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> Revised Rules for Essence, A very different approach
JanessaVR
post May 9 2017, 07:23 PM
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I’m in the process updating our group’s official House Rules document. As its designated keeper, I’ve allowed it to get in far too shoddy a state, with hastily-written and frequently incomplete notes and patches, so I’m in the process of a full clean-up for it. When I’m done, I’ll post the whole thing here.

We already have a major revised rule for Essence, and one minor one as well. These are:

Revision #1 – Essence 0 Doesn’t Mean Death
Essence 0 means Magic 0, and that’s all. If you have higher than Magic 6 and then get some cyberware installed, we calculate a proportional loss of Essence. The end result is Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex meets The Sixth World, with plenty of people who are really just brains in a braincase unit, able to effectively change into different fully-robotic bodies at will. Magically speaking, their robot bodies count as Highly-Processed Objects for Resistance Tests.

Revision #2 – Really Just a Little Bonus for the Awakened
If the only piece of cyberware you have installed is a Deltaware commlink (or datajack), you can have that for free, Essence-wise. But, you can’t have any more cyberware installed, or you’ll retroactively be charged the typical 0.1 Essence for it. This is to allow the group’s mages and adepts to have headware commlinks, which makes coordinating with the rest of the team easier (not having to carry around commlinks and/or wear headsets); the only member of the team who doesn’t have one is the technomancer, who doesn’t need one.


I’m going to be proposing adding the following rule, and was curious as to any thoughts here.

Proposed Revision #3 – Location-Based Essence
Much has been argued over the years about “Essence Holes.” The (rather reasonable) idea being that if, for instance, you already had your right arm replaced with a cybernetic version, then having that removed and replaced with a newer model shouldn’t cost you any more Essence. We already generally allow this, but this is a more formal allocation of Essence according to following body areas:

Head…worth 0.5 Essence
Torso…worth 1.5 Essence
Arms…worth 1 Essence each
Legs…worth 1 Essence each

This divides up the body into 6 Essence and then pretty much replaces all the little Essence costs of individual cyberware pieces into this more simplified structure. Again, this is only if you aren’t going “full cyborg,” in which case you lose all your Essence (and all your Magic, if you had any).


Your thoughts?
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Glyph
post May 10 2017, 02:09 AM
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My biggest problem with location-based Essence is that a lot of things are whole-body treatments - muscle toner, wired reflexes, clean metabolism, etc. And you could wind up with a character who has, say, 2.5 Essence left, but can't get that sythcardium because most of the remaining Essence is in the character's arms and legs. Finally, 0.5 Essence is much too little for the head, with all of the internal communications, senseware, and cognitive enhancers out there. Different strokes and all, but it seems overly complicated and punitive for mundane characters.
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JanessaVR
post May 10 2017, 02:56 AM
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QUOTE (Glyph @ May 9 2017, 06:09 PM) *
My biggest problem with location-based Essence is that a lot of things are whole-body treatments - muscle toner, wired reflexes, clean metabolism, etc. And you could wind up with a character who has, say, 2.5 Essence left, but can't get that sythcardium because most of the remaining Essence is in the character's arms and legs. Finally, 0.5 Essence is much too little for the head, with all of the internal communications, senseware, and cognitive enhancers out there. Different strokes and all, but it seems overly complicated and punitive for mundane characters.

Whole body treatments - good point there, I'll ponder possible solutions.

As for 0.5 Essence being too little for the head, I'm trying to go off a body mass ratio - how much of the body, percentage-wise, is an arm? A leg? By that measure, 0.5 seems reasonable for the head.

And this system is unbelievably generous to mundanes - there's basically no limit to the amount of cyberware they can have! They can just go "full cyborg" and get a completely robotic body if they really want to max out their cyberware. They've got nothing to lose if the don't have a Magic rating. This proposed rule is only for people who still want to have some meat left outside of their brain. The point is that the Essence costs for cyberware have a max limit per area of the body. For example, if the source books say the Essence cost for all of your cyberarm accessories is 3 Essence, well, it's only going to cost you 1 Essence because that's all the Essence your arm is worth. So you get to disregard the official Essence costs per item and load up your new cyberarm with everything that will fit inside it, for no additional Essence cost. Your cyberware limit is your bank account, and how many accessories can physically fit in each area of your body (available slots by item).
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KCKitsune
post May 10 2017, 08:01 AM
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I would say get rid of the Location-Based Essence. Too much bookkeeping. Just have it for Mundanes, they can get as much or as little augmentation as they want. If the character wants to have some meat left in their body, then they'll have to not get that cyberlimb and instead go with bioware. Or you could even say that for extra cost their "synthetic" cyberlimb is like that of a Terminator T-800, vat grown flesh over a cybernetic skeleton. I mean honestly I don't know why this isn't an option.

Allowing a mage to have that .1 Essence for free seems fine to me. My character wouldn't need to deal with that rule because I get way more than .1 Essence in augmentation.

My SR4 Chaos Magician had two points of cyber/bioware. Hell every character I have ever created (thank you makers of Chummer and Chummer5!) has at least some augmentation... even the Technomancers. Shadowrun is where Man, Magic, and machines meet. by denying one of those legs, you're really shortchanging yourself.
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JanessaVR
post May 10 2017, 05:19 PM
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QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 10 2017, 01:01 AM) *
I would say get rid of the Location-Based Essence. Too much bookkeeping. Just have it for Mundanes, they can get as much or as little augmentation as they want.

For mundanes, this is a good idea. Tell them to just put a "-" in for their Essence score, as it doesn’t really apply to them. With Essence now being redefined from "a measure of your very lifeforce" to "a measure of your ultimate potential for Magic, if you’re Awakened," then there’s no reason for them to worry about it at all. It does raise the question of what vampires will be feeding upon instead of Essence; might need to have them drain Body instead.

However, that leaves the issue of what to do about cyberware if the subject is Awakened. My approach of capping maximum Essence loss per body part seems to make more sense than the canon rules.

I found some interesting facts here, and I think I can revise/expand my figures according into a simple little table of how much Essence each part of the body is worth.


QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 10 2017, 01:01 AM) *
If the character wants to have some meat left in their body, then they'll have to not get that cyberlimb and instead go with bioware. Or you could even say that for extra cost their "synthetic" cyberlimb is like that of a Terminator T-800, vat grown flesh over a cybernetic skeleton. I mean honestly I don't know why this isn't an option.

I can’t believe I didn’t consider this. The "Terminator Option" is kind of having your cake and eating it too. This is certainly within 2070’s level of technology and medicine, as per what I’ve seen in SR4 Augmentation. That said, it does raise the issue of how to treat such people/machines for purposes of resisting magic. Right now, with us blatantly ripping off Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex for our version of Shadowrun, we've just said that robotic bodies count as Highly-Processed Objects. With this new version, they're kinda half that. Tricky question to ponder here...


QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 10 2017, 01:01 AM) *
Allowing a mage to have that .1 Essence for free seems fine to me. My character wouldn't need to deal with that rule because I get way more than .1 Essence in augmentation.

My SR4 Chaos Magician had two points of cyber/bioware. Hell every character I have ever created (thank you makers of Chummer and Chummer5!) has at least some augmentation... even the Technomancers. Shadowrun is where Man, Magic, and machines meet. by denying one of those legs, you're really shortchanging yourself.

One of our players (who doesn’t always join us), swears by the "sacrifice just one point of Essence for cyberware" approach. Personally, I recoil in horror from the very idea. "You want me to sacrifice any points of Magic, for any reason?! Heresy! Burn them!" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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Tecumseh
post May 10 2017, 07:07 PM
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QUOTE (JanessaVR @ May 9 2017, 07:56 PM) *
For example, if the source books say the Essence cost for all of your cyberarm accessories is 3 Essence, well, it's only going to cost you 1 Essence because that's all the Essence your arm is worth.

Maybe I lost the plot somewhere but this isn't how Essence works in SR4 (or SR5 for that matter).

The cyberlimb has a flat Essence cost of 1. It also has Capacity. Cyberlimb accessories, enhancements, and weapons take up Capacity, not additional Essence. The limb will never cost more than 1 Essence.

(Anarchy uses the Essence calculation method that Janessa is describing, but I quickly nixed that with a house rule.)

Now, say you have a character with a cyberarm who also wants to have bone lacing or muscle replacement or something else that affects the whole body. I would understand the logic for giving them an Essence discount on the additional 'ware based on the fact that the arm is already missing, but that's a different rule that what's being described. It would be reasonable to give someone with cyberlimbs a (Limb Count x __% per limb) Essence discount on whole-body 'ware that would have affected the missing limb.

I would use round numbers for convenience, especially so that things don't get overly complicated with Biocompatibility qualities or Alpha/Beta/Delta grades of 'ware, but something like:

Head: 10% discount
Torso: 30% discount
Arms: 15% discount
Legs: 15% discount
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JanessaVR
post May 10 2017, 07:17 PM
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QUOTE (Tecumseh @ May 10 2017, 12:07 PM) *
Maybe I lost the plot somewhere but this isn't how Essence works in SR4 (or SR5 for that matter).

Um, yeah. This is a discussion of house rules that replace and redefine the Essence rules, so no, this isn't how Essence works in canon. Though perhaps I picked a bad example (I typically avoid cyberware outside of a headware commlink). The main points here are:
    1) Your typical mundane would normally die of Essence loss if they go on a big cyberware shopping trip. These new rules negate that happening, and allow them to safely use lots and lots of cyberware to achieve greater parity with Awakened characters.
    2) For Awakened characters getting cyberware, the Essence cost ought to be proportionally capped by area of the body replaced.
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JanessaVR
post May 10 2017, 07:52 PM
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Ok, utilizing updated body part percentages (from the link above), I computed this in Excel and have a revised table of Essence costs:

Revised Essence Costs:
CODE
Body Part                       % of Body    Essence Cost
Head                            7.3%         0.44
Trunk (chest,back,abdomen)      50.8%        3.05
Thigh (each)                    9.88%        0.59
Lower Leg (each)                4.65%        0.28
Foot (each)                     1.45%        0.09
Upper Arm (each)                2.7%         0.16
Forearm (each)                  1.6%         0.10
Hand (each)                     0.66%        0.04

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KCKitsune
post May 11 2017, 04:46 AM
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QUOTE (JanessaVR @ May 10 2017, 12:19 PM) *
For mundanes, this is a good idea. Tell them to just put a "-" in for their Essence score, as it doesn't really apply to them. With Essence now being redefined from "a measure of your very lifeforce" to "a measure of your ultimate potential for Magic, if you're Awakened," then there's no reason for them to worry about it at all. It does raise the question of what vampires will be feeding upon instead of Essence; might need to have them drain Body instead.

However, that leaves the issue of what to do about cyberware if the subject is Awakened. My approach of capping maximum Essence loss per body part seems to make more sense than the canon rules.

I found some interesting facts here, and I think I can revise/expand my figures according into a simple little table of how much Essence each part of the body is worth.

How are you going to fit in all the headware that CAN'T go into cyberlimbs? I mean hell, standard level 1 eyes and ears sets you back 0.4 Essence. Are you saying that I can only get .44 (from your later post) of cyber in my head, or I can get as much cyber/bio in my head as I want and it will only cost 0.44?

QUOTE (JanessaVR @ May 10 2017, 12:19 PM) *
I can't believe I didn't consider this. The "Terminator Option" is kind of having your cake and eating it too. This is certainly within 2070's level of technology and medicine, as per what I've seen in SR4 Augmentation. That said, it does raise the issue of how to treat such people/machines for purposes of resisting magic. Right now, with us blatantly ripping off Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex for our version of Shadowrun, we've just said that robotic bodies count as Highly-Processed Objects. With this new version, they're kinda half that. Tricky question to ponder here...

Simple. It goes down to "Manufactured High-Tech Objects and Materials"... done. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)


QUOTE (JanessaVR @ May 10 2017, 12:19 PM) *
One of our players (who doesn't always join us), swears by the "sacrifice just one point of Essence for cyberware" approach. Personally, I recoil in horror from the very idea. "You want me to sacrifice any points of Magic, for any reason?! Heresy! Burn them!" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)


I would shoot back with a sarcastic: "At least in a mana void my synaptic booster doesn't fail, I still have all my enhanced senses, and I still have all the boosts from my nanoware systems**" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

** == SR4 obviously... Catalyst fragged up bad when they went "We got to nerf nanoware to make Shadowrun more gritty!"
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JanessaVR
post May 11 2017, 05:26 AM
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QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 10 2017, 08:46 PM) *
How are you going to fit in all the headware that CAN'T go into cyberlimbs? I mean hell, standard level 1 eyes and ears sets you back 0.4 Essence. Are you saying that I can only get .44 (from your later post) of cyber in my head, or I can get as much cyber/bio in my head as I want and it will only cost 0.44?

Well, obviously the existing costs just don't cut it any more. How much of your head are your eyes and ears? Quick-and-dirty, just call it 0.1 for cybereyes and another 0.1 for cyberears, if the whole thing is only worth 0.44 Essence. And unlike just slipping an implant commlink into your skull, this is actually cutting off and replacing body parts, so now we're talking Magic rating loss. Might as well get some more while you're at it...


QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 10 2017, 08:46 PM) *
Simple. It goes down to "Manufactured High-Tech Objects and Materials"... done. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

You know what, I'll take it! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)


QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 10 2017, 08:46 PM) *
I would shoot back with a sarcastic: "At least in a mana void my synaptic booster doesn't fail, I still have all my enhanced senses, and I still have all the boosts from my nanoware systems**" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Ha! In 3 years, my magic won't be obsolete and needing surgery to replace! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)


QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 10 2017, 08:46 PM) *
** == SR4 obviously... Catalyst fragged up bad when they went "We got to nerf nanoware to make Shadowrun more gritty!"

Throw that on the long list of reasons to stick with SR4.
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sk8bcn
post May 11 2017, 08:32 AM
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I don't see any reason to keep Essence at all if you go the GITS route.

You can directely substract Essence from Magic (and maybe drop magic to 0 if 6 pts are lost) and forget anything else. I don't see why adding more cyberware in an artificial limb would make any difference Under a GITS POV.
Space/Size and mutually exclusive cyberware is all you need.
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JanessaVR
post May 11 2017, 05:51 PM
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QUOTE (sk8bcn @ May 11 2017, 01:32 AM) *
I don't see any reason to keep Essence at all if you go the GITS route.

You can directly subtract Essence from Magic (and maybe drop magic to 0 if 6 pts are lost) and forget anything else. I don't see why adding more cyberware in an artificial limb would make any difference Under a GITS POV.
Space/Size and mutually exclusive cyberware is all you need.

Well, as KCKitsune pointed out, sure, just go ahead and completely drop Essence as a stat for mundanes. As we’ve gone the GitS route for our version of the Sixth World, they don’t need to worry about it at all.

The issue is then “What happens when Awakened PCs get cyberware?” My big issue here is that I think the official Essence costs per item should be adjusted to be proportional to the percentage of body parts being replaced. The tricky part I’m still pondering is, as Glyph and Tecumseh have addressed, what about whole body treatments, like Wired Reflexes? No one’s chopping off any limbs, but it certainly seems invasive. And what happens when that’s crossed with limb replacement? That’s about the last thing I need to work out here.
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Sendaz
post May 11 2017, 10:32 PM
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KCKitsune
post May 12 2017, 11:51 AM
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QUOTE (JanessaVR @ May 11 2017, 12:26 AM) *
Ha! In 3 years, my magic won't be obsolete and needing surgery to replace! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

(sarcasm) Yeah, but it's just (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) and Awakened have plenty of that (/sarcasm)

That's the reason you you go with Bioware... it never goes obsolete, and it heals right along side of you.
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JanessaVR
post May 15 2017, 07:04 PM
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Ok, the remaining issues we have are partial replacements for above areas of the body I’ve computed revised Essence costs for, and whole body treatments.

Headware/Eyeware/Earware: For things like cybereyes or cyberears, bill those at 0.1 Essence (for a set). This is probably a good price level for other pieces of headware as well. If this exceeds 0.44, well, at that point you can get all the cyberware you want that will actually fit in your head. If you actually try to replace your brain, you die; this is the one part of you that needs to stay meat for your soul to remain anchored to (what’s left) of your body.

Parts of a Hand: The whole thing only comes to 0.04 Essence, so if someone wants something like a fingertip compartment either just let them have it for free or charge them something like 0.01 Essence (if you actually care about Essence costs this small).

Bodyware: Most of these costs actually seem reasonable as whole body treatments. What gets a bit tricky is when they’re combined with any limb replacements. The best approach I can think of here is to just deduct the Essence cost of the replaced limbs from the whole body treatment. For instance, if you already have your right arm replaced with a cybernetic version (try not stick this one in the monster’s mouth next time) and you want Wired Reflexes 1, that would be (Essence cost 2 – Essence 0.3 already paid) = 1.7 Essence cost for you get your new cyberware added.

Though since the Essence rules now only apply to Awakened characters, I still advise mostly staying clear of the stuff – it’s bad for ‘ya.
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KCKitsune
post May 16 2017, 11:17 AM
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QUOTE (JanessaVR @ May 15 2017, 03:04 PM) *
Bodyware: Most of these costs actually seem reasonable as whole body treatments. What gets a bit tricky is when they're combined with any limb replacements. The best approach I can think of here is to just deduct the Essence cost of the replaced limbs from the whole body treatment. For instance, if you already have your right arm replaced with a cybernetic version (try not stick this one in the monster's mouth next time) and you want Wired Reflexes 1, that would be (Essence cost 2 – Essence 0.3 already paid) = 1.7 Essence cost for you get your new cyberware added.

Though since the Essence rules now only apply to Awakened characters, I still advise mostly staying clear of the stuff – it's bad for 'ya.


The only problem with that is when you deal with bioware. There is two ways to handle this: First, just charge full Essence cost (consider it an "Awakened Tax"... nothing's free Chummer!), and you don't have to deal with calculations, etc, etc, ad nauseam. Second, find out what percentage of the body was replace and then you get that much of a discount on your cyber/bioware. A little more book keeping, but simple enough to do without having to have a degree in mathematics.
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JanessaVR
post May 16 2017, 06:18 PM
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QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 16 2017, 04:17 AM) *
The only problem with that is when you deal with bioware. There is two ways to handle this: First, just charge full Essence cost (consider it an "Awakened Tax"... nothing's free Chummer!), and you don't have to deal with calculations, etc, etc, ad nauseam. Second, find out what percentage of the body was replace and then you get that much of a discount on your cyber/bioware. A little more book keeping, but simple enough to do without having to have a degree in mathematics.

Well, option 2 here is basically what I'm doing for cyberware, so I'll go with that.

Thanks for all your input, everyone! I think I can write this part up for the house rules document now. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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KCKitsune
post May 17 2017, 07:31 AM
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QUOTE (JanessaVR @ May 16 2017, 02:18 PM) *
Well, option 2 here is basically what I'm doing for cyberware, so I'll go with that.

Thanks for all your input, everyone! I think I can write this part up for the house rules document now. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)


No problem. Will you post the rules when you have them written out?
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JanessaVR
post May 17 2017, 05:20 PM
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QUOTE (KCKitsune @ May 16 2017, 11:31 PM) *
No problem. Will you post the rules when you have them written out?

Yes, definitely. But I swear, the more I go through all the various scribbled notes I have, the more I see that this is going to take at least another few weeks (given my work schedule at present). This comes about from many instances of: "Oh, yeah, that is a good idea! Yo, Janessa - make a note of that for the house rules, ok? Uh, right...[scribble, scribble, hasty data entry to a "To Be Added to the House Rules" Word file]...yeah, got it.", and then back to the game...
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