 Pissing contest for Number Crunchers, Do your Duty and Twink that Booty. |
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 May 21 2004, 09:31 PM
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#51
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 606 Joined: 17-December 03 Member No.: 5,909  |
By my calculation that would have a drain of +2 D+1 with the touch range modifier it would be +2 D and with a trauma dampener it would be +2 S. Thats about as low as i can get it off the top of my head. I would say give it the self only modifier making it +2 M and +2 L with the trauma dampener but alot of people here think its wrong to give that modifier to spells like that. |
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May 21 2004, 10:07 PM
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#52
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 614 Joined: 17-June 03 From: A safehouse about to be compromised by ninjas Member No.: 4,754 |
No grenades dont do jack to decent runners. Sorry, but its true. You might tag the mages or deckers with a light if they roll bad or neglect to spend combat pool, thats about it. Since successes on a grenade test only make it land at ground zero and dont actually up the damage theyre not hard to resist...
As for the spirits clumping... AE spells have a range of (magic rating) meter radius out to los (unless its an ele manip spell). By 90 karma, the magicians are going to have magic attributes of 8, 9 something like that. An 8 meter radius is a 50 foot diamater sphere, which should easily be enough to catch most spirits in a normal size room. If the final battle was a warehouse fight or something, it would be harder, but itd also be that much easier for the players to use drones and recen the area since its one big room... |
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May 21 2004, 10:21 PM
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#53
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 931 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Somewhere near Jupiter orbit Member No.: 1,668 |
I know, it's not something I'd ever do with a character 'cos it's just too munchy but he did ask for a hiddeous character concept. As for elemental effects it'd probably be blast, fire, water, and lightning for the two knockdown effects and 2 ammo cooking off effects *8-> getting the drain downs the bitch though so there'll probably be a sustaining focus or quickening holding it *8-> As for drain mod, I'd be trying for caster only but I don't know if I'd let someone get away with it. Ohh and belows the start on the character that I've got done, stilla fair bit to go so far, and yes he has only a few skill points atm (1 i think) mainly cos there coming from the 300 karma *8->
Race: Troll Changling (15) Magic: PhysMage (30) Edges/Flaws/Surge: (-4) Attribs: 34 (68) Skills: 1 (1) Resources: 200,000 (15) <--- this is probably going to drop to 90k though Edges/Flaws/Surge Exceptional Attrib (Str) x2 (4) Astral Chameleon (2) Surge: Dermal Deposits (2) Allergy Uncommon Severe (silver) (-4) Combat Monster (-1) Vindictive (-2) [Hey what good bad guy isn't? *8->] Surge: Dual Natured (-5) Body: 11 Quick: 5 Str: 12 Char: 4 Int: 2 Will: 6 Cyber/Bio Mnemonic Enhancer 3 Trauma Dampener Powers Magical Power 2 (2) Killing Hands Serious (2) Attrib Boost (Str) 4 (1) Increased Abilities (Unarmed Combat) 2 (1) Then add tatooed Increase Str 6, Increase Body 6, Increase Quick 6, Armour 6..... *8-> I think I can get his strength up to about 20ish and martial arts to 15+ or so fairly easily *8-> |
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May 21 2004, 10:43 PM
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#54
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Sorry, but it's not true. Note the specification of a narrow corridor: chunky salsa anyone?
Which really won't do a thing to spirits that are approaching from all directions. Furthermore, it's far from guaranteed that a mage will decide to blow that much of their first hundred karma on initiations. It's not difficult at all to get around even that large a Spiritball. Besides which, will they even have it at Force 8? Not hugely likely. Hell, some mages may not even have Spiritball. ~J |
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May 22 2004, 12:55 AM
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#55
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Grand Master of Run-Fu Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,840 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Tir Tairngire Member No.: 178 |
You don't want him to die? Very simple.
Make a hundred-karma character with a very high charisma and conjuring. Pour the remaining two hundred karma into an ally spirit. Make sure the ally has a form that looks almost identical to its owner. Slap a sustaining focus on it with a custom-designed Astral Mask spell. Presto, unkillable villian-- even if they destroy him, he'll be back in a month; and the main bad guy is untouched. |
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May 22 2004, 04:17 AM
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#56
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 614 Joined: 17-June 03 From: A safehouse about to be compromised by ninjas Member No.: 4,754 |
Chunky-Salsa doesnt help either, since you get hit in waves. Worst case people will take a moderate even with the waves, from a few lights adding up.
There is no garuntee the spirits will all attack from one side, this is true. I suppose if theyre presummoned and set to attack from all sides the mage would ahve to spend two actions, or fork a spell, to pull it off. Even if its only force 6, the mage can roll a few succeses against a tn 6 or 8 a lot easier than the spirit can roll enough successes against tn 6, simply because the mage will have a much bigger pool of dice at their disposal. Then, even if the spirit gets a few more and doesnt take a deadly, its at +2-3 tn for its one turn, until the mage casts it again next time and finishes them off. Which all in all would make things somewhat challenging, for the first half of the combat turn. Then the bad guy would die. Which is exactly what I said would happen if you rely on a single individual. I guess not everyone will build characters like we do, and be used to the same tactics, but theres only so much you can do to get around tactics which just dont fail except in very narrowly defined parameters. Having 6 sorcery, 6 spell pool, 6+ focus dice, a force 6 fire elemental all on hand, well when you want to bust a move its not so hard; and thats all available at starting. With a few levels of initiation (and it seems unlikley to me that by 90 karma you wont have spent at least 25-35 getting to the grade 2-3 range) it can get even scarier fast. The catch is that the reason it works is because the mage has a team taking actions and backing him. No matter how many dice, a single npc is in one of two categories: I have enough dice to fry you all in one go making the encounter pointless (aka Lofwyr etc), or I can hurt you once on my first action then you go and I die. Groups make far, far, far more effective opposition for the PCs because theyre more flexible in both what they can do and the range of danger they can encompass. |
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May 22 2004, 06:11 AM
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#57
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The back-up plan Group: Retired Admins Posts: 8,423 Joined: 15-January 03 From: San Diego Member No.: 3,910 |
Callidus--By standard rules you can only buy 30 Attribute points and exceptional attribute once. |
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May 22 2004, 06:18 AM
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#58
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
That's untrue. If you check Page 119, the diagram clearly shows the chunky salsa effect turning an originally 10S attack into a 20S attack, and that's in a five-meter-wide area. Add in the 1/2 Power vs. TN of 4 for staging rule and there's going to be some serious pain going on. ~J |
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May 22 2004, 06:20 AM
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#59
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
That's untrue. If you check Page 119, the diagram clearly shows the chunky salsa effect turning an originally 10S attack into a 20S attack, and that's in a five-meter-wide area. Add in the 1/2 Power vs. TN of 4 for staging rule and there's going to be some serious pain going on. ~J |
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May 22 2004, 06:23 AM
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#60
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The back-up plan Group: Retired Admins Posts: 8,423 Joined: 15-January 03 From: San Diego Member No.: 3,910 |
White Dwarf-- My understanding from BBB p. 119, is that you just keep stacking the power up, but the damage code to soak stays the same, and it is only one damage test. Thus a grenade that generally does 16S can wrap upwards of 30S in a confined space. Goon A fires the grenade launcher. Bad Ass Mage casts a high-force physical barrier spell in to create add'l wall. Chunky Salsa light activated. Edit: Damn you Kagetenshi and your faster typing skills This post has been edited by McQuillan: May 22 2004, 06:24 AM |
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May 22 2004, 06:42 AM
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#61
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Senior GM Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,406 Joined: 12-April 03 From: Redmond, WA Member No.: 4,442 |
Actually, standard rules have more successes move the grenade closer to the target AND stage up damage.
The optional rule (right column, same page) Kagetenshi uses above makes them even more deadly. In our game, we've been trying out the optional rule, because we felt grenades needed to be feared. A 1m wide corridor can easily take a 10S grenade to power 100S. And rolling 50 dice (TN 4) to stage it up makes it instantly deadly. We may decide to only let the "primary" power of the blast roll dice, not the final power, but even 5 Dice for 4's with 100S base damage will cause a Deadly. Or, we might just go back to the standard rules. I hate the standard rule, however, because I don't see how a thrower's successes can stage up on someone 5m to the left of the final blast as well as on someone 5m to the right of the blast. |
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May 23 2004, 12:25 AM
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#62
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The back-up plan Group: Retired Admins Posts: 8,423 Joined: 15-January 03 From: San Diego Member No.: 3,910 |
This is by no means fully twinked:
Human Mage with Initiatory group of Flunkies. Bod 5 Qck 6 Str 4 Cha 5 Int 4 Will 9 Mag 14 Bio 1.2 Ess 6 Combat 9 Spell 9 Sorcery (Combat Spells) 6 (12) Shotguns 5 Conjuring 6 Athletics 4 Stealth 4 Leadership 5 Etiquette 4 Intimidation (mental) 4 (6) Small Unit Tactics 4 Bioware: Suprathyroid Gland Trauma Dampener Pain Editor Initiated with Group and Ordeal: Masking Shielding Reflecting Psychometry (or Divination) Absorption Severing Invoking Channeling Spells: Detect Enemies 6 (with Sustaining Focus) Enhance Aim 4 (with Sustaining Focus) Inc Reflexes +3 2 (with Sustaining Focus) Physical Camouflage 6 Slay Troll 8 Slay Ork 8 Slay Human 8 Gear: Hardened Military Heavy, Ruthenium 12 Scanners Military Helmet Franchi-Spas II Shotgun w/APDS in BF mode Edges/Flaws: Friends in High Places Focused Concentration True Believer (Self)--Megalomania takes a whole new meaning Vindictive |
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May 23 2004, 12:38 AM
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#63
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
*Stabs the True Believer flaw*
~J |
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May 23 2004, 12:54 AM
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#64
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Why oh why didn't I take the blue pill. Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,545 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gloomy Boise Idaho Member No.: 2,006 |
Well, I am not sure this guy would be anything more than a one trick pony, but why not a troll physad with Titanium bone lacing, killing hands deadly, a 22 strength (Enhanced Att str) , distance strike and quick strike, and a 12 point boxing skill. Plus you could give him a bunch of other abilities as well. essentially every time he went he would kill some one.
GM: You see the bad guy, he's a immense troll. Runner: My init is 49, cool I frag him with my Vindicator. GM: Sorry, he went before you, resist a 32D(Uber successes on bad guys unarmed combat roll) Oh and only impact armor applies. Runner: I guess I am dead. GM: *Ding* Next? Edit: And just to protect himself from annoying mages add 6 or 8 levels of Magic Resistance. |
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May 23 2004, 01:43 AM
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#65
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,616 Joined: 15-March 04 Member No.: 6,158 |
Why stop there? Give him a martial art with Multi-Strike. Since Distance Strike doesn't allow any counterattacks, he can just go down the line in his one action and blow the entire team to smithereens before they have a chance to react.
If you make him a Surprise Test junkie, too (by giving him an insane amount of Sixth Sense dice as well as doing everything else you can do to raise Reaction to insane levels), most of them probably won't get a Dodge Test either. |
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May 23 2004, 02:04 AM
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#66
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
…Ow? Why not just hand out new character sheets?
~J |
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May 23 2004, 04:16 AM
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#67
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 216 Joined: 27-January 04 Member No.: 6,025 |
That's White Dwarf's point.
By three hundred karma the bad guy can be Nhi-unstoppable in personal combat. However CoalHeart said that it's not planned to have the PC's encounter this guy, so I think if it does happen then it will be on the players terms and it will be the Don in the crosshairs of that Barret .50 cal. BOOM one dead NPC, next. You can't do this if your facing a team because you get your one shot then the other guys get to react. Here endith the lesson |
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May 23 2004, 05:04 AM
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#68
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
If your one shot is with a Great Dragon ATGM, then no, the rest of the group does not get to react.
~J |
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May 23 2004, 05:40 AM
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#69
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 216 Joined: 27-January 04 Member No.: 6,025 |
I'll see your Great Dragon and raise you 20 kilos C-12 and a Vindicator ;)
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May 23 2004, 11:46 PM
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#70
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Why oh why didn't I take the blue pill. Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,545 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gloomy Boise Idaho Member No.: 2,006 |
Thats why you kill the guy with the detonater first, use all your 24 dice to dodge the vindicator, and kill him next.
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May 23 2004, 11:55 PM
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#71
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
24 dice won't do much vs. a dodge TN of 9.
~J |
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May 24 2004, 12:22 AM
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#72
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Why oh why didn't I take the blue pill. Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,545 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gloomy Boise Idaho Member No.: 2,006 |
Karma then and purchase some success. You would have a karma pool of 30 or 15 depending.
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May 24 2004, 01:57 AM
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#73
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 665 Joined: 20-November 03 Member No.: 5,834 |
What about a Rigger/Mage? Consider that the Armor Spell is compatible with any armor, and it automatically improves armor by the spell's force. Force 8 + Steel Lynx = Glowing vehicle against which anything non-AV with a power of less than 35 is no more useful than a thrown tomatoe. Multiply until you exceed the number of AV weapons they have by 1.
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May 24 2004, 02:25 AM
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#74
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Grand Master of Run-Fu Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,840 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Tir Tairngire Member No.: 178 |
The Armor spell doesn't provide Hardened armor. You could get the normal armor rating up to that point, though.
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May 24 2004, 02:31 AM
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#75
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Traumatizing players since 1992 Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,282 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Las Vegas, NV Member No.: 220 |
The armor spell specifically works on "Worn armor" which is a far cry from vehicle armor. By the description it will not work on vehicles.
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