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Thanos007
post Jul 19 2004, 03:36 PM
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Does you crew wear masks? Do they get new footwear for every mission?Do they burn their clothes after the mission? Are they foolish enough to take souvenir? What steps do they take to contaminate their multiple crime seens?

Just curious.

Thanos
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mfb
post Jul 19 2004, 04:12 PM
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off-camera, my characters replace the firing pins and barrels on their firearms on a fairly regular basis. items of value that the dead guys aren't going to need get picked up for later sale, or use in later runs in the case of weapons.

sloppy? eh, possibly. the thing is, in real life, all the crimes committed in one area usually fall under one jurisdiction. in SR, there might be one jurisdiction for every single run my character does, even if he stays in the metroplex area for his entire career. and unlike real life, these jurisdictions have no reason to work together; working together means sharing information, and you never know what piece of information will give your competitor the edge he needs to beat you in the market next quarter--especially when it comes to info regarding shadowrunners.
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BitBasher
post Jul 19 2004, 04:16 PM
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QUOTE
off-camera, my characters replace the firing pins and barrels on their firearms on a fairly regular basis.
Replace firing pins? Why not just use caseless ammo? :huh:
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Traks
post Jul 19 2004, 04:22 PM
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I will be silent about my runners. They aren't... unnecessarily professional when it come to details.
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mfb
post Jul 19 2004, 04:23 PM
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because the idea that any weapon can be made in cased or caseless versions gives my brain indigestion. i started out with the assumption that my character's favorite weapon (HK-227) uses cased ammo, so i'm staying with it.
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Austere Emancipa...
post Jul 19 2004, 04:43 PM
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Just to get this thread way OT: Cased or caseless doesn't make much of a difference in the need for replacing firing pins. The G11 uses a firing pin, although admittedly it doesn't strike as hard a surface as a firing pin does with cased ammunition. Electrical ignition can be used with either kind of ammunition.

This post has been edited by Austere Emancipator: Jul 19 2004, 06:58 PM
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GrinderTheTroll
post Jul 19 2004, 05:50 PM
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This is a constant learning experience for my runners and I award extra Karma when they strive for being more professional.

They are constantly thinking about using Mask spells, or just plain old masks, stealth outfits and gear, com-link system and sub-vocal microphones.

That's been one of the biggest draws to SR for me is the level of detail to which you can account for and still have fun.
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Konphujun
post Jul 19 2004, 06:21 PM
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My runners wear all black security armor all the time, and when they're finished with a run they go over the scene as best they can i.e. picking up spent shell casings, mopping up any blood, and checking their gear for transmitters and such.. just in case. Also, they usually try to cause as little structural damage as possible and they wipe off all finger prints... though usually they wear gloves.

P.S. im new here, and my name is pronounced Confusion.

Peace :cyber:
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Skeptical Clown
post Jul 19 2004, 06:26 PM
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In my games, most police and security forces are highly corrupt and not entirely competent. And they're nonexistent in many places. Caution pays off some, but most of the time things are fairly sloppy.
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Firewall
post Jul 19 2004, 06:26 PM
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Our Shadowrun GM, with years of experience, does not reward stealth.

The first game we did with him, I had my decker carefully disable the external security. I had the cameras looping a nice nondescript feed, had the electric fence drop for 60 seconds, we all got in. Everything was fine until the mage saw a hellhound and unloaded an Uzi at it. (he panicked and forgot he was a mage)

The GM had an NPC 'minder' following us. Just to make sure we did not try to run away. This was the point when he opened up with a Panther... It turned out that he, and the characters he had rolled up for any player without pre-existing sheets, had not a single silenced weapon between them.

What can you do when the GM gives more karma for explosives (based on the number of mooks killed) than for shutting down a red security grid?
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de4dmeta1
post Jul 19 2004, 06:52 PM
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That sounds kinda like my GM Firewall :grinbig:

As for Professional vs Sloppy, I try to lean on the side of professional, but when your GM constantly overlooks everything for wetwork (with a stipulation of brutality I might add), it's kinda hard.
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nezumi
post Jul 19 2004, 08:09 PM
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I'm running a couple of games. So far the groups vary. Deckers seem to be a bit smarter, they'll seek out and overwrite camera footage, security logs and the like. A few characters are smart enough to try and get maps and put on disguises. But largely it's still 'run in, grab it, shoot a bunch of people and get out before the star arrives'. Since I'm turning up the security forces on each mission, I think they'll gradually become more and more disenfranchised with that idea.
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BitBasher
post Jul 19 2004, 08:11 PM
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QUOTE
Since I'm turning up the security forces on each mission, I think they'll gradually become more and more disenfranchised with that idea.
Or they'll start munchkinizing or thingking you're putting them against unfair competetion making the game unfun. :D
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cpcarrot
post Jul 19 2004, 08:43 PM
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QUOTE
Just to get this thread way OT: Cased or caseless doesn't make much of a difference in the need for replacing firing pins. The G11 uses a firing pin, although admittedly it doesn't strike as hard a surface as a firing pin does with cased ammunition. Electrical ignition can be used with either kind of ammunition.


True enough however the point of replacing the firing pin with regards to cased ammunition is that the firing pin leaves a mark on the spent case where it strikes which can be used to trace the weapon as each pin will leave it in a slightly different place at a slightly different depth with a slightly different shape. With caseless ammuntion no spent cases are ejected with which this technique could be used the firing pin in the G11 ignites a block of solid propelant which is distroyed in the discharge and as such leaves no useful evidence that can be used to trace the weapon. Hence with caseless ammunition no need to replace the firing pin to avoid tracing, with cased you do. Still have the problem of the rifling leaving marks on the bullet but as was mentioned before thats where replacing the barrel comes in...
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Moirdryd
post Jul 19 2004, 11:40 PM
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I find with the groups i run games for it depends heavily on the characters involved. I agree with the philosophy that deckers are the most cautious. but after all, its to be expected. The char spends most of its time with stealth and sleaze programs etc. and doing things without being noticed are what deckers do after all.

My favotrite from my table though was a ninja character who was a proper ninja character. Didnt so much as leave a footprint in the dirt outside anyplace he broke into. Scary.
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Necro Tech
post Jul 19 2004, 11:44 PM
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Damn I wish I had the option to be a cautious decker. I'm the parties #2 gun and the default scout. Stupid thieves/riggers/mages.
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FlakJacket
post Jul 19 2004, 11:55 PM
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To give the easiest answer, it depends on the charcter. Some have been ultra-careful, some complete whack-jobs that didn't take many if any precautions and others were cautious types that still took a calculated risk sometimes. Like I said, each PC is different.

I'd have to say that my favourites to play have usually been the cautious yet occassional risk takers- run and gunners can be fun for a bit but it wears thin after a while and uber-paranoids can also take the fun out of things. Although they can be good for a laugh sometimes depending on what extremes you take it too. :D
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Snow_Fox
post Jul 20 2004, 12:58 AM
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mfb has a point, the conflicting jurisdictions make a life of crime so much easier.

We try to take procautions such as having clothes and guns used only on runs and not kept in main residences. For example, my main character has a Colt Asp as her legal weapon but on runs that stays home and she packs a Colt Manhunter.

We also try to leave incriminating evidence of other corps when we hit a particular place. It may not work, but it muddies the waters. Likewise we've been known to hire hire runners to hit targets for no good reason to add confusion.
"Ok we know someone hit our Bellevue research plant, but why'd they hit the motor pool in Auburn too? what are they doing?"
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Kagetenshi
post Jul 20 2004, 01:02 AM
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QUOTE (Thanos007 @ Jul 19 2004, 10:36 AM)
Does you crew wear masks? Do they get new footwear for every mission?Do they burn their clothes after the mission?

My character is a Rigger.

More expansion on the topic, I always attend meets by L5-encrypted telepresence gear, I use a picture of the world instead of my picture, I alter my voice to sound male while my character is female, I make sure never to meet anyone face-to-face if I don't have to, my drones all run L5 encryption, and I try to stay as far away from anything as I can.

~J
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de4dmeta1
post Jul 20 2004, 02:00 AM
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Does this character also happen to be anti-social, or a hypochondriac by chance? :grinbig:

My characters are usually cool and calculating. For example, if he's doing a hit, he'll go up to the mark, talking with them like he's their good friend, then, when they're least expecting it- BAM! Down they go with either a bullet or an AZ-150 stun baton to the back of the head. Or, if subtlety isn't needed, a Remington Roomsweeper loaded with stun shells does the trick. I find that stun weapons work wonders, especially since people don't put much stock in impact armor. :rotate:

As for disposables/untraceables/whatever, a good balaclava and some gloves usually do the trick, along with some silenced guns.

Mind you, a fellow runner with an auto-shotgun and a love of blasting makes all of that useless... :grr:
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sir fwank
post Jul 20 2004, 03:34 AM
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my runners just discharged a bunch of autofire in a c-class or better district. oh and they killed some LS beat cops. they will learn.
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Sahandrian
post Jul 20 2004, 03:51 AM
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Our group seems to vary from one game to the next. Fairly often they're in the barrens so it doesn't even matter. But when it does... well, there was one time where the majority of the team knew the last member would be a liability on this kind of job, but were asked to bring him along, so they sent him in the other side fo the building making a lot of noise, then headed in through the back as quietly as possible.

Then there was the time the adept came up with a plan that depended entirely on nobody in the room happening to look his direction. That, of course, failed entirely.
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Austere Emancipa...
post Jul 20 2004, 03:58 AM
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QUOTE (cpcarrot)
True enough however the point of replacing the firing pin with regards to cased ammunition is that the firing pin leaves a mark on the spent case where it strikes which can be used to trace the weapon as each pin will leave it in a slightly different place at a slightly different depth with a slightly different shape.

That makes sense. A quick Google revealed that this technique is only about 50-75% reliable IRL, it's bound to be more effective in 60 years.
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DigitalMage
post Jul 20 2004, 12:03 PM
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I had a character who planned for the worse. He had a full beard and full head of hair. He kept multiple emergency kist stashed around the plex including ration bars, clothing, armour, a gun and some money. The bag also contained a razor and some hair dye so that he could quite radically change his appearance.

I had a list of standard gear I would buy for every run, and either dispose of or fence afterward. This gear included mobile phones (the pay as you go sort for complete anonymity) pistols, armour etc.
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Firewall
post Jul 20 2004, 08:45 PM
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QUOTE (Necro Tech)
Damn I wish I had the option to be a cautious decker. I'm the parties #2 gun and the default scout.

I get to be decker and #2 gun. Luckily, my weapon of choice is a sniper rifle. A sniper rifle that, due to the GMs he has been running with, has been used more often for targets within 10 feet than he has ever used the scope...
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