Saying NO., Getting a single player to quit Options

[TimeKeeper]

Hello people. Never thought I'd have this problem, but surprisingly I do.
How can I get a player to quit?

I started off with a couple of people, three really. I spent a session with them creating their characters. All three of them knew about RPGs, but only 2 had actually played before and none of them SR. We end up with a human rigger, human phsyad, and dwarf sniper. I run them through the first SR Missions download.

They do well for a begining group. During this, we had an audience. Next time we play he wants to join in. He makes a combat decker. And buys the black scorpion, Slivergun, an LMG, Anitoch GL, the best starting deck, and some basic programs. I let him borrow the book for 3 days before he decks, telling him to read the specific section on the matrix since he'll be needing it.
End result from haking Lone Star's main system? Near death from Black Ice (I was being generous). I find out that he didn't read it. I also sit him down in front of me while I'm running the other characters, forcing him to read, and still doesn't.

On the second run, the team has to extract a new player from Lock-up. The decker decided to get some info from the source (hense the reason he was in LS's mainframe). He discovers that the prison isn't at Lock-up yet, he's in a holding cell to be transfered the next day and noon. Then he runs into the Ice and falls to near death. He comes to at roughly 11:45 with the rest of the team staking out the Prison. He tells them that the prisoner is being transfered at noon to LSL (Lone Star Lock-up) and that would be the best time to nab him. Realizing what time it is and seeing the prison convoy down the road he tells the team to attack. He gets very frustrated when I tell him that he can't wear all his armor that he bought and that I don't tell him target numbers. Through some chance, he survives.

I sit down and talk to him about his character and about his play style. I tell him more about the SR world, specifcly Drakes and Dragons. Now he changed his mind. He doesn't want to be a decker, he wants to be a drake. No wait, he wants to play a great dragon now (he learned about "Twist Fate").

So how can I get rid of this player? Our group's expanded to include 2 others, and a possible third, and pretty much everyone agrees that he'll kill the team.

[Arethusa]

Tell him he's not welcome and explain why. Do this face to face and with whatever measure of grace or forceful bluntness you find appropriate. That's pretty much it, really. If you don't like him (and, from what you say, I think I can readily sympathize) and he's that intent on being ass, that's basically all there is to it.

[Kagetenshi]

"We don't think your style of play complements the rest of the group. Sorry, maybe if we switch games we'll call you up."

~J

[Dax]

What's wrong with a simple....

"YOU SUCK!!"

:rotfl: :rotfl:

[CircuitBoyBlue]

The problem with a simple "YOU SUCK" is, foremost, it doesn't exactly say he's not welcome anymore. He may suck, but it would be better to say "YOU SUCK! YOU"RE NOT WELCOME ANYMORE." I'm not actually suggesting that, though.

I think Arethusa's right, you should probably just come right out and say it, and be prepared to justify everything in terms you're not afraid of anyone hearing. But something to think about is that I can kind of see where the kid's coming from on a few things. The amount of rules involved in the Matrix is wild, and I wouldn't be expecting it if I were coming from another game, or if I had just seen other people making non-decker characters. The guy making the street same just made a character with just the gear books, how hard can this be? That sort of thing. And yes, it can be frustrating when you realize you've bought more armor than you can use (I think. My problem is I never buy enough armor, because I always think I'm too cool for it, which I never am except for one character I had way back). Overall, you're right. Anyone who doesn't read something when the GM specifically sits him down and tries to make him is ass (yet another cool use of the word "ass" I've picked up from these boards). But you shouldn't go into it without seeing his point of view on a couple of these things. Good luck with that, though.

[Raife]

I feel that letting people know through a limeric is the way to go.

For instance:

You started playing with us last week,
But our team will just get geeked,
If you come here again,
Ill kick your shins,
And your eyeballs will be hard to seek.

[Arethusa]

I disagree and counter with a haiku.

You're really an ass,
And none of us like you much;
Why don't you shove off?

[Raife]

NO, how can you possibly feel that the honor of a civilized Haiku could be applied here? This is OBVIOUSLY a call for a large drunken irish man to handle the situation.

Your haiku would need to be delivered by a ninja. While more threatening it's not nearly as funny as Lord of the Dance

[Arethusa]

No, if you want threatening, this is more in line with what you want.

You are quite a jerk,
And rather incompetent;
Why are you still here?

But, if you must avoid the haiku, a loose cinquain, then.

Loser,
Annoying twit,
We hate you,
Really, you're obnoxious and,
Leaving.

[Raife]

I bow before you use of the cinquain.

That was a much better poem :)

All witty at the end and shit.

[Paul]

If for some reason you can't muster the gumption to boot this guy, here are few alternatives that you may want to try:

• Pregenerate his characters. You know his style, apparently, better than he does. "The group needs a nother Street Sam, sorry take it or leave it."
  
• Omnidome. This is a time killer we use when we can't get the whole group togther. (Which seems to happen all too often these days...) Pick a map, role initiative and have them kill each other. (Its all pretend, but it teaches the rules, especially combat and terrain etc..) For fun add drones, spirits or traps.

Thats two suggestions that you may find useful.

[Mr.Platinum]

I suggest just out right kill him, hack him up with a chainsaw and then bury him in some corn feild for he who walks behind the rows.

[Cray74]

[RedmondLarry]

It's easy to get rid of a player. There are several good suggestions above.

When future players join, you should let them know there is a probationary period, ending at some unspecified time when the GM and current players either decide to make the player a "full" member of the group or kick him/her out without any explaination.

However, I'm not sure you need to kick the player out. I suggest you inform all the players that their characters are part of a team, and as a team they can choose who is part of the team and who is out. They can reject a runner on future runs if they feel he/she has been unsafe in an earlier run, or unprofessional, or for whatever reason. They can interview potential replacement characters, and reject any they feel could be a threat to their health. Shadowrun is a team game, and the characters do not have to accept every PC that comes along.

I can easily see the PCs, discussing things in character, decide his current character is too dangerous to the group. They can inform him that he will only get a half-share of future earnings, and can be terminated by any other team mate in the middle of a run if any of them decide he's just pulled a stupid act. Or he can make up a new PC, and interview for the newly opened position, including a probationary period where any experienced team member can terminate his membership.

[Arethusa]

[Abstruse]

There are more questions that need to be answered about this really. I mean is this guy a pretty nice guy who just wants to be a munchkin, or is he annoying in other ways? If he's a nice guy, just sit him down and explain to him the basic point of a role playing game isn't to "win", it's to have fun. Hell, look at Paranoia. The whole POINT of that game is for your character to die.

If the guy's just a douche, though, tell him to hit the road. Explain to him that he's a munchkin and why that's lame, then send him packing.

The Abstruse One

[Kagetenshi]

[tisoz]

It seems that hiding target numbers and dice rolls from people who are trying to learn a game would make it more complicated.

It also breeds distrust if the guy already thinks you are biased against him.

Maybe you should do a search of old threads about GMing for newbies, because it sounds like you overlooked that part. Maybe some threads on curbing munchkins, too. Seems like you got a munchkin and his response is to build a better munchkin. I'd never let a new player play a decker, unless they are familiar with the decking rules.

On getting rid of him, if you are going to act like a bunch of girls, get rid of him like a bunch of girls. Whisper amongst yourselves but don't include him. Have everyone nitpick everything his character does that others don't like. Tell him the game got cancelled because you need to wash your hair. Have someone else answer the phone and say you aren't there or can't come to the phone. Get a restraining order. Use your imagination. Almost anything that avoids the issue while avoiding the player will work. ;)

[Snow_Fox]

You've got a serious munchkin problem. Next up he'll want to be an IE not just any IE but Harlequin etc.

If you don't want him to play just say "it's not working out, we don't want you to be in the group."

But short, sharp and to the point.

[Siege]

I was open-minded until the "I wanna be a dragon" part of the story.

I second the short, sharp answer.

-Siege

[Adarael]

My entry into the fray:

Streams run and leaves fall,
as Karma follows a course.
You bring *bad* karma.

[littlesean]

Are you having fun? Is the group as a whole having fun? I have recently (Here) discovered that to be the best measure. If not, explain to him why. Be clear, brutal if need be, but try to avoid being confrontational.
In the end, if the majority of you are not having fun, then I submit that you are not doing it right.

[Wounded Ronin]

So, I have the impression that this guy only played a session or two, and you already want to kick him out?

If I were you, I'd just tell him why the other people don't like his playing style, suggest he go with the Weapons Specialist for now, and give him a couple more sessions. Explain to him that decking is difficult and complicated and tell him no drake players are allowed. That way, he can make the decision to leave if that type of play is totally incompatible with what he would like to do.


Anyway, he dosen't have to kill the whole team by being inept. Most likely he himself will just die and the rest of the team can, like, flee or something while hte bad guys are killing him. My impression based on your post is that people are overreacting a little bit to 1 PC being incompetent. Look at it this way...if he keeps playing badly, you can have 1 dramatic PC death fairly frequently and so it will help keep your other PCs from getting cocky and jaded.

Yeah...if the PC does something stupid, don't pull punches. Just have the Black IC or whatever kill him.

I mean, SR does have something of a learning curve. Its easy to die and after a few deaths I'm sure he'd become more cautious.

[Siege]

He wanted to play a Great Dragon.

-Siege

[Herald of Verjig...]