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> AZ-150 Stun Baton, Overloading electric weapons.
Paul
post May 26 2004, 05:02 AM
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QUOTE ("Cannon Companion Page 10")
AZ-150 STUN BATON

This high-energy stun baton was designed for use by security forces against orks, trolls and other larg opponents. Though it delivers a bigger jolt than the standard stun baton, it carries enough charge for twelve uses. The baton can be recharged at a rate of 1 use per 5 minutes of recharging. Use the rules for Shock Weapons (p.124, SR3) when weilding the AZ-150.


QUOTE ("Same Page")
AZ-150 Stun Baton

Concealibilty: 5
Reach: 1
Damage: 8S Stun
Weight : 1
Availibilty:3/36 hours
Cost: 1,500
Street Index: 2
Legailty: 5-C


Okay with all that taken care of here is my question(s).

Can you overload/jury rig an AZ-150 (or any shock weapon) to discharge a full charge (in this case all 12 uses) at once? Would this melt the battery packs? Could it cause them to explode? How much risk does the user face? And what sort of damage code are we looking at?

If you could discharge more than one use at once is there a fair way to judge the damage? Maybe a staging up? So two uses makes it 9S instead of 8S?

Any help would be appreciated.
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Luke Hardison
post May 26 2004, 05:05 AM
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Neat idea :)
I would probably use the burst fire rules as a palette, i.e., each "round" adds one power, every three adds one DL. At least, something similar. Make one "burst" completely drain the batteries?

And yes, I would have it damage the baton irrevocably when used this way ... maybe on a 1 on a 1d6 roll when overloaded.

To mod, Elec. B/R (Stun Weapons) (4), 20 minutes, Kit.

That's all just off the cuff.
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Lindt
post May 26 2004, 05:06 AM
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Why not just plug a leed into the wall... if 1 charge is 8S, 12 would be flash fried...
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Ghoste
post May 26 2004, 05:11 AM
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I can imagine that now...

...'Stop thief! Hey, come back here. My extension lead doesn't go that far. Please?'
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Shrike30
post May 26 2004, 05:32 AM
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QUOTE (Lindt)
Why not just plug a leed into the wall... if 1 charge is 8S, 12 would be flash fried...

Nah, you just gotta hit em with OC spray first :grinbig:
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Zephania
post May 26 2004, 05:46 AM
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One of my favourite weapon mods of all time has to be a smartlinked shock glove.

here's what I came up with: discharge when you want, not just on impact (shake hands anyone?) and a similar thing to auto fire where you decide how many charges to use with the burst fire damage rules.

eg +1 power level per charge and +1 staging per 3 so if you hit and set it for 3 charges then instead of 7s stun, you're doing 10d stun.

This will turn physically weak characters into quite lethal operatives so be careful out there.
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Arethusa
post May 26 2004, 06:22 AM
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Wouldn't work for the shock glove, as I imagine any sane design would put the leads on the back of the hand and knuckles. You wouldn't ever touch them on the palm. Honestly, variable charges worry a bit. Seems too abusable, and in terms of realism, it should be quite dangerous.
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Paul
post May 26 2004, 06:38 AM
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I agree that the Baton would be scrap after a usage like this. definitely not in the users manual as a safe method of usage. :D

I too had envisioned the burst fire rules when I first looked at this, but I wanted to see if anyone else was thinking that. (I'm not crazy, you're crazy...)

Plugging it in may be an option, but not in this scenario, so I will leave that to those of you intrested in kicking that idea about. Human Tesla Coil anyone?

For anyone intrested this isn't something I see being used by this character often, if even more than once. Its just too dangerous, and has too many variables. Plus if he is using it, well he's screwed. And I am hoping that doesn't happen too often.:)
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Nikoli
post May 26 2004, 01:22 PM
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Reminds me of a taser in another system. Had a chainsaw motor connected to a dynamo which powered the taser. tag, then rev till cooked to suit.
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kevyn668
post May 26 2004, 01:23 PM
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QUOTE (Arethusa)
Wouldn't work for the shock glove, as I imagine any sane design would put the leads on the back of the hand and knuckles. You wouldn't ever touch them on the palm. Honestly, variable charges worry a bit. Seems too abusable, and in terms of realism, it should be quite dangerous.

Where does it say that the leads are on the back of the hand/knuckles? I always figured you could give someone a good open hand slap and zap 'im.
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Abstruse
post May 26 2004, 01:32 PM
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Use full auto fire rules for damage staging and do something like if more 1s than sucesses, then it melts in their hand or the insulation goes or something and they take damage? *shrugs*

The Abstruse One
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Hasaku
post May 26 2004, 01:44 PM
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I always assumed so too, as do all my players. In fact, one of them likes to discharge her shock glove while she's holding a chain whip wrapped around an opponent. I give it a 4M stun off the top of my head.

As for overloading a stun baton, I'd go with something like 1 on a 1d6 means the baton explodes in their hand, 2-6 means it's ruined beyond repair.
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Capt. Dave
post May 26 2004, 02:21 PM
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QUOTE (Hasaku @ May 26 2004, 08:44 AM)
I always assumed so too, as do all my players. In fact, one of them likes to discharge her shock glove while she's holding a chain whip wrapped around an opponent. I give it a 4M stun off the top of my head.


Yeah, I have a PC that has jacked people out of the Matrix with a shock glove. Maybe the pads on the palm could have an on/off switch?
All you need is shock glove B/R...
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Arethusa
post May 26 2004, 05:38 PM
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QUOTE (kevyn668)
QUOTE (Arethusa @ May 26 2004, 02:22 AM)
Wouldn't work for the shock glove, as I imagine any sane design would put the leads on the back of the hand and knuckles.  You wouldn't ever touch them on the palm.  Honestly, variable charges worry a bit.  Seems too abusable, and in terms of realism, it should be quite dangerous.

Where does it say that the leads are on the back of the hand/knuckles? I always figured you could give someone a good open hand slap and zap 'im.

If you put leads on the palm or fingers, you endanger the end user unnecessarily. If he or she makes a fist, at best, it's extremely uncomfortable and he or she stands a chance of breaking something on impact. At worst, the gloves malfunctions and shocks him or her into unconsciousness. Hence, any sane design would put leads on the knuckles and maybe back of hand.
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Hasaku
post May 26 2004, 05:54 PM
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Still doesn't stop my Magic Fingers + Shock Gloves loving Adversary Shaman. When he sticks it to the man, he REALLY sticks it to the man!
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Zazen
post May 26 2004, 05:55 PM
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QUOTE (Arethusa)
If you put leads on the palm or fingers, you endanger the end user unnecessarily. If he or she makes a fist, at best, it's extremely uncomfortable and he or she stands a chance of breaking something on impact. At worst, the gloves malfunctions and shocks him or her into unconsciousness.

Or... they're designed so that it's not uncomfortable, doesn't endanger the user, and doesn't break on impact. That's also a possibility :P
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Zephania
post May 26 2004, 07:05 PM
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I use this shock glove in my games and make sure that if you roll 1s then you take the damage. Like everything it's open to abuse but with good design and materials, I can't see frying yourself as all that common.
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A Rodent of Unus...
post May 26 2004, 07:35 PM
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I'd stick to the rules for burst fire as others have said except that I'd increase the Damage Level by one for every two "shots" instead of three just to make sure that two bursts actually have some oomph behind it. But this is countered by the fact that the device will have to be repaired and possibly even fried after each use.

Immediately upon each use, I'd roll 1D6. If the result is lower than the number of "shots" fired, the item is fried beyond repair. If it comes up as a 1, the user has to resist the same damage his target did as well. Regardless of the outcome, the device is limited to half-damage until it receives some minor repairs due to the stress it just suffered.

An Electronics B/R (4) Test would need to be done to modify weapons in this fashion, plus 10% of the item's cost for the controls. Smartlink modification would be allowed for the standard costs (based upon the cost of the item). An Electronics B/R (6) and spare parts costing 10% the items' base cost is required to repair the item after each stressful use.

So basically it means that it's possible, but only worthwhile when you *really* need to fry something big, like a troll or cyberzombie or something.
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Hasaku
post May 26 2004, 09:10 PM
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Or if you're just that kind of person.
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Necro Tech
post May 26 2004, 11:31 PM
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This is just my two cents from someone who has overloaded an electrical object (twice). Not only does every wire in the object tend to melt/vanish/vaporize its leaves really nasty burns if it carries a high enough charge. Most of the devices I work with have cut-outs of course but they also tend to have just enough capacity in their wiring for regular use. Heavy duty high capacity tools are expensive. Crank up the juice and they burn out rather than work. Lets not even discuss what happens when you overload something plugged into a wall.
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BishopMcQ
post May 27 2004, 02:37 AM
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I'd let an electronics person Jury-rig the device. There of course will be an increasing chance that it shorts out. I'd stick with the burst fire rules since that dynamic already exists.

Now my question is how do other GMs rule the introduction of a shock weapon to a puddle of water or other highly conductive surface?
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A Rodent of Unus...
post May 27 2004, 02:43 AM
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Everyone resists the base Damage Code of the weapon with the attacker's successes only being used for purposes of determining how many successes the defenders have to make to stage down the damage. The point of the lack of staging up is due to the reduced effect created by spreading the charge out over an area, while the successes demonstrate knowing the best place to apply the charge to get the biggest bang out of the attack. In my mind, this keeps it as an option, but makes it less effective than a direct strike.

They then make a standard Knockdown Test to see if they can avoid being knocked on their asses from the sudden jolt.
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