Are the Hacker/Decker and Rigger Rules Really Better Now?, Just what it says above. Options

[Thanos007]

No. Really. Just what it says above. Across all editions these two rule sets have been.... not good. OK. Bad to abysmal. What's the skinny?

[binarywraith]

We honestly don't know yet.

The Decker/Rigger book is next up on the list of splatbooks to come out, we won't have a really solid idea of what they're going for until it does come out.

If I were to judge by just the SR5 core book? No, they aren't.

[Shaidar]

While the resolution mechanics are in-line with the SR4 & SR5 fixed TN system.

The issue remains in the cognitive realm, meaning that the steps needed to accomplish a task fail to follow a logical path that the player/GM can remember to follow.

[hermit]

Are the Hacker/Decker and Rigger Rules Really Better Now?

No, but they have a core expansion book coming up each where CGL can try to fix that. The rules in the core book come poorly together, interact weirdly, and overall seem not entirely thought through.

[SpellBinder]

I don't think so, either, but I'm still holding out for the Matrix/Rigger book(s) before final judgement. To be honest I'm not holding out hope.

[Glyph]

The rules are a mess in every edition, but I don't like how SR5 makes them like separate "character classes" again. It's a step backwards, in my opinion.

[Medicineman]

I don't really think so. What i really don't lke is the Speed Rules for vehicles ( and I doubt that the Riggerbook will change these rules)
They already needet some eratta or else Riggers could easily Acheive the Speed of Sound with a Ford Americar.
Hacking , I don't know I keep reading Posts that SR4A Hacking was so bad, and the Rules so clunky and everything. I never had any trouble with the SR4A Martrix Rules. But I know that I don't like the GOD Overwatchscore. So , for Me
I don't think that the SR5 Rules are better.(Maybe with the missing books, but I'm not sure at all)

with an unsure Dance
Medicineman

[Sternenwind]

If you ignore Wifi Boni, I would not say that the rules are bad. Actually they are pretty solid. They can look complicated, broken and terrible but for that the structure of the book is to blame. Rules for playing a rigger are split over 4 chapters in the book and no summary anywhere. A little guide for decking or how to use the matrix rules would have been nice too (for GM and player).
I only have 2 complains at the moment. The Grid rules are unnecessary and only complicating everything and that there is no way to remove a file protection without alerting the system.

[Smash]

No. Really. Just what it says above. Across all editions these two rule sets have been.... not good. OK. Bad to abysmal. What's the skinny?

4th Ed matrix rules were a total clusterfuck. 5th ed's are not great but they're a large improvement over all prior editions.

[silva]

Are the Hacker/Decker and Rigger Rules Really Better Now?

Decking is more playable than ever, specially if you stick to wireless/AR hacking (and avoid VR as much as possible). We just had a run where our decker hacked cameras and maglocks all around the complex, and it was really fast. Funnily, It felt like a D&D thief disarming traps (which I think was the idea behind the decker since 1st edition SR) instead of a player going through a complex mini-game while the rest of the group watched in boredom like in previous editions.

The problem is that the matrix chapter is badly writed and organized (IMHO), so actually making sense of how matrix works and the rules fit together is hard at first.

[binarywraith]

It definitely benefits from a flowchart.

[DeathStrobe]

The Matrix really does get better every edition, but it will always be weird, because there is no real frame of reference or mental models for it.

5th edition's Matrix is better than 4th's. If you played 4th's Matrix by RAW, which no one in their right mind would, all Matrix actions take too long to resolve, even if there is no real risk of failure. This is mostly do to the problem of everything being extended tests. The other problem is that the Matrix doesn't follow the mechanics of the rest of the game, that being Attribute + Skill = Dice Pool. In SR4, its Program + Skill = Dice pool. On top of that, there are restrictions and a lot of unnecessary bookkeeping, take for example that all programs can not be higher than system rating, and that system rating can not be higher than response. Than you also have to worry about signal range and mutual signal range in order to hack.

SR5 abstracts a lot of that away. System and response get's abstracted in to data processing. Signal rating gets tossed out entirely, and replaced with a noise mechanic, which functions like background count, so has a parallel with another mechanic already found in the game. The dice pools are calculated like every other test in the game, that being Attribute + Skill = Dice Pool and limit set by your gear. This makes it a lot easier to learn SR5's Matrix.

As for rigging, its conceptually similar. But with the addition of limits, you don't have to worry about the Street Sam with wired reflex being a better driver than the dedicated rigger, because vehicle limits are terrible and the rigger's VRC will give the rigger much higher limits. So you don't have to worry about that weird logical inconsistency anymore.