I return from the blasted wastes of reddit bearing gifts Options

[Sendaz]

More surprised she hasn't been prosecuted for walking around doing magic stuff without a license.

Or for being off a leash. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Or for being off a leash. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Well, those leash laws are prety harsh... so yeah...

[JanessaVR]

If people are out walking Fox-Girls on leashes...I, uh...start to think of RPGs other than Shadowrun, to tell you the truth. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[hermit]

Or for being off a leash. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

When I drove home from a game a couple years back, I saw the most urban fox ever. It was walking along the sidewalk, not dashing, nor using cover, but relaxed, just like a pedestrian, with a neatly folded, orderly McDonald's takeout bag in its mouth, held by the folded top. Really, those gentrified animals.

A bit more on topic: I'm with Janessa that OP in that thread took advantage of and griefed those players. It wouldn't be my group either, by far, but as the new guy, he's the one making the adjustments, not everyone else. Besides, there's no bounty on shifters save for Quebec and Yakut, and even there, it's a mere 10K. If you really want to make money off a shifter, use it as a one-animal pelt farm. Of course, better get a tiger for this, not a fox. SURGE don't have bounties on thier heads canonically either, just like metahumans don't. He wasn't taking the setting much more seriously serious than the others, but unlike them, he also didn't care about the collaborative element in an RPG. I'd have ignored his actions to the other characters too, as a player, and probably kicked him out of the channel, as a GM.

[FriendoftheDork]

The fact that the GM is running the game does not absolve every player there of any and all responsibility for their own actions. I don't even know why I'm having to explain this.

I think some people are overrating the "the GM is always right" rule. In fact, there is not a GM/player dichotomy, they are all players in a game that has an implicit goal of mutual fun. The Gm has a different role, but in the end every player is responsible for their own actions. The GM has some responsibility to adjudicate game actions and warn off players if they do something not acceptable to the group, but it's as much the players fault for doing it in the first place.

The GM is not a parent to the other players, and are not responsible for their actions.

[bannockburn]

Ideally, that is.

As for the "consent of the GM" for anything: That is certainly a style some people are used to, but far from the norm. If one of my players tells me "My character walks to the left," I don't have to consent to anything. I merely narrate the consequences of there being a crocodile pit to the left. That's called player agency and is an important factor contributing to everyone's fun.

And no, I don't run games completely hands-off. If someone's being disruptive, I'll call them out, and ultimately remove them if they insist on staying disruptive. That's a skill people tend to learn around kindergarden.

[Hibiki54]

I followed that subreddit post since it started and it's been interesting.

Keep in mind that this game was not played over VOIP; text only game.

FNG comes in at the last minute. He kinda knows what he's getting into, but doesn't really understand until he's in game. He goes along with it and is shocked that everyone is being pretty much straight forward with their characters, telling them secrets to some random stranger they never met. He rolls with it until he finds issues that made no sense. Team is getting chump change to run against AAA corp. He points out flaws in plans and how to correct them, but is basically turned away by "my way or highway" attitude from the group. And this is suppose to be a "team first" group. Then the drek hits the fan.

IMHO, I would have done the same thing. Not to the extent of FNG, but I would have seriously blown up IC and OOC on that team.

I'm not a stickler when it comes to types of games. I like black trenchcoat and pink mohawk, and it's great when you can mix and interchange both in the same campaign. Whatever that group was play was neither of that, but more along the lines of Dungeon and Dragons Adventure League 2068. The OP of the post, whether it was the actual player or really a 3rd party, painted a picture that was entertaining on one hand and drekked up on the other. But the fact that the players bothered to add their input only painted a more boarder picture that was not in their favor. Sure, they were bitter, but they learned nothing from that type of experience since their game retconned and continued on.

[Wounded Ronin]

I followed that subreddit post since it started and it's been interesting.

Keep in mind that this game was not played over VOIP; text only game.

FNG comes in at the last minute. He kinda knows what he's getting into, but doesn't really understand until he's in game. He goes along with it and is shocked that everyone is being pretty much straight forward with their characters, telling them secrets to some random stranger they never met. He rolls with it until he finds issues that made no sense. Team is getting chump change to run against AAA corp. He points out flaws in plans and how to correct them, but is basically turned away by "my way or highway" attitude from the group. And this is suppose to be a "team first" group. Then the drek hits the fan.

IMHO, I would have done the same thing. Not to the extent of FNG, but I would have seriously blown up IC and OOC on that team.

I'm not a stickler when it comes to types of games. I like black trenchcoat and pink mohawk, and it's great when you can mix and interchange both in the same campaign. Whatever that group was play was neither of that, but more along the lines of Dungeon and Dragons Adventure League 2068. The OP of the post, whether it was the actual player or really a 3rd party, painted a picture that was entertaining on one hand and drekked up on the other. But the fact that the players bothered to add their input only painted a more boarder picture that was not in their favor. Sure, they were bitter, but they learned nothing from that type of experience since their game retconned and continued on.

Why blow up?

It would be much more fun to be eyerolling in character and come up with an individual escape plan for your character.

If and when things go badly (which they might not, if this is the campaign playstyle) do a Johnny Depp frou frou running away thing. It would be hilarious and entertaining.

Or, create a silly or grotesque character just for that session and run with that one. Or, parody a well known character and run with it and basically be making jokes all evening.

I mean, join the game and make an effort to have fun. Otherwise why waste your time?

[Sengir]

FNG comes in at the last minute. He kinda knows what he's getting into, but doesn't really understand until he's in game. He goes along with it and is shocked that everyone is being pretty much straight forward with their characters, telling them secrets to some random stranger they never met. He rolls with it until he finds issues that made no sense. Team is getting chump change to run against AAA corp. He points out flaws in plans and how to correct them, but is basically turned away by "my way or highway" attitude from the group. And this is suppose to be a "team first" group. Then the drek hits the fan.

IMHO, I would have done the same thing. Not to the extent of FNG, but I would have seriously blown up IC and OOC on that team.

I'm not a stickler when it comes to types of games. I like black trenchcoat and pink mohawk, and it's great when you can mix and interchange both in the same campaign. Whatever that group was play was neither of that, but more along the lines of Dungeon and Dragons Adventure League 2068. The OP of the post, whether it was the actual player or really a 3rd party, painted a picture that was entertaining on one hand and drekked up on the other. But the fact that the players bothered to add their input only painted a more boarder picture that was not in their favor. Sure, they were bitter, but they learned nothing from that type of experience since their game retconned and continued on.

$PLAYER joins the game of FNG and Hibiki54 at the last minute. He kinda knows what he's getting into, but doesn't really understand until he's in game. He goes along with it and is shocked (shocked!) that everyone is acting like being a TM or shifter was akin to being a homosexual atheist communist in Westphalia. He rolls with it until he finds issues that made no sense. Team is getting ridiculous amounts of cash for a simple burglary. He points out overzealous plans and how to take some dramatic license, but is basically turned away by "my way or highway" attitude from the group. And this is suppose to be a "team first" group. Then the drek hits the fan.

So he decides to simply hack all the commlinks in the group and reveal everybody's oh-so-secret trivialities to the rest of the group and proceeds to goad the three "no nonsense ex-military professionals" into killing each other over who grassed.


The worst thing was the reaction: FNG and Hibiki54 did not embrace the once true way of RPGing, but continued to (shockingly!) act like THEY were the ones to decide how to play their game. Sure, they were bitter, but they learned nothing from that type of experience since their game retconned and continued on.

[JanessaVR]

$PLAYER joins the game of FNG and Hibiki54 at the last minute. He kinda knows what he's getting into, but doesn't really understand until he's in game. He goes along with it and is shocked (shocked!) that everyone is acting like being a TM or shifter was akin to being a homosexual atheist communist in Westphalia. He rolls with it until he finds issues that made no sense. Team is getting ridiculous amounts of cash for a simple burglary. He points out overzealous plans and how to take some dramatic license, but is basically turned away by "my way or highway" attitude from the group. And this is suppose to be a "team first" group. Then the drek hits the fan.

So he decides to simply hack all the commlinks in the group and reveal everybody's oh-so-secret trivialities to the rest of the group and proceeds to goad the three "no nonsense ex-military professionals" into killing each other over who grassed.


The worst thing was the reaction: FNG and Hibiki54 did not embrace the once true way of RPGing, but continued to (shockingly!) act like THEY were the ones to decide how to play their game. Sure, they were bitter, but they learned nothing from that type of experience since their game retconned and continued on.

Bravo! Even better than the response I was writing up.

[Glyph]

To me, this was never about incompatible playing styles. This was pretty obviously nothing but a douche-bag griefer from the get-go.

Never mind the mangled facts that got corrected later; just read the original post. The sanctimonious self-righteousness. The preening, "I'm-so-clever" smugness. The hateful condescension directed at grotesquely exaggerated straw man stereotypes. The transparent concern-trolling. All that, and a laughable pretense of being an unbiased observer.

[binarywraith]

$PLAYER joins the game of FNG and Hibiki54 at the last minute. He kinda knows what he's getting into, but doesn't really understand until he's in game. He goes along with it and is shocked (shocked!) that everyone is acting like being a TM or shifter was akin to being a homosexual atheist communist in Westphalia. He rolls with it until he finds issues that made no sense. Team is getting ridiculous amounts of cash for a simple burglary. He points out overzealous plans and how to take some dramatic license, but is basically turned away by "my way or highway" attitude from the group. And this is suppose to be a "team first" group. Then the drek hits the fan.

So he decides to simply hack all the commlinks in the group and reveal everybody's oh-so-secret trivialities to the rest of the group and proceeds to goad the three "no nonsense ex-military professionals" into killing each other over who grassed.


The worst thing was the reaction: FNG and Hibiki54 did not embrace the once true way of RPGing, but continued to (shockingly!) act like THEY were the ones to decide how to play their game. Sure, they were bitter, but they learned nothing from that type of experience since their game retconned and continued on.

I'm still waiting on anyone to source bounties on shifters or TMs in twenty seventy fragging eight.

[MrGlee]

I'm still waiting on anyone to source bounties on shifters or TMs in twenty seventy fragging eight.

Apparently a novel mentions the TM one, Dark Resonance I believe.

[hermit]

Apparently a novel mentions the TM one, Dark Resonance I believe.

Yeah, and in 2071, that would have been correct. Dark Resonance suffers from many issues, one of them is several messy rewrites to keep it up to speed with the current, official timeline.

[LurkerOutThere]

To those that blame the GM which I too originally did it's important to remember that being an authority GM is learned skill that not everyone has the temperament for.

[binarywraith]

To those that blame the GM which I too originally did it's important to remember that being an authority GM is learned skill that not everyone has the temperament for.

It is, and the more the regular players talk the more sympathy I had for the GM. It's apparently their first campaign as GM, so they haven't quite gotten it all together yet.

[hermit]

In general, though, the primary culprit in this case should be the originator of bad behavior - FNG - and not whoever didn't go out of their way to stop them. Being an asshole is the problem, not others' failure to handle the asshole in a perfect and defusing manner. Deflecting blame from pertpetrators is a general - and worrying - social trend.