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> [ShadowsOfEurope] in 2012, the pope decreed
VoceNoctum
post Aug 4 2004, 03:55 AM
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"In January 2012, the situation became even more volatile when Pope John Paul IV denounced metahumans as abominations" SoE Page 11.

So, he pointed at all the little babies (less than a year old) that had birth defects (as they regarded UGE then) and said they were abominations?

That's amusing. :)
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otaku mike
post Aug 4 2004, 07:28 AM
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Yep, and unfortunately canon since a veeery long time. (SR 1st Ed IIRC). That's only one of the things that we had to do with and try to make look not too weird.
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Synner
post Aug 4 2004, 07:57 AM
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Mike is correct, strangely enough, its one of the many "amusing" issues I had to iron out regarding the RCC that dated back to 1st Edition (Grimoire 1).

Others included the apparently contradictory background of the New Jesuits in Aztlan and at least one novel, and the whole issue of why the conservative German church broke loose 10 years before Imago Dei. John Paul IV's denouncement was also addressed in Tir Na nÓg and Germany (also 1st Ed.) since it led to the beginning of a schism with the Irish Catholic Church and later the German one.

If you read on, in the Vatican section of the Italian Confederation chapter, a little light is shed on the matter (according to SoE with a number of other branches of the Church which weren't too happy with the Pope calling hellfire (he's that kind of guy) on a bunch of malformed, but cute, elven and dwarven babies)..

Of course it starts to make sense if the conservative Pope has reason to associate the freaks born during 2011 with the first clear signs of the return of magic during the Awakening, rather than UGE... in fact, SoE suggests that the Pope had other (hidden) reasons to denounce "magic and metahumans" off the bat - the most obvious deduction would be that the Church seems to know more about what was coming than most anyone else. What those reasons might be is a subject for upcoming books...
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Kanada Ten
post Aug 4 2004, 06:32 PM
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Also consider that Dwarves and Elves contiuned to be born at 10% of newborns even after 2011; evidence in the way of high population numbers of both metatypes in 2052. The Pope was saying the children were born with the "Mark of the Beast" by way of their form. Not all to different than what I've heard from some people about malotto children. It's funny in the way of all Shadowrun history - real enough to reflect, but twisted enough to laugh at.
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VoceNoctum
post Aug 4 2004, 06:35 PM
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QUOTE (Kanada Ten)
Also consider that Dwarves and Elves contiuned to be born at 10% of newborns even after 2011; evidence in the way of high population numbers of both metatypes in 2052. The Pope was saying the children were born with the "Mark of the Beast" by way of their form. Not all to different than what I've heard from some people about malotto children. It's funny in the way of all Shadowrun history - real enough to reflect, but twisted enough to laugh at.

Yeah, but the pronouncement was in Jan 2012. The pronouncement was right after the first dragons, and I'm sure that's what it was supposed to be.

It's still just funny. :)
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Snow_Fox
post Aug 4 2004, 10:25 PM
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Probably they didn't realize it would beso wide spread and just lookedl ike another freak show, like Dragon, they could limit very quickly. Not to get into my usual rants, but the Catholic church does not respond to change well and the idea of a few things, even babies looking like trolls-with horns and all, would cause a major league melt down. It's the retraction, so fast, that is miraculous.
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shadd4d
post Aug 4 2004, 11:00 PM
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For the Catholics, that's bordering light speed (sorry, I'm Lutheran). But it's interesting to see. Compare that with...Vatican 1, circa 1970s I believe. It took about 460 for the Catholic Church to see others, like the Lutherans, Baptists, and other denominations as equals and start working toward making 1 church. The Church retracts its previous stance on metahumans in just 12 years. That's bordering on a miracle, historically speaking. (Keep in mind, Joan of Arc was only made a saint in the 1970s, as opposed to the 1400s when she lived. The Catholic church has gotten a lot quicker in its 2000+ years)

Don
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Snow_Fox
post Aug 4 2004, 11:06 PM
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I was raised a Catholic, I know how they move. That's why I'm a wiccan and famous here about for my rants on the church.
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shadd4d
post Aug 4 2004, 11:16 PM
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Considering I said some insulting words about Catholics last night and then had my seat on the plane given to someone else, I'm inclined to believe he's really Catholic. Remember, I'm supposed to be flying home today to Atlanta, GA, USA, but I end up getting stuck in Germany until Friday the 13th. Arrr.

Don

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Snow_Fox
post Aug 6 2004, 10:54 PM
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Don't sweat it, like I said, I'm infamous for my anti-catholic rants but I figure after 12 years of catholic school, I've earned the right.
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