Complex vs. Simple Actions for Mounted Weapons, SR3 and SR3R Options

[nezumi]

So easy question;

per the BBB, firing any weapon which is mounted on a vehicle is a Complex Action, whether the weapon is SA or FA.

Is there a rationale behind this? Why would using a rifle on a pintle mount take longer to fire than one I'm holding to my shoulder? Why would it take longer to fire via the VCR if I already have a sensor lock?

Secondly, is this a good rule? Does it make sense to keep this, or should it be turned to the normal action rules that are in place for unmounted weapons?

[Bertramn]

It may at some point have been meant to balance out that mounted weapons are often stronger than the ones you hold in your hand.

I think it should be handled like normal weapon-fire though.

[Mach_Ten]

Think it's meant to offset the stupid amount of recoil compensation that a vehicle mount offers.

add in rigger Control pool or combat pool etc. and it's a license to print street pizzas!

[nezumi]

Mach Ten, I would agree with you. Plus it's easy to mount those MMGs and HMGs you can't haul around. But is that the only reason then? To help pull back the damage they're dishing out? And is that reasonable?

I'm inclined to say that it's not. This doesn't impact full-auto, since that's already a complex action. Nor does it impact the very heavy autocannons, since they're single shot. It *only* impacts using burst fire, and using SA weapons. So basically, your mounted hunting rifle is nerfed, while the HMG is still fine.

[Lobo0705]

Mach Ten, I would agree with you. Plus it's easy to mount those MMGs and HMGs you can't haul around. But is that the only reason then? To help pull back the damage they're dishing out? And is that reasonable?

I'm inclined to say that it's not. This doesn't impact full-auto, since that's already a complex action. Nor does it impact the very heavy autocannons, since they're single shot. It *only* impacts using burst fire, and using SA weapons. So basically, your mounted hunting rifle is nerfed, while the HMG is still fine.

Disagree.

It nerfs the HMG as well, in that you can fire Full Auto as a Simple Action (6 round burst). And the way that the rules work, if you Take Aim (or any other Simple Action) and then fire a 6 round burst, your recoil never adds up from IP to IP, and the RC provided by the vehicle mount means you will never take recoil firing those 6 round bursts.

However, making it a complex action means that every time you fire you are accruing recoil, meaning you will eventually need to stop firing for a complete IP.

[nezumi]

Automatic fire is a Complex action. Burst fire is a simple action. It'll nerf double-bursts, but there isn't a huge difference between double-bursts and automatic with two three-round bursts.

[Lobo0705]

Automatic fire is a Complex action. Burst fire is a simple action. It'll nerf double-bursts, but there isn't a huge difference between double-bursts and automatic with two three-round bursts.

Completely ignore my previous post, since I somehow managed to miss that this was a SR 3 thread.

My apologies.

[Mach_Ten]

Completely ignore my previous post, since I somehow managed to miss that this was a SR 3 thread.

My apologies.

Not to worry, us old throwbacks usually stop and gawk at you new and trendy hipsters when you wander in,
But age and decrepitude soon assert their authority over our senses and we sliwly go back to our dominoes and pints of bitter.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

On, topic of mounted high power SS or SA Rifles.
Im not sure if there are rules for bracing etc.

What does prone, a bipod or tripod give a sniper?
Id take a guess a houesrule to allow the same benefits if any.

Downside is the action it takes to unmount said weapon

[nezumi]

Bipod gives, IIRC, +2 rc, and tripod +4. Dropping prone to use a bipod/tripod (if you're standing) is a free action, but once you're in that position there's no further action penalty until you decide to get back up again (simple action).

With SR3R, we're testing out halving recoil when mounted on a vehicle.

For either recoil schema, it isn't likely to come into play for an SA rifle.

[Kagetenshi]

per the BBB, firing any weapon which is mounted on a vehicle is a Complex Action, whether the weapon is SA or FA.

Is there a rationale behind this? Why would using a rifle on a pintle mount take longer to fire than one I'm holding to my shoulder? Why would it take longer to fire via the VCR if I already have a sensor lock?

It is at the least a different kind of motion, though I’ll grant that I don’t have an answer to “but why longer?” For Sensor-Enhanced Gunnery you can at least write it off as the cost of the ballistic processing and sensor integration involved in SEG.

Secondly, is this a good rule? Does it make sense to keep this, or should it be turned to the normal action rules that are in place for unmounted weapons?

I suppose the one clear benefit I see is that Sniper Drone Wars is deadlier with Simple Actions, though that’s somewhat “keeping out of the fire by staying in the frying pan”. There are also some implications for SA Grenade Launchers—the Conceal keeps them in check for meat ‘runners, but for a drone that doesn’t have to look casual on the way to the target two grenades an initiative pass is a pretty substantial firepower amplification.

Is this the best way to achieve the desired result? I’m much less clear on that one. My instinct is to leave it, but I could be convinced otherwise.

~J