Aztechnology, Really??? Options

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Indeed... Dunklezahn was not assassinated, He committed Suicide... Apparently the hotline was jammed with callers.

[Sendaz]

Or, just like how a cat when it falls tries to cover it up by acting like that was supposed to happen, the Big D WAS assassinated, but not thoroughly and his spirit then acted like it was a ritual suicide on our behalf just to look good because even Dragons pay homage to the Rule of Cool. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Or, just like how a cat when it falls tries to cover it up by acting like that was supposed to happen, the Big D WAS assassinated, but not thoroughly and his spirit then acted like it was a ritual suicide on our behalf just to look good because even Dragons pay homage to the Rule of Cool. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

Ummm... Dunklezahn killed himself... how is that an assassination?

[Draco18s]

Ummm... Dunklezahn killed himself... how is that an assassination?

See, it all depends on whether or not you consider the Dragonheart Trilogy to be canon (suicide) or not (assassination).

Hell, even if it is canon, most of the people in the SR universe don't know about the events depicted and still believe it to have been an assassination.

[Sendaz]

Ummm... Dunklezahn killed himself... how is that an assassination?

See, it all depends on whether or not you consider the Dragonheart Trilogy to be canon (suicide) or not (assassination).

Hell, even if it is canon, most of the people in the SR universe don't know about the events depicted and still believe it to have been an assassination.

Exactly, let's not forget there are more than a few novels that played the edge of reasoning/canon, like Black Madonna which needed a few novels after to clean that mess up and change some parts to get things back on track.


Again, I am not saying it was assassination, but even if it was I wouldn't be surprised if the Big D could still capitalize on it to some degree for his own ends.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

See, it all depends on whether or not you consider the Dragonheart Trilogy to be canon (suicide) or not (assassination).

Hell, even if it is canon, most of the people in the SR universe don't know about the events depicted and still believe it to have been an assassination.

Belief, however, does not make it so... Fact is, Dunklezahn offed himself. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Draco18s]

Belief, however, does not make it so... Fact is, Dunklezahn offed himself. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

If and only if you consider Dragonheart to be canon. Some people don't. I do, because of Rule of Cool, but I don't consider War! to be canon (Storm Front I haven't made a decision on, but it feels like an extension of War!).

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

If and only if you consider Dragonheart to be canon. Some people don't. I do, because of Rule of Cool, but I don't consider War! to be canon (Storm Front I haven't made a decision on, but it feels like an extension of War!).

Since it was put out by FASA, in the Shadowrun Universe, why would you not consider it to be Canon? Any such ruling would be a Houserule(?), and not a basis to form a common ground. I do understand people not liking it, though. But saying it isn't Canon because I do not like it is like saying the Ares Alpha isn't Canon becasue I don't like it. It Does not wash with me. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

War! does not bother me as Canon (though some of the stories/premises have the capacity to offend, no doubt); I am still plowing through Storm Front, so no real opinion on that yet.

[Voran]

If you stat it, the players will kill it.

Edit:
Apparently, sometimes you don't even need to do that...

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/That_Guy_Destroys_All_Psions

Wow, I'd reach across the table and throttle both the player and GM in this case.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Wow, I'd reach across the table and throttle both the player and GM in this case.

Indeed... Pretty much an Epic Fail all the way around. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/eek.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

[ShadowDragon8685]

Indeed... Pretty much an Epic Fail all the way around. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/eek.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

Actually, I think that player was kind of a hero, given that almost the entire group was out to get him, the GM was throwing around god-level NPCs like a dick, and he managed to bring down said God-NPC not once but twice.

[Draco18s]

Actually, I think that player was kind of a hero, given that almost the entire group was out to get him, the GM was throwing around god-level NPCs like a dick, and he managed to bring down said God-NPC not once but twice.

Three times, actually.
1) Destroying the Plane of Force
2) Turned off psionics in his own demiplane
3) Mobbed the BBEG with ever-healing construct minions

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Actually, I think that player was kind of a hero, given that almost the entire group was out to get him, the GM was throwing around god-level NPCs like a dick, and he managed to bring down said God-NPC not once but twice.

Heh... There is that too... The shenanigans that occurred are just not my cup o' Tea any longer. Of course, many years ago (Early 90's), I did something similar with a Champions 4th Edition game, when I was told that there was no way that I could create a a 200 Point character that could not be controlled. Challenge Accepted... Did not take long for THAT idea to be disabused. Was asked to not play Champions with that group again.

[Voran]

I've always felt: NO GAME is better than SHITTY GAME. I've heard horror stories like that and went, "Why were you playing with them in the first place?"

I mean, play with yourself instead.



....wait

[Neraph]

From what I remember of your game rules you could win against every statted GD and IE at once.

... You mean the literal explanation of the rules? I'm simply more creative than many people. And no, not all GDs and IEs at once. Maybe not even all of them in sequence. But two F15 spirits? Yeah, I gots dis. And maybe (probably) one GD.

If you stat it, the players will kill it.

Edit:
Apparently, sometimes you don't even need to do that...

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/That_Guy_Destroys_All_Psions

Actually: radiation exposure, thor shots, and nuclear weapons are things that simply state that a thing dies outright. No stats still dies because it's a kill effect.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Actually: radiation exposure, thor shots, and nuclear weapons are things that simply state that a thing dies outright. No stats still dies because it's a kill effect.

Except that with Twist Fate, the GD is pretty protected from stuff like that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/eek.gif)

[FuelDrop]

Except that with Twist Fate, the GD is pretty protected from stuff like that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/eek.gif)

Twist THIS! *fires death star*

[DMiller]

If you stat it, the players will kill it.

Edit:
Apparently, sometimes you don't even need to do that...

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/That_Guy_Destroys_All_Psions

I liked what this guy did. The group truly didn't want to add anyone else to their group, why they advertised for someone is beyond me. I think the player did everything right, the GM and other players were out of line.

[FuelDrop]

I liked what this guy did. The group truly didn't want to add anyone else to their group, why they advertised for someone is beyond me. I think the player did everything right, the GM and other players were out of line.

Gotta agree. Also, points to him for doing the whole thing with consistent characterization.

[ShadowDragon8685]

Twist THIS! *fires death star*

I agree; Twist Fate is a bullshit game mechanic that makes me see red.

If you're not big and scaly enough to survive on your own, you don't get to break the normal mechanics of the game for everyone else in order to force your survival. This isn't Call of Cthulhu, you don't get to automatically eat 1d4+1 Shadowrunners per initiative pass.

If you're a Great Dragon and you piss off the entire world badly enough for a major warfighting power to declare open season on you and you then get into an open field battle against them, your life is now in the hands of the dice, same as with everybody else.

Frankly, I hate the Azzies, but I'm glad that somebody put the Great Dragons officially on notice that they were not the dominant species on the planet anymore.

I liked what this guy did. The group truly didn't want to add anyone else to their group, why they advertised for someone is beyond me. I think the player did everything right, the GM and other players were out of line.

Yeah, that GM was being a pure asshole, not shutting down Psychic Rape Boy hard and fast, and not shutting down the PKing and intraparty conflict the moment it started, and especially when he let one of the other players attempt to PK the wizard by BBEG. And then he was extra asshole, when he not only went along with the other player's asshole attempt to murder the wizard with the BBEG, but then retconned the BBEG's death twice (and shut down what would have been a second repeat of his first death by fiat,) rather than, say, awarding the wizard his 6,144,000 XP and figuring out where to go from there.

[Chinane]

Since it was put out by FASA, in the Shadowrun Universe, why would you not consider it to be Canon?

Because one is a novel, the other is a sourcebook for a game. If they want stuff to be canon, they'd better put a summary into an actual sourcebook, else I'll happily ignore it.

[sk8bcn]

There's one thing strange about you Shadow. Everytime you discuss about great dragon, it's nigh like it's real fact. When it's just about how the set of authors perceive the universe.

If I was the lead-designer, GD would pull strings in the back. And those strings would induce shadowruns.

And not god know why epic battles.....

[ShadowDragon8685]

Because one is a novel, the other is a sourcebook for a game. If they want stuff to be canon, they'd better put a summary into an actual sourcebook, else I'll happily ignore it.

This.

There's one thing strange about you Shadow. Everytime you discuss about great dragon, it's nigh like it's real fact. When it's just about how the set of authors perceive the universe.

Because I'm the one thing in the world that trumps the authors: the Game Master. Whenever I'm speaking, I'm speaking of how things are in my game.

If I was the lead-designer, GD would pull strings in the back. And those strings would induce shadowruns.

And not god know why epic battles.....

Aye, that's how smart GDs should behave. Exposing yourself to violence means that those who are inclined to use violence will, and those are capable of employing more violence than you have the means to counter will turn you into a schmear of expensive exotic reagents in short order. Or just regular old viscera, if you're not made of magic; either way.

[Sendaz]

Because one is a novel, the other is a sourcebook for a game. If they want stuff to be canon, they'd better put a summary into an actual sourcebook, else I'll happily ignore it.

It is a good point to remember. The novels are sort of guided by the game, but not entirely limited to it.

Stackpole's Wolf Character from 'Wolf & Raven' is a good example of this.

He wrote this back in the early days when FASA had the reins so you would think everything in it was canon, but even Stackpole admitted that there was no real guidelines for what a shapeshifter/werewolf was or what it could and could not do, so he winged it and created Wolf on the fly doing what fit the Rule of Cool.

Even today he does not quite fit neatly into the rules as they are. True shapeshifters are awakened animals who can take a human form, but Wolf was actually Human who was blessed by the WOLF spirit (mentor?). A minor point but again it strays from classic canon regarding the shapeshifters. His transformation abilities come closer to the spell, especially in one fight where he takes a hybrid form combining both man and wolf features to maximize his fighting ability. A normal shapeshifter would not be able to do this (SR shifters don't have the hybrid form like WoD versions do).

I will admit that the Dragonheart series was probably intended to be canon, but it was such a mess I can understand why many players would rather forget about it, sort of like Highlander 2 (alien prisoners? seriously?)

[Stahlseele]

Twist THIS! *fires death star*

*points at the remains of the moon*
how did you even manage to miss the planet with me on it and hit the moon instead?