What's the best way to twink you've ever heard of?, Or done? Options

[I Eat Time]

My take is, if a player knows he's taking advantage of a flaw in the mechanics to play the game, then he's really undermining the spirit of role-playing-games, and is better suited for video games or Magic: The Gathering.

Don't get me wrong, I'll give them admiration and respect, but my games are run on stories, not on mechanics, and all my players know this. They also know that taking advantage of semibroken or broken rules really ticked me off, and I'd use the stories to get vindictive.

It can be argued that players should be allowed to do whatever they can do with the canon rules, but I'm going to say that the buck stops when people stop having fun, and that's including the GM.

[GreatChicken]

Personally, I wouldn't mind munchkining IF the person comes up with a good, unique background for it. Unfortunately, the general trend for munchkins (and munchkin wannabes) is that their backgrounds leave a lot to be desired.

[toturi]

[Austere Emancipa...]

[Lilt]

@SirKodiak:
There's a better word for that form of munchkinning. It goes like: MAGIK IZ TEH WINNR!!!!!!11

I'm not attempting to insult you, it's just one of those things. Magic Vs Mundane = Magic wins. Spirits, Invisibility (with Stealth), and Astral Surveilance are all things mundane defences have a lot of troubble combating. that's why any competent running or defence team needs magical support, and why "Geek the enemy Mage first" is SOP. If the enemy awakened support dies, then a powerful mage could win single-handedly. If your awakened support dies, the enemy mage beats you to a pulp and there's very little you can do about it.

[I Eat Time]

The biggest problem with munchkins and gamebreakers isn't that they bend and contort without ever shattering a rule to create some insane stuff, that's just crafty, as the presence of this thread indicates. I admire munchkins who can think like that, because I sure can't. I'm not jealous, I just think it's pretty cool that it can be done.

No, the biggest problem is playing in a group with one munchkin. It's either incredibly easy, with the twink doing most of the work, constantly arguing with the GM, and single-handedly creaming over the competition, or it's much worse. The GM feels the need to put up competition and challenge to all the players. Problem being, what stands as competative to a twink is usually Dragon missles, insanely powerful military cyberzombies, Great Dragons themselves, or other incredible nasties. Which take out the rest of the group.

It's no fun to play a game where you are as unto a GOD in the gameworld, one of the main reasons I personally don't exploit so many rules to my advantage. So it's not just about 'pissing off the GM'. It can ruin the game for other players.

[Eyeless Blond]

[Kagetenshi]

[A Clockwork Lime]

Suppressive fire works quite nicely against invisibility or anything else of that nature, assuming you know someone's around (ala Thermosense Organs and whatnot). Visibility doesn't play any role in it whatsoever, so that +8 penalty is non-existant, and the dodge test is generally harder especially if you do know exactly where the target is.

[Lilt]

[Kagetenshi]

Sensor dice are halved? Where is this? Anything other than the FAQ support that?

Edit: I found the mention in the FAQ, and it is quite clearly smoking something. [Edit: Active] Sensor tests get bonuses for being within LOS, so II shouldn't do a thing but kill that bonus.

~J

[snowRaven]

Okay, time to twink; refining concepts already stated will be the topic for today.

Koborokuru Dwarf (cause they're harder to hit, can take more damage, resist lots of stuff, and they're as fast as humans. Natural Immunity(Narcoject), Natural Immunity(Atropine))
Albino (for that extra willpower, pick color blind as the extra flaw)
Edges: Exceptional Body, Magic Resistance 4, Quick Healer, Toughness, Will to Live 3.
Flaws: Pacifist, Dark Secret, Ugly and Doesn't Care, Uneducated, Allergy(Gold, Mild)

Bioware(all cultured): Trauma Damper, Platelet Factory, Suprathyroid Gland, Pain Editor, Toxin Extractor 1 (3.85)
Genetech: Phenotypic Alteration (Body), Angiotensin, Calcitonin

Cyberware: Cyberhand w/Guardian Angel Biomonitor w/DNI, Titanium Bonelacing(beta), Nanite Facilitator + Hive w/Nanite Symbiotes, Dermal Sheath 3(beta), Synthetic Cyberskull(beta), Display Link(beta), Datajack(beta) (linked to Biomonitor and Display Link), Auto-Injector, reusable(beta; anti-coagulants), Auto-Injector, reusable(Trauma Patch) (5.01)


Body 10 (18 for damage resistance tests; Physical Overflow 13)
Quick 7 x 3
Str 5
Cha 2
Int 6 (5 with Pain Editor activated)
Will 8 (9 with Pain Editor activated)

Combat Pool 10

SmallUnit Tactics 6 (used for extra combat pool)

Formfitting Fullsuit (4/1); (Chemical Seal 5)
Armor Vest w/Plates (5/4) (Nonconductive 7 + Dikoted)
Heavy Jumpsuit (2/4) (Fire Resistance 6)
Forearm Guards (-/+1)
Security Helmet (+1/+2)
Bone Lacing (+1/+1)
Dermal Sheathing (-/+2)
Total Armor: (10/11(12 with guards))

Ballistic Riot Shield (3/1) to hide behind

This little unassuming fellow can survive most things, and when he's taken too much punishment he just turns on the Pain Editor and runs away. The ideal is to fit him with two cyberfeet with retractable cyberskates, but that will require more betaware and alpha legs (change the hand to a lower leg in this case - the biomonitor and the skates take up 6 ECU together, so it fits)

He could be made even tougher if you SURGE him and hand-pick the effects, but that's too much even for twinking, I think. (Positive: Resistance to Poisons 3(5), Dermal Deposits(2), Gills(4). Negative: Allergy(Silver; Mild)(-2), Tusks(-1), Sensitive Neural Structure II(-4))

And if you want other types of twinkiness I have a few others up my sleeve :grinbig:

[Eyeless Blond]

er, what's with the cyberskull?

Oh, and add on Cultured Nitchiating Membranes. Even better than Flare Comp, especially since you didn't get your eyes replaced. :D

[Shockwave_IIc]

You don't have to get your eyes replaced anyway. But what happens if it starts suffering stress???

[Eyeless Blond]

Um, then it suffers stress? That's kinda like wondering why a runner should carry a gun with him on a run, if firing it might draw the guard's attention. :P Honestly though, I don't much like how those rules are put together in M&M for this very reason; there is essentially no difference in a single bioware system's vulnerability between index .1 and 1, but a big jump between 1 and 1.1. Further, a single bioware system is more individually vulnerable than the same system in a cluster of other boiware systems. I'm really not sure much thought was put into those rules, other than "let's make something up that uses d6s and is unnecessarily complex, just to confuse everyone!"

Besides, it really fits in with the albino condition, speaking from experience. I have albinism, and I can tell you some days I'd give my right nut for polarized flare comp transitional eye covers. I'd never have to worry about changing between these three different pairs of glasses (some for inside work, one for outside work), and polarization really cuts down on glare, which is absolute *death* for people with sun-sensetive eyes.

[Lilt]

If I could direct your attention to the Drakeish Metahumans thread I think I may have 'discovered' a new and improved way to twink. :)

We have:
Night One Adept with a flying speed of 96kph before you even factor-in athletics, and 132kph assuming 12 athletics dice (they are an adept after-all).

Troll Physad Drakes with body and strength both in the 20s from chargen

Astral guardians with natural astral armor 6 and +1 reach.

[northern lights]

physad POM using points system for a million nuyen

edged weapons 6 improved edged weapons 6 plus a bonded force 6 reach 1 weapon focus

geas the magic power and get 24 spell points to bond focus at pp cost of 3

geas 1 point of magic loss and you have enhanced artichokes and reflex recorder

20 dice without combat pool 21 if you specialize

max strength and you could easily boost it with maybe a geased pp or bioware to a 9 or 10 then if it's an ork pump him up with some auto injected kamikaze and you're like 15+m with 20 dice at target 3

dikote for maximum muchiness.

[northern lights]

yup, geas the magic power to exclusive, you'll never use it anyway, you're just bondin the focus.

geas imp str >RML at 1 level cost .75
geas imp edged at 6 levels for a cost of 2.25

use talisman for both of those. use the weapon focus as the talisman.

muscle aug 3
reflex recorder
and enhanced artistry

auto injector, jolt alert - whatever .1 essence ware to allow magic loss to be offset with meditation geas

bonus str edge

dikote the beast with your remaining 28k

human - str11 base damage 15S with 21 dice specialized

find 5 points of flaws

ork - str13 base damage 18S with 21 dice specialized

attribute allocation:
657335

still have some room to play with flaws to increase some stuff.

edit:

sacrifice an att point from will and qui and make it a troll for 20Sand get the extra reach.

imagine taking 2 geasa for more cyber/bio!!!

[Lilt]

Hey, northern lights, you forgot to make him ambitwinkerous!

As Weapon Foci add their rating to the skill used to wield them, main-hand weapon foci bonuses also apply to the off-hand weapon when dual wielding and vice-versa! IE: you add ambitwinxterity to that mix and you start rolling 30 dice before pool!

Even better, you could buy a short off-hand weapon and wield it getting the same bonuses as if you had a main weapon focus (except it's cheaper karma-wise and you'd probably need to lose your reach bonus if you were trying to damage a creature with immunity(normal weapons).

[snowRaven]

Eyeless Blond, the cyberskull is there for the wonderful bonus of negating the damage level increase to called shots to the head (which is what people will start doing when he keeps getting up) - it can be removed and replaced with some more nifty bioware, if desired (like the membranes - I forgot about those!)

[northern lights]

yeah lilt, i specifically went with a reach weapon. and in doing so you don't have the ambidextwinkity factor available with the build points. well you could with the human, but not the others.

you can do it with a reach 2 weapon as well, though you can't culture anything fom the cost. but you are totally correct, if you could find a decent reach 0 weapon, get 2 foci and ambidextwinkity and there you are with somewhere around 30 dice.

assuming that the ambi goes off of base skill and hence adds 3 dice. and that you can bond 2 foci. i see no reason you couldn't

5/7 skill
+3 ambi
+6 focus 1
+6 focus 2
+6 imp abil (can't exceed magic)
+1 reflex recorder
+1 enhanced artwinkies

that's 30. your call as to multiple foci, but hey mages gut multiple sustaining foci, right?

oh yeah the down side is the 2 difference in power.
gee only like 13 s for the human.

edit:

OMFG!!! i just realized that reach 0 weapon foci are insanely expensive. for some reason i thought they were cheaper. damn, i guess 2 foci aren't the way to go. oh well, you can still get 26 dice. i don't think that it works adding 12 (skill+focus) and 6 (half (skill + focus)) nor adding 12 (skill+focus) and 9 ((half skill) + focus)so no 30s. if i am wrong though someone correct me.

[A Clockwork Lime]

Why go with Reach 0 weapons at all?

Snag Ambidexterity, geas away your cybernetic Fangs (-1 Reach) and Horns (-1 Reach) [only 0.40 Essence with retractable versions of each]. Might as well add some Venom Sacks for no Essence and only 500¥.

To have those enchanted as Weapon Foci, it costs 90,000¥/Force and 2 Karma/Force. Quite a bargain over 0 Reach, and with Close Combat, Reach becomes a null point and you're dishing out a ton of dice with your Cyber-Implant Combat skill. You may look like you're having a seizure with all the head action, but...

Now if we could only find a Reach -2 weapon, we'd actually be making money on 'em if we had 'em enchanted (-10,000¥/Force). :D

[northern lights]

the only reason we were looking at reach 0 was the amidexterity thing and the (wrongly) assumed lower costs.

[A Clockwork Lime]

Ambidexterity works just fine with cybernetic implants and Reach -1 weapons. :) Use your horns to deflect or parry your opponents weapon then sink your fangs into the exposed target you left open for yourself. <chomp> You even get to deliver a chemical attack on top of that.

Get 'em dikoted and the damage increases to (STR+1)S for the horns or (STR+2)M for the fangs, too.

[Lilt]

Great idea Lime! What you want to do now is make them all foci, then actually fight with two dikoted cyberspurs. AFAIK They all use cyber implant combat, so the bonuses from the reach 0 weapons carry-over to the weapons you're actually fighting with! (may depend on your definition of wield)