IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> New Vehicle Design Option, Opinions?
GunnerJ
post Aug 23 2004, 11:58 PM
Post #1


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 669
Joined: 25-May 03
Member No.: 4,634



Reinforced Frame
The vehicle's chasis can be hardened and "bulked up" to allow it to resist damage better. Each level gives the vehicle an additional die for damage resistance tests. A vehicle may not have more extra dice for damage resistance than half (round up) the vehicle's Body. Reinforced Frame can weigh the vehicle down, thus decreasing its Load.
Design Point Cost: (Body ^ Rating) * 100
Load Reduction: (Rating * 10) kg
Maximum Rating: (Body/2), round up

---------------------------------------------

The cost can be problematic. For rating 5 on a Body 10 vehicle, it costs 10,000,000 DP! But then, we're talking about giving Body 10 vehichles (which typically have lots of Armor) 15 dice for DR tests, which seems like a fairly big deal. Any suggestions?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Ecclesiastes
post Aug 24 2004, 12:26 AM
Post #2


Jesus Freak
******

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 3,141
Joined: 23-April 04
From: Anaheim, CA
Member No.: 6,274



I love the idea. I've never liked that there wasn't any way to increase Body (for damage resistance only, I'm aware that increasing body would mess up the costs of lots of other things).
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
SunRunner
post Aug 24 2004, 04:35 AM
Post #3


Target
*

Group: Members
Posts: 33
Joined: 7-August 04
From: Las Vegas, NV
Member No.: 6,549



I agree that the cost is a bit high. How about this instead?

CODE

Design Point Cost: 100 points per Rating
Load Reduction: (Body Squared) x 10 kg per Rating
  (Body 1, Rating 1: 10 kg) (Body 1: Weight Range of 5 to 75 kg)
  (Body 2, Rating 1: 40 kg) (Body 2: Weight Range of 75 to 300 kg)
  (Body 3, Rating 2: 180 kg) (Body 3: Weight Range of 300 to 750 kg)
  (Body 4, Rating 2: 320 kg) (Body 4: Weight Range of 750 kg to 2.5 tons)
  (Body 5, Rating 3: 750 kg) (Body 5: Weight Range of 2.5 to 7.5 tons)
  (Body 6, Rating 3: 1,080 kg) (Body 6: Weight Range of 7.5 to 20 tons)
  (Body 7, Rating 4: 1,960 kg) (Body 7: Weight Range of 20 to 30 tons)
  (Body 8, Rating 4: 2,560 kg) (Body 8: Weight Range of 30 to 45 tons)
  (Body 9, Rating 5: 4,050 kg) (Body 9: Weight Range of 45 to 60 tons)
  (Body 10, Rating 5: 5,000 kg) (Body 10: Weight Range of 60 to 100 tons)
Maximum Rating: (Body/2), round up


The above is is basically Vehicle Armor, with doubled cost, doubled weight, a low maximum rating and no effect on handling. As it is for damage resistance only, armor is actually more effective as it can flat-out bounce the attack (you subtract the Armor rating from the Damage) while Body only reduces the damage that gets through the armor by giving them more dice to roll. And dice can fail.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Edward
post Aug 24 2004, 06:53 AM
Post #4


Neophyte Runner
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,073
Joined: 23-August 04
Member No.: 6,587



I like the concept. It always annoyed me that noma ter how much I armoured up my body 3 or 4 vehicle or how well I rolled a heavy pistol with AV rounds would kill it in a minute or less. (Base S damage all resisting dice succeed results in Light damage he only needs to hit me 10 times)

Edward
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
SunRunner
post Aug 24 2004, 07:32 AM
Post #5


Target
*

Group: Members
Posts: 33
Joined: 7-August 04
From: Las Vegas, NV
Member No.: 6,549



QUOTE (Edward)
I like the concept. It always annoyed me that noma ter how much I armoured up my body 3 or 4 vehicle or how well I rolled a heavy pistol with AV rounds would kill it in a minute or less. (Base S damage all resisting dice succeed results in Light damage he only needs to hit me 10 times)

Edward

Hmm ... the maximum damage code (not counting amunition) for a Heavy Pistol (as published in the Cannon Companion) is 12S -- the Ruger Thunderbolt. Modified for AV Rounds, this means you would need a Vehicle Armor of 24 to bounce them.

CODE
Amor, Vehicle, 24 points
Cost: 30,000 :nuyen:
Load Reduction: (Body 3) 1,080 kg (Body 4) 1,920 kg


You would need a good amount of load, yet you should be able to do it. A custom van with a gasoline engine could do it easily.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Edward
post Aug 24 2004, 07:40 AM
Post #6


Neophyte Runner
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,073
Joined: 23-August 04
Member No.: 6,587



Thanks. I misread AV ammunition.

Of cause anything with 24 armour will have the manuverability of a of a mule drawn cart with a bet axel and a stubborn mule.

Edward
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
SunRunner
post Aug 24 2004, 08:28 AM
Post #7


Target
*

Group: Members
Posts: 33
Joined: 7-August 04
From: Las Vegas, NV
Member No.: 6,549



QUOTE (Edward)
Thanks. I misread AV ammunition.

Of cause anything with 24 armour will have the manuverability of a of a mule drawn cart with a bet axel and a stubborn mule.

Edward

:D

24 Armor, divided by 6, equals a handling increase of 4.

Start with a van (Handling 4/10; 60 Design Points) use the reduced handling design option (Handling 2/6; +150 Design Points), plus 24 Vehicle Armor customization (Handling 6/10; 30k :nuyen:). Then add the Improved Suspension customization twice (Handling 4/10; +20% of Original Cost in :nuyen:) and you are done. You still do not want to take it off-road, and you could skip out on reducing the off-road handling if you wanted (doing so would save you 100 design points) on that basis.

Just a thought.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
tjn
post Aug 24 2004, 08:43 PM
Post #8


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 476
Joined: 30-December 03
From: Fresno, CFS: taking out one durned furriner at a time.
Member No.: 5,940



QUOTE (SunRunner)
Hmm ... the maximum damage code (not counting amunition) for a Heavy Pistol (as published in the Cannon Companion) is 12S -- the Ruger Thunderbolt. Modified for AV Rounds, this means you would need a Vehicle Armor of 24 to bounce them.

Not quite.

The Thunderbolt base damage takes into account the fact it's a burst fire weapon, and as the power is not modified by burst or autofire when compared, the vehicle does not need 24 armor. If one "unbursts" it, it becomes 9M, and like nearly every other heavy pistol with AV requires an armor of 18 to bounce the rounds.

The only exception in canon would be the Ruger Super Warhawk, and with it's base of 10M it would be the only heavy pistol with AV rounds that would require more then 18 armor.

(pg 149, BBB, under Attacks Against a Vehicle)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Moonstone Spider
post Aug 25 2004, 12:07 AM
Post #9


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 665
Joined: 20-November 03
Member No.: 5,834



Personally I think the entire chassis concept in vehicles should be scrapped.

Instead the vehicle should simply start as a body 0 drone and have one base model for each type, car, motorcycle, T-Bird, Walker, etc.

Make purchasing body an option, possibly with a hideous price-code like body^4 *100 total points for it.

Make the limit on CF based on body, for instance body * 50 = max CF (Probably needs work as I'm pulling these numbers out of the air here, not testing them). Body 0 drones always have 5 CF or somthing simple like that to avoid 0CF vehicles.

Base sig before improvements is 10-body. Engine type has a sig modifier rather than a default Sig setting, for instance Electric might be Sig-1 while Methane is Sig-2 and Gaseoline is Sig-4.

That way you avoid a lot of the stupidities of the current system, I was ticked when I discovered that for a third the price of a heavy axle trailer I could get a 20-foot trailer with way more CF and body.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
GunnerJ
post Aug 25 2004, 02:02 AM
Post #10


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 669
Joined: 25-May 03
Member No.: 4,634



Sun Runner: I'm thinking of adopting something like your costs. However, I think that while it makes sense game-balance wise to not have such hich costs compared to Armor, it doesn't make as much sense w.r.t. the internal logic of the design option. Armor is just put on the vehichle, but Reinforced Fram changes the very structure and composition of the chasis; it's a more invovled modification. So I'm a little torn here.

New costs:

Design Point Cost: Body * Rating * 100
Load Reduction: (Body ^ 2) * 10 * Rating kg
Maximum Rating: (Body/2), round up

Rating 5 on Body 10 costs 5000 DP and reduces load by 5000 kgs.
Rating 3 on Body 5 costs 1500 DP and reduces load by 750 kgs.
Rating 1 on Body 1 costs 100 DP and reduces load by 10 kgs.

This seems quite reasonable to me.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Thistledown
post Aug 26 2004, 01:00 AM
Post #11


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 236
Joined: 14-March 04
From: Cal Poly: SLO
Member No.: 6,155



I've used a really simple option in my vehicles called "Beefy"

Adds one to body, for a decent cost, but can only be taken once, and only on something that starts at body 2 or more.

Later I'll try and find the exact cost of it.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Reply to this topicStart new topic

 



RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 27th May 2024 - 11:55 PM

Topps, Inc has sole ownership of the names, logo, artwork, marks, photographs, sounds, audio, video and/or any proprietary material used in connection with the game Shadowrun. Topps, Inc has granted permission to the Dumpshock Forums to use such names, logos, artwork, marks and/or any proprietary materials for promotional and informational purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not affiliated with the Dumpshock Forums in any official capacity whatsoever.