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> First runner needs equipment help
Leviathan
post May 6 2004, 12:59 PM
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Hey, I've never done shadowrun before, and I'm asking for a hand figuring out equipment and such that I will need.

Character: Cybered and Bioed up Orc, So I'm the muscle, mostly hand-to-hand combat. I'm also a security guard for a large 'pub'. I should also mention that the GM is setting out games in Australia, so guns are a lot more illegal, and armour etc a lot more conspicuous.
Stats
Body 9 (11 with bone lacing)
Strength 11
Quickness 9
Intelligence 3
Willpower 3
Charisma 2

I've got about 300,000 left to spend after all my implants.
This is the equipment list that I've got so far, I'm also going to need a vehicle in the mix.

Kris
Claymore
AZ-150 Stun Baton
Yamaha Pular Tazer
Browning Ultra-power (with lazer sight)
Ruger 100 sports rifle (with Mag 3 image scope and a sling)
Ulysses coat
full body form fitting body armour
full suit of urban camo
general clothing
ammo for everything (how much recomended?)
Flash-bangs

Also looking at needing some kind of peppermint bomb (to remove our scent, in case of sniffer dogs etc), and will need some way to destroy the DNA in any blood that I lose to prevent DNA tracking.

Any advice on what more I need? Also any other tips are greatly appreciated!
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FXcalibur
post May 6 2004, 01:11 PM
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Perhaps post the rest of your character, especially skills, the special attributes and cyberware. It would really help knowing exactly what you got.
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Abstruse
post May 6 2004, 02:22 PM
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Ammo - a lot. I usually buy at least 50 rounds for every pistol I get and 200 rounds for any automatic weapon (don't forget to buy the 5 spare clips for each time you need one).

I'd definately get something heavier than just a Heavy Pistol if you're supposed to be the muscle unless you've got backup. Your heavy pistol should definately be your go-to gun for most situations, but for a muscle character, you need something with more punch for when the drek hits the fan. SMG/Assault Rifle, or at least a shotgun. Sports rifles are IMHO only for snipers who can't get the sweet rifles at chargen because of availability. They're just not made for heavy combat but rather for picking your shots.

Nice choice with the Ultra-Power though. That's my personal favorite heavy pistol for a non-smartlinked character because of the laser sight. Plus it's a lot easier to figure out how many clips you have with the ammo you bought because it's 10 rnds to a clip. Throw a silencer with it though (doesn't have to be conceal-carried with it on as it only takes one phase to put it on).

But definately post your skills, cyber, and also more detail about the concept you're going for so we have somewhere to start. Depending on what you're trying to do with the character, any advice given could be completely wrong for the character.

One last thing. Do NOT run around town carrying a friggin' sword...unless it's a katana and your character is Japanese and wired out the ass/an adept, or if it's a weapon focus, you'll be laughed at a lot. Then shot at a lot. Then arrested a lot.

The Abstruse One
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Leviathan
post May 6 2004, 02:38 PM
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Ok then. Oh, and the other party members are: A fire-arm street-sam, a dwarven demolitions specialist, a mage (sun I think), and we will be getting a troll rigger.


Skills:
Capoeira - 6
- Sweep
- Evasion
- Whirling
Rifles - 4
Athletics - 2
Stealth - 2
Etiquette - 2
Intimidation - 2
Wilderness Survival - 2
Bike (Ride) - 2
Bike (Repair) - 1
English Language - 3
Japanese Language - 3
Knowledge Intimidation - 4
Knowledge Unarmed-Combat - 2
Street Knowledge - Local Neighbourhood - 3
Small Unit Tactics - 3
Cyber Implant Combat - Spurs - (This one is weird, I'm using NSRCG, and it comes up as) [2/4]=3

Augmentations:

Cyberware:
Titanium Bone Lacing
Retractable Spurs
Replacement Ears
- Dampener
- High Frequency
- Low Frequency
Replacement Eyes
- Low Light
- Ultrasound
- Thermographic
- Vision Magnification 3
- Retinal Clock
- Mirrored Covers (This helps protect from Flashbangs doesn't it?)

Bioware:

Enhanced Articulation
Muscle Toner 4
Muscle Augmentation 2


Edges:
Bonus Attribute Point - Strength
College Education
Photographic Memory
Human Looking
Magical Resistance Lv 2
Good Reputation

Flaws:
Allergy (Uncommon, Severe) - Raw Gunpowder
Allergy (Uncommon, Severe) - Bleach
Allergy (Uncommon, Mild) - Tree Sap
Day Job 10hrs/week (Security Guard)


My character is basically going to be a 'run in and hit them while the mage does his tricks and the street sam shoots'.
I think thats about everything, anthing else you want to know?

I'm not going to be 'running around' with the sword, it will be stored in the vehicle in case of need.
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GunnerJ
post May 6 2004, 02:45 PM
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I would think that if you're playing in Oz, a desert cammo suit would be useful as well.
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shadd4d
post May 6 2004, 03:01 PM
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Take out the cybereyes; you're paying for a cybernetic version of your own vision that's not as good. You need flare comp to get away from getting messed up by your own flashbangs.

Your're also slow (1d6) initiative, which can really hurt going up against people who are faster. Think about that. Why does your character have a college education if he's a security guard? I don't get the logic here.

Don
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FXcalibur
post May 6 2004, 03:03 PM
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A Troll rigger. I see those as often in my games as troll deckers.

What abtruse said is right, the Ultra is a good sidearm, but I have to ask: Why no smartlink? I don't know how much essence you have left, but even if its' ungodly low, slam an internal smartlink 2 into your guns and pick up a pair of smartlink 2 goggles. You should be able to afford it, and they really help with called shots The goggles even come in mirrored shade design 8)

Unfortunately, smartlinks don't work with scopes, but you already got cybereyes so it shouldn't be a kicker. If you have enough essence, i really do recommend smartlinks. I recommend smartlinks for anybody who even comes close to touching a gun, but hey, it works.

As for choice of ammo payloads, don't overlook plain ol standard ammo. Cheap and gets the job done. Stash several hundred rounds of 'em in your lifestyle(s). YMMV, but I've also found it's nice to have truckloads of ammo and pre-bought so you can just go back and reload after an ammo exhasutive run.

Pick up gel rounds for nonlethal takedown. Add a silencer and you've got nonlethal silent takedown rounds. No sound, no mess. Groovy. Aim for the head if possible, by the way, to maximize effectiveness. If you need to assassinate someone who isn't built for combat, use flechette and again, aim for the head. If you need all out power with no subtly whatsoever, grab EX Explosive rounds.

There are other variants of ammo, but I find these the most useful in general.

If you're in a place where guns are, uh, even more illegal (illegaler? :D), grab a permit for guns that have them. Only 10% of the gun's cost, and it'll keep the police off you. Just don't take a stroll down the park wearing a freakin assault rifle and you'll be fine.
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Leviathan
post May 6 2004, 03:09 PM
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I need the cybereyes for both the thermo vision and the ultrasound vision (ok, will get the flare compensation, I missed it first time round).
I know I'm slow, but there is nothing I can do about that at character creation, after I get the cash in game I'm going to get synaptic accelerator to help compensate for that.

The college education is in my backstory, I migrated to the city after a mana storm tore apart the settlement where I lived, so I used the cash from my (now dead) parents savings to put myself through University, then got the job as a security guard later.
Dont worry about anything on the grounds of back story, it all fits, but trying up my full story here would take me forever.
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shadd4d
post May 6 2004, 03:12 PM
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Not really. Anything you get for cybereyes can be made into retnal modifications, Yes, you'll lose more essence, but you'll keep your natural lowlight vision, plus save on having to pay for it.

Think about the smartlink; it's useful. Better yet, spring for smartlink II, if you can. Permits are nice too.

Don
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Leviathan
post May 6 2004, 03:13 PM
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Yeah, I'll tack a couple of silencers on the list, I'll see what I can do about the smartlink (I've got 2.5 essence left). So permits are 10% of the gun's cost? Thanks, I had no idea what permits were worth (hence the reason I didnt' have any), shall rectify that right away. And as to being arrested, did I mention that I have a Lv 3 contact within the police department? ;-)

Once the troll rigger arrives, we shall have one of each race in our party, we wont attract attention!! No!! Never!!
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dead_as_elvis
post May 6 2004, 03:13 PM
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also, you may want to change your weapons or combat skills. Your Kris will need Edged Weapons, your Claymore will need Pole-arms (which is just stupid), your stun baton will need Clubs, and your pistol and taser will need Pistols. With your set up now, you will be defaulting like crazy, which is never good.

oh and the reason the program listed your skill 2/4=3 is because your base Cyber Implant is 2, your Spur speciality is 4, and it cost you 3 points to have it that way
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Lilt
post May 6 2004, 03:16 PM
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You'll probably want reflex recorders for your Capoeira skill.

I'm not sure if this is the sort of advice you want: but your character stands a high chance losing in melee against an adept or a character with reach (such-as a katana). Your character is far better with his unarmed combat than he is with his spurs, so there is really not much reason to use them. You would probably be best dropping the cyber implant weapons skill and buying a good weapons skill with reach (Whips with a Manriki Guisari or Morningstar gives you a good reach).

You probably won't need the cyberears. Smartlinks are good, also you have a pistol but no skill to use it.
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KillaJ
post May 6 2004, 03:22 PM
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I notice a few things that may or may not need to be addressed. First off, the pistol has been mentioned twice but I dont see any pistol skill. If your the muscle you definately want weapon skills to match your weapons. Also you have spent 6 points on Capoeira and three manuevers. If my understanding of the martial arts rules are correct you would need to spend 12 points to get three maneuvers. You must select one maneuver for every increment of two you raise you MA skill. Everyone who has posted above me is correct, if your already cybered a smartlink is almost mandatory. Hope you enjoy the game.
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Catsnightmare
post May 6 2004, 03:42 PM
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Everyone seems to have missed his intial statement that the campaign is running out of Australia where guns are highly illegal, (IIRC IRL Aussie's can't even own a simple breach-loader rifle without extensive proof and permits that you live in a wild enough part of the Outback to need one, much less a handgun).

Though I'd agree about improving the various armed combat skills. Since you're getting spurs (a pair?) I'd drop the unarmed combat skill altogether and transfer the points to Cyber Implant combat up to 6 and the rest into uping the various armed combat skills (clubs, edged weapons, polearms).
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FXcalibur
post May 6 2004, 03:46 PM
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The world has changed, maybe the laws are different now. Does anyone have a shadows of Australia book handy? At any rate, best check with your GM. If you're lucky, he'll just make permits much more expensive.
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Leviathan
post May 6 2004, 03:56 PM
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As to the stun baton, I'm not worried about not being proficient with it, it's more 'security guard apparel'

Ok, I have a couple of options here.
1) Switch one of my martial arts specialties to close-quarters fighting, to negate opponent's reach, drop the spurs, and put a couple of points into pistol.
2) Drop martial arts entirely, beef up pistols, cyper combat, and either whips or pole-arms for reach.
3) Drop martial arts and the spurs and go with pistols and whips or pole-arms.
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Crusher Bob
post May 6 2004, 03:57 PM
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I'd say drop the spurs as well, you already get plenty of bonuses for just hitting people, using obth skill points and essence for spurs is a bit much.

If you want your 'close' weapon to be your hands, this lets you skip the pistol skill for now. This lets yu sink some more points into the skills you nned when you ren't running around killing stuff.

In general, assault rifles are the most versatile of weapons, you get range and firepower in one package. Taking lauch weapons (grenade launchers) or throuwn weapons (grenades) can be worth a look too.
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Lilt
post May 6 2004, 04:12 PM
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According to Target:Awakened Lands, guns are more tightly controlled, and handguns are more illegal than long-arms. Combat Cyber is labelled Security Grade (You can presumably still pick-up a lisence if you must though).
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TinkerGnome
post May 6 2004, 04:17 PM
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Best vision setup for an ork is to keep your natural low light vision, and add in eyelights. Nearly perfect vision out to 100 meters. Screw thermo, you'll never need it. Keep the vision mag, but you might not need the ultrasound vision. Keep it if you're going to do a orientation system. Unless you have a particularly good reason to keep it, ditch the low frequency hearing in favor of an amplifier, sound filter, or spatial thingie (only if you're going to go with an orientation system).

On the skills, [2/4]=3 means you have a base skill of 2, a specialization of 4, and it cost you 3 skill points. Someone else might have already hit on that one, though ;)
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Eyeless Blond
post May 6 2004, 04:29 PM
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QUOTE (Leviathan)
Skills:
Capoeira - 6
- Sweep
- Evasion
- Whirling
Rifles - 4
Athletics - 2
Stealth - 2
Etiquette - 2
Intimidation - 2
Wilderness Survival - 2
Bike (Ride) - 2
Bike (Repair) - 1
English Language - 3
Japanese Language - 3
Knowledge Intimidation - 4
Knowledge Unarmed-Combat - 2
Street Knowledge - Local Neighbourhood - 3
Small Unit Tactics - 3
Cyber Implant Combat - Spurs - (This one is weird, I'm using NSRCG, and it comes up as) [2/4]=3

Huh, so you're basing your character around the Caporia martial art. I... guess that's interesting; have you read the rules for martial arts, and Caporia specifically, in Cannon Companion? It's a style mostly centered around kicks and ground fighting, and really IMO those should be more emphasized in your chosen Maneuvers. With titanium bone lacing and this high a martial arts skill (12 skill points invested solely in a martial art!) you should probably just stick with that, and forget cyber implant combat and all those extra melee weapons; you're never going to be as good with them without spending massive amounts of Karma anyway.

Also, you're spread out way too thin. Don't do this; Shadowrun rewards specialization, especially at chargen, and you will find yourself really hurting later if you water down your character like this. Baring attribute limits, generally don't buy a skill that you intend to actually use at less than 3 points, and any skill you intend to use often should be 4 or more. I'm also confused as to why you have the College Education Edge, indicating you went to college, "and got more out of it than the average student," but no Academic Knowledge skills at 3-4+ that would indicate that you actually went. :P

Bricks tend to go with Assault Rifles or SMG skills with Smartlink backup, rather than Rifles and lasers/vision mag, which tend to be more for snipers and ultralong ranges. Which kind of character do you intend to play?

QUOTE
Cyberware:
Titanium Bone Lacing
Retractable Spurs
Replacement Ears
- Dampener
- High Frequency
- Low Frequency
Replacement Eyes
- Low Light
- Ultrasound
- Thermographic
- Vision Magnification 3
- Retinal Clock
- Mirrored Covers (This helps protect from Flashbangs doesn't it?)

Bioware:

Enhanced Articulation
Muscle Toner 4
Muscle Augmentation 2

As was said elsewhere, lose the replacement eyes. Ultrasound vision (if you really want it; it's kinda pointless without a spacial recognizer and orientation system) and flare compensation can be bought as regular eye mods; about the only things that can't are eye weapons and eye datajacks. The good thing about this is you keep your natural vision, which is almost always better than any kind of cybereye vision (unless of course you're a puny human :P).

As was said before, the spurs are kinda useless. Get rid of them and get a Smartlink-2 with rangefinder; it fits the brick character better anyway.

Seriously consider some kind of reflexes, even if it's just Boosted 1. A slow sammie always has all sorts of problems in combat.

QUOTE
Flaws:
Allergy (Uncommon, Severe) - Raw Gunpowder
Allergy (Uncommon, Severe) - Bleach
Allergy (Uncommon, Mild) - Tree Sap
Day Job 10hrs/week (Security Guard)

Bleagh. These flaws are so... uninteresting, and possibly munchy as well. Consider other things for flaws maybe, other than a bunch of allergies. Also note that, since no chemical reaction ever goes to 100% completion, your gun-toting sammy will frequently be inhaling raw gunpowder residue with the smoke from his own guns, as well as taking small quantities inside of him with every bullet he takes, which'll really suck for you.
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Leviathan
post May 6 2004, 04:29 PM
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Ok, I've removed martial arts, the spurs, and cyber-implant weapons.
I now have:
Pistols 4
Pole Arms 6
Clubs 5
hows that?
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Eyeless Blond
post May 6 2004, 04:41 PM
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Well if you're gonna do that you'll get more milage out of replacing titanium bone lacing kevlar bone lacing and a good dermal sheath. :) Also most of the other comments still stand.
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Leviathan
post May 6 2004, 04:42 PM
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Ok, skills and fighting are going to get overhauled tomorrow night (it's currently 2:30am, time for bed (I have uni tomorrow) )
Ok, ignore the skills/weapon setup as they stand, I shall report more tomorrow.

Anyways, back to the equipment, any more advice there?
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Chance359
post May 6 2004, 04:47 PM
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(5,000) Bugout Bag:
(50) Bag
(2,000) Certified Credstick w/ 2,000
(500) 500 in script
(450) Ares Predator
(30) 15 regular rounds
(155) Spare clip w/ 15 Ex-explosive rounds
(80) Spare clip w/ 15 Hollow point rounds
(150) Quick Draw Holster (concealed)
(60) 2 smoke grenades
(450) Survival knife
(10) 35 meters of duct tape
(50) Handset cell phone
(100) Survival Kit
(250) Medkit w/ extra supplies
(25) Heavy denim jeans
(25) Synth Wool Sweater
(10) 2 changes of underware
(10) 2 changes of synth wool socks
(5) Towel
(50) Leather gloves w/ wool liners
(40) Mini-Mag light w/ extra bulb, two changes of batteries
(30) 6 while glowsticks
(40) Food bag w/ dry cereal, coffee grounds, jerky, ramen noodles, multi vitamins
(50) Camal Pak
(80) Sleeping bag
(50) Thermal blanket

And more contacts.
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KillaJ
post May 6 2004, 04:48 PM
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Buy a rope.
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