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#1
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935 ![]() |
Sorcery When you cast a spell, what you're doing is forming a temporary astral construct, channelling the astral energy from the ambient mana surrounding you through your body. The difficulty in forming the construct depends on any number of factors, including where the magician is and where the construct is to form (i.e. the target of the spell). If any condition exists which makes it more difficult to channel or manipulate mana (a background count, magical barriers, mental exhuastion, etc) at either location, then the difficulty of the spell increases. Note that this does not require a "stream of mana" towards the target! The temporary astral construct, or "spell engine," is a fourth dimensional construct. The casting magician must access the astral plane (channel mana through their body) in order to form the construct (a three-dimensional shadow of the fourth-dimensional spell engine exists, of course, but without access to astral energy it is no more than a complicated thought-shape.) It is unknown how magicians ground astral energy through their bodies in order to do this (one theory is that the elusive Magus Factor is an astral shadow within the magician's genetic code, allowing astral energy to cross in much the same manner as metagenes are activated, but giving the subject awareness of the energy, which can then be learned to be applied). Consider Ritual Sorcery. Because the magician(s) cannot sense the target directly, they must create or possess a link to the target. When the ritual is complete, the spell engine manifests at the target's location, but /does not pass through the intervening space between the caster(s) and the ragets/. Rather, the spell engine executes at the spot, as well as it can given whatever barriers or conditions exist which impeded the ability of the casters to manipulate mana. The spell engine is a very flexible and complicated object, which can be modified each time it is used by the caster. This is, in part, why spell forumlae for the same spells at different levels of compelxity do not aid the magician in learning the spell: a more complex spell engine can be easily simplified, but a more complicated spell engine may be of an entirely different shape than the one famiar to the magician! It is good in this case that the magician can modify spell engines to accept more mana for increased effect. The pivotal abilities of the sorceror are the skill of consciously manipulating astral energy, and the innate gift to channel such energy through their own bodies to realize such a skill. The body of skills and techniques known as Sorcery are, in fact, mental devices to better facilitate the impression of the magician's Will on the psycho-sensitive mana around him. Consider the metamagical technique of Centering. The Centering skill of the magician, be it a mantra or ritual action, focuses the concentration of the magician, allowing astral energy to be manipulated with greater ease (this even allows the magician to manipulate the energy as it channels through their body, thus lessening the physical and mental fatigue associated with channelling such energy). Essence, Aura, and Drain A complicated subject, the aura is a function of the Law of Similarity and the fourth-dimensional nature of astral space. Metagenes manifest because they are three-dimensional shadows of specific fourth-dimensional objects. When the ambient mana level rises to allow these objects to exist, mana grounds itself through these astral shadows, activating the metagenes. In a similiar fashion, all beings possess genes which, while astral shadows, do not do anything unusual in the presence of magical energy. The fourth-dimensional component of these astral shadows, however, form the basis of the aura. As the aura is a component of any being in which consists (and interacts with) psychosenstive mana, the aura becomes, by the Law of Similarity, a mirror of the being in the physical world, reflecting the emotions of the being. Changes in the physical being are reflected on the astral, as the Law of Similarity reflects the difference of the subject from the "Aural Template" supplied by the fourth-dimensional aspects of the genetic code. Because a magician presumably grounds ambient mana through the aura and into the physical body in order to manipulate astral forms and energies, and dissociation of the aura can impede this ability. <finish later> |
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#2
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,049 Joined: 24-March 03 Member No.: 4,323 ![]() |
I, for one, eagerly await the completion of this...deal... I don't suppose you've prepared a similarly in-depth analysis of shamanic theory? |
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#3
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Manus Celer Dei ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,008 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 ![]() |
*Scribble scribble scribble*
~J |
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#4
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Chicago Survivor ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 ![]() |
So, by this we could extrapolate that with a link of some kind a spell caster might not need LOS in a combat situation?
Example: Sec. Guard A gets finger blown off (don't ask), and guard A runs away with buddies to regroup at the security office. Mage picks up finger and tosses a power ball at the previous owner of said digit. Does this count as ritual or normal sorcery? |
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#5
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 ![]() |
LoS to component to hit the whole is the basis of ritual sorcery.
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#6
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 309 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,548 ![]() |
Whenever this conversation comes up, I wonder why the spell is called ManaBOLT. If nothing...bolt-ish happens, shouldn't it just be called "Hurt Person?"
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#7
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,616 Joined: 15-March 04 Member No.: 6,158 ![]() |
That's what happens when you play a game that originally started off as a thinly-veiled conversion of D&D. Mana Bolt = Magic Missile.
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#8
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 309 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,548 ![]() |
Well, not quite. But the main thing is, why haven't they changed it? The name, I mean?
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#9
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 ![]() |
The same reason that the rules for an Ares Viper Slivergun have changes from 2M3 to 9S(f) while the name has remain unchanged. Names are as critical a part of the story continuity as the continental shapes (actually, moreso). Spells were dropped (turn to goo), spells were added, but something that was not dropped would not be given a new name because the system rules have been adjusted.
Besides, the naming is as much IC as OOC, and if the first mage to come up with a good LoS single target mana damage combat spell called it "Manabolt" that is probably the name that would stick even when magical researchers prove that there is no "bolt" effect in the spell. |
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#10
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 749 Joined: 22-June 02 From: Parts Without Member No.: 2,897 ![]() |
A lot of the wacky thought on how the "bolt" spells do what they do comes from the wacky wording in the BBB. In the street grimoire, it states, under Manabolt:
which sure sounds like something is coming out of the caster and into the the target. Of course, the rules are plenty clear that this is not the case....two dozen pages earlier when it is stated, under Combat Spells....
Which....yeah....means..... *sigh* What you can get from this: Magic is wacky. It channels energy outside of things, into things, damaging them from within, whilst staying without, and it all happens so hella fast that no one is the wiser. Ish. Things were less confusing when Mountain explained them to me.... |
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#11
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Immortal Elf ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 ![]() |
"channel destructive power into the target" is different than "channel destructive power that comes from the caster into the target". i see it as manipulating the mana that surrounds the target, causing magic in the target's vicinity to hurt the target.
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#12
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,685 Joined: 17-August 02 Member No.: 3,123 ![]() |
I heard that Leonization has a new name, but I don't have SOTA '63 so I could be wrong. |
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#13
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 ![]() |
Hmm... ok, genetech has been changed with some renaming.
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#14
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 153 Joined: 1-April 04 Member No.: 6,211 ![]() |
Ok, this is off topic, but I've always been really curious, and have never been able to read a copy of first edition rules:
How did firearm damage work orginally? I've seen codes like 2M3 listed elsewhere, and I've been so curious to know what that MEANS.. I don't need ten pages of rules, just a quick explination from someone in the know? Please? |
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#15
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 ![]() |
Combat in 1st edition was a bit different.
1st: armor didn't decrease the power, it counted as free successe on your resistance test. If you had 4 armor, that was 4 successes before you even rolled body. 2nd: the damage codes were in the form of (TN to resist)(base damage lewel)(scaling rate) I can't remember if both sides of the damage scaling used that number, I think they did. That made some weapons extremely consistant and other extremely variable in how much damage they could do. 2M10 would take 10 successes to change the damage either way, while 4L1 would scale with every success. |
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#16
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 153 Joined: 1-April 04 Member No.: 6,211 ![]() |
Thank you! That's an itch I've been wanting to scratch for a while!
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#17
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 117 Joined: 29-April 04 Member No.: 6,291 ![]() |
I may be dragging a lot over from M:tA, my other RPG addiction, but here's my take on this. In essence (rimshot) manabolt doesn't actually do any bolt-travelling. The effect of the spell-engine is simply Hurt Person. But when it was first created, the FORM of the engine came with a flashy bolt effect. Obviously, the bolt effect is false, otherwise people standing in front of a manabolt would get hurt, even if they weren't being aimed at. The spell doesn't actually do any 'travelling' in three dimensions, it just looks like it does. In addition, there's also that whole (awesome) point made about sticking to the original spell name, both OOC and IC. Feel free to critique, just some thoughts on my end. |
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#18
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 402 Joined: 23-April 03 From: London, UK Member No.: 4,491 ![]() |
Which explains why a lot of people bought Streetline Specials in those days! :D |
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#19
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 138 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Paris, France Member No.: 639 ![]() |
About Mana bolt, my take on it:
there's an actual bolt, but only in astral space, and this bolt is actually the mana around the target that suddenly strikes it like a natural lightning bolt would strike a tree. Except maybe that the source of the "bolt" is more spread around the target in the case of the mana bolt whicle clearly far above it in the case of the (natural, not the spell) lighning bolt. |
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#20
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 903 Joined: 7-February 03 Member No.: 4,025 ![]() |
Let me take a shot at the line of sight issue. (get it?)
To target a spell, you need to somehow 'relate' to the target; to create some sort of sense of its identity. Line of sight (ie: my natural senses perceive the target) would be the easiest way to relate to it in the short term. Whereas ritual sorcery involves spending a lot of time to develop a visualization or an 'internal sense' of the target (like broadening your sense of the world through meditation, but on a higher scale). In other words, I don't need line of sight for anything to travel, I need it so I can know that there's a real target for my spell. If a magician got 'good enough' at this remote sensing, they could cast LOS spells without, but so far, no magician has developed that ability and it is currently outside the realm of the game. This could explain a few other things, such as object resistance tests (harder to develop empathy for car than a dog.), drain differences for touch spells (hands on sensing). Go easy on me, I was just typing this as I was thinking it up. |
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#21
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Target ![]() Group: Members Posts: 85 Joined: 28-August 03 Member No.: 5,551 ![]() |
My guess would be that some sort of mana has to travel from the magician to the target; otherwise, what good would astral barriers do? (If the mana could use 4D or metaplanar shortcuts, it should be able to bypass barriers as easily as a spirit bouncing back and forth.) And that provides zero confusion for me. Mana is channeled from the magician's location. (Whether directly or just roughly doesn't matter.) Mana enters target's astral form/aura, completely bypassing any physical affects. The exact way that the mana damages the target is unknown (if irrelevant), but since mana has never had any problems with physical impediments, I don't see why it would start now. |
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#22
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935 ![]() |
The Somatic Way
All magicians possess the ability to channel and manipulate astral energy. The extant of skill in these abilities is determined by two things: what the magician believes is possible, and knowledge of certain metaphysical laws and properties. The Adept does not, save in rare cases, focus on the direct and conscious manipulation of astral energy. Rather, the adept slowly builds up lasting astral forms within their own physical forms (the astral segment becoming a part of the aura). Unlike when a Sorceror anchors or sustains a spell, the astral forms of the Adept are bound and hidden within his aura, and maintained unconsciously (although the Adept may exercise conscious control over their powers should they choose to). A peculiar side effect of the Adept's unconscious development of personal astral forms (which, though a conscious process, is not necessairilly an intellectual one requiring the complex theory and experience of other magicians.) is a relative unattunement to astral space. Because the Adept's astral forms are so closely tied to their physical form, it is almost impossible for an Adept to seperate their spirit from their physical form. <finish later> |
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#23
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 614 Joined: 17-June 03 From: A safehouse about to be compromised by ninjas Member No.: 4,754 ![]() |
Great thread, good read.
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#24
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,451 Joined: 21-April 03 From: Austin, TX Member No.: 4,488 ![]() |
Want more Sensei!!
Magical theory is something you shouldn't think about too hard unless you've done some serious reading/thinking on the issue just because it's something that doesn't exist in the real world, yet has centuries of historical background and "laws" governing it. BTW, you can call your spells whatever you want. Your shaman may not have studied with anyone to learn it's called "manabolt" and thus calls it "Snake's Fangs" or whatever. It can also take almost any form you want it to take. I've made sorcerer adepts that duplicated DBZ characters before without designing a single new spell. It's all about how your character visuallizes it. Like AH said, a lot of it has to do with what your character believes. The Abstruse One |
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#25
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 160 Joined: 12-August 03 From: Sulphur, Louisiana Member No.: 5,418 ![]() |
Yeah.. A Bull Shaman PC of mine called his Power Ball spell 'Bull's Wrath'..
We even had a PC whose magical group was a bunch of his friends (all awakened) who played D&D every weekend. He called his Mana Bolt spell 'Magic Missile'. |
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