Really heavy weapons, what do the big boys pull down? Options

[Snow_Fox]

since the stealth ships thread was closed, I assume because it had lapsed into a thread on modern systems, I'd like to keep this for SR related stuff. but I was thinking. It was talknig about the accuracy of artillery shells, and how that wasn'rt supposed to be pin point.

Now direct fire guns would be, but will there even be indirect fire guns, howitzers and the like, bigger than a mortar? Or would all that fall, more and more to Missles? Artillery was used in Iraq's Gulf War 2.0 but for bombardment of existing positions. For called in direct stuff it was direct fire from tanks or missles. Since by 2060 we're not seeing even such wars as Gulf War 2.0, thought the Tsimian-SS war might be close, Would there be targets to justify big guns?

In 1982 the RN used guns only for support fire. the Ship actions from both the Brits and Argintines were using missles for serious shots.

In 2004 most naval ships use missles as main armaments, guns just for fire support and close in defense. In "Tomorrow Never Dies" when missles don't work a navy officer declares "We'll have to do it the old fashioned way" and switches to a gun. With 60 years to better develope the tech and a lack of targets for massed guns, would there be a need for big guns?

[Adarael]

Yep. For one type of weapon alone:
Railguns, baby. Railguns.

The UCAS military uses them to guard facilities against assault, so I'd assume they use them for other things. Check out Shadowrun: Missions for info on that.

[Misfit Toy]

Rigger 3 has a whole list of "really heavy weapons" for naval ships and tanks.

[Nath]

The main advantage of cannon artillery is that it is a lot cheaper than missiles. That's true IRL, and by SR rules too : the Javelot missile has a range of 120km, damage code 8MN and cost 425,000¥ ; a medium naval gun has a range of 25km, damage code 11MN and cost 475,000¥ plus 1,500¥ per round. Once the target is in range, obviously you'd better miss ten shots than use a missile. For a barage fire to prepare an amphibious operation, a gun can fire more and longer than a ship's missile ramps. On the ground, logistic play an even greater role. The air force of course, can only use missiles.

And no, the Tsimshian-SS border cannot be compared with Gulf or Iraq War (Gulf War 2 ? There were what, two days of combat on the seafront at Umm-Qasr ?). Look at population and income figures in SoNA: it's like Austria and Slovenia were at war, except the playground is larger. Sure, the technology is cheaper by 2060 and both have corporate support (Mitsuhama for the Tsimshian, Federated-Boeing for the salish-Shidhe), but the scale will remain limited. Before the war started, the Salish-shidhe barely had a real army. The Tsimshian capital Kitimat would have a population around 50,000 souls. A single strategic bomber would wipe it out.

[Arethusa]

It should be noted that guns also have a major advantage on the modern battlefield in that there are not really any effective countermeasures. Missiles can be knocked out by counter missile systems (eg Patriot), close in weapons systems (eg Phalanx), point defense laser systems (eg HERO), etc. Missiles may have much longer range and much greater precision, but they cost a hell of a lot more and can be countered much more easily. Guns will make it back in a big way— not as a replacement for missile systems, which undoubtedly have their uses, but as a vital component of a modern (and, hell, progressive) combined warfare strategy.

[Frag-o Delux]

Boeing is working on something called the SLID (Small Low-cost Intercepter Device).
It is like a portable pariot system for artillery. It maybe availible by the 2060's.

[Kanada Ten]

[Kanada Ten]

With the advent of drone spotter and Smartlink II, Battle Tac, and so on, indirect fire would be precise enough to really damage targets. They even have mobile artillery in SotA:63.

In places like the Chinese Warstates, the shifting borders and relatively poor states would almost rely totally on guns over missiles to provide cover and support fire to troops and along vast hard to patrol areas. The decreased space for launching planes and bombers in mountainous regions - not to mention cost - would weigh heavy in favor of indirect artillery. Pretty much all of the Asian continent, really.

[Snow_Fox]

In the SS-Tsmiian war we treat it like the Etheopian-Ettrian war.