to find locations with out wifi to hook up to than with out any power sources.

[CanRay]

Charge off of body heat. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Shaidar]

The idea is an unplanned stay in the wilds rather than having time to prep for everything. I've done the solar cell back up before and if the mage thinks to pick up the recharge spell that would nicely solve everything. Lets say prep and the spell aren't an option.

Has the rigger got a vehicle? If so as long as it has fuel I'd guess their smaller devices can get a recharge.

[Halinn]

Actually ... not so much. He wanted to broadcast that power wirelessly, through the air, over distances of MILES. Not one of his better ideas - and hey, even supergeniouses like him, can have a brain-failure now and then.

It's not so much that it's a bad idea, but more along the lines that we can choose to have wireless electricity, or wireless everything else. Radio, TV, phones, internet, etc. To have enough electricity going around in the air, it needs to fill enormous amounts of the spectrum. Also, pouring tons of energy into the atmosphere is quite wasteful and possibly dangerous.

[_Pax._]

[...] dangerous.

Not just possibly. Definitely.

[Lantzer]

On a related note, read the old Heinlein story "Waldo". The idea of radiant power is kind of central to the story. It's also the source of the name "waldo" for remote manipulators.

[CanRay]

Also the origin of Waldos, period.