Your munch-fu is superior!, Good adept powers Options

[A Clockwork Lime]

Yes there is. No power can have a rating higher than your true Magic Attribute. Thus no starting character can begin with Magical Power 7 or higher unless they begin as an initiate.

[Kakkaraun]

Yeah, I thought that, but I thought that there was a specific and very apparent injunction against that in the description for the Magical Power Adept Power.

[TinkerGnome]

Since it depends on being able to initiate at character gen, which would raise your magic, and you're not required to spend power points as soon as you get them, it still works. Just not quite as well.

[Kakkaraun]

How about this house rule then: "No initiation at char gen, period."

There, now we're all happy. Except for the munchkins. And they have enough 1 point flaws to play with that they won't care anymore within three hours.

[A Clockwork Lime]

Maybe I'm missing something. But what's so uber powerful about having a Magical Power of 7 if you initiate once? Physical mages get shafted during initiation to begin with, so he has to take a Power Point in place of a Metamagic Technique to do it anyway.

This place has the strangest logic I've ever seen.

[Kakkaraun]

Casting higher-level spells without Drain. Having metamagic. I'm not even talking about this situation, really, I'm just saying that initiation at chargen is a bad idea /in general/. And yes, this place does have strange logic. Always did.

[A Clockwork Lime]

1) You always suffer Drain when you cast a spell. The only thing a higher Magic Attribute gives you is that its Stun instead of Physical.
2) You wouldn't have Metamagic with the Physical Mage.
3) Metamagic is not unbalancing to begin with.

[Kakkaraun]

1) You always suffer Drain when you cast a spell.

I meant Physical Drain. Come on.

2) You wouldn't have Metamagic with the Physical Mage.

"In general." Do we need to look that up for you, in a book? Yes, a b-o-o-k? :)

3) Metamagic is not unbalancing to begin with.

It's more unbalancing than "no Metamagic," isn't it. And weren't you complaining in some other thread that "Magic is broken enough already, don't make it worse?"

EDIT: You're a real ninja with that edit button, aintcha? :)

[A Clockwork Lime]

In the above scenario you would not have a metamagic talent. You would have had to have purchased a Power Point with that grade of initiation in order to get Magical Power 7. Thus, since you selected a Power Point, you don't get a Metamagic Talent.

As for your latter logic, I'm just not going to bother with that kind of logic.

[Kakkaraun]

Once again, IN GENERAL. IN FUCKING GENERAL. I'm not talking about physmages, I'm talking about the regular mage who starts the game off with Possessing and Divination or summat. Seriously. You might want to be King of the Wicker Man, but you're nowhere near subtle enough.

[mfb]

initiation at chargen allows characters a higher degree of specialization. they pay for it in depth, though; an initiate will have, maximum (assuming no bought power points), 13 force worth of spells--23 if they're aspected. anybody who's built a mage before knows that's not a lot to work with.

[Kakkaraun]

Buy all of your high-force-required type spells at gen, and as soon as you start playing you could astrally quest at a somewhat low TN to have to pay only 1 karma for a spell...something like that.

Kick me in the head. UMLAUT!

[mfb]

all your high-force-required spells? all two of them, then?

[Kakkaraun]

Yeah. Precisely.

[mfb]

that's a very inefficient character design. you'll have initiation, and nothing else. why would someone hire you?

[Glyph]

If you have Firebolt: 6 and Toxic Wave: 6, what other spells do you need? 8)

[broho_pcp]

you might want fashion to repair your clothing after the acid rebounds off their burning, melting bodies. :lick: like in robocop (except he wasn't burning, just melting)

[Moonstone Spider]

Usual improved melee combat skills
Killing Hands L
Delay Damage, Obvious
Transmit Attack

Skill:
Performance (Mime)

Physad assassin dresses as a Mime and, as the target goes by, pretends to throw a flurry of strange punches at the target 20 feet away. The Target laughs at the silly mime and goes on his way, then dies later that afternoon.

[Mana Child]

[FlakJacket]

[Lilt]

What is so wrong with having a metamagic or two at chargen? You're spending a respectable number of spell points to do it that could be spent on spells or binding foci.

[randomarguments]
In-fact learning a single force 6 spell with no limitations is probably going to take longer in-game than joining a metamagical group and initiating once. As for using astral quests to reduce karma: Time is karma and money.

Even if a character somehow manages to get 18 dice on his test to learn a spell, it'd still take him on-average 14 days to learn the spell. That's 1 day for the astral quest, 6 days on the first attempt to learn the spell, 1 day on another astral quest, and another 6 days on a second attempt to learn the spell. In that period of time the character has probably lost one or two runs worth of karma simply by not going on them.

As for learning all of your high force spells with starting spell points: From my experience most people tend to go with high force spells at chargen anyway. OK: there's the obligatory F1 increase reflexes +3 and F1 improved invisibility, but they only cost 1 karma anyway and the other spell will be force high force.
[/randomarguments]

[Moonstone Spider]

Carrying the plan on that mime even further consider this:

Killing Hands L
Delay Damage (Subtle)
Distance Strike
Blindfighting

Any Martial Art 6 + blindfighting

Subtle delay damage means you need not make anything like an attack to kill an enemy. Distance Strike lets you do it at Magic Meters away. Blindfighting (You could probably also use Astral Perception) means you can make the attack even when blindfolded with a fair chance of success. Your character can kill just about anybody within his magic range even if he's tied up in a chair and blindfolded. And since he can delay the damage he could, if captured, easily kill every person in the room before the first one realizes he's hit.

It'd be even better with some Improved Unarmed Combat of course.

[toturi]

Cyclops ghoul adept (Geased)

Attribute Boost: Strength

Muscle Augmentation (Geased)

Deadly Hands

Distance Strike

[Lilt]

Blindfighting is good, but under most circumstances (IE: When there's not a white noise generator around) you'd be better with ultrasound vision and some other mod such-as natural thermo.

[A Clockwork Lime]