Aha! Finally a way to destroy the ultra tank! Options

[Da9iel]

[Canid13]

I can see where you're coming from. It does kinda make carrying passengers a weakness - but I'd have thought that the power was still halved since you're still shooting the vehicle so you still get penalised for shooting through this big hunk of metal.

[Kagetenshi]

They do still get the vehicle's armor for cover. That and the fact that the windows are usually opaque and equally heavily armored, if there are any windows…

~J

[Cray74]

I've always been partial to the "have the fire elemental manifest in the crew compartment" means of dealing with armored vehicles.

[Canid13]

Unfortunately, there's too many 'Spirit Ball Grenades' in my campaign for that to work effectively :o)

[Zenmaxer]

My issue with this is that passengers are still protected by vehicular armor which if I remember is the factor that makes it halve and stage down once...


or you can have a salamander manifest in the fuel tank.

Also note... to my knowledge there is no minimum on the physical size of a manifested salamander, at least not that I have noticed... Stats may be given somewhere defining it for all spirits, but I don't know what or where they are, if they exist. If there are none, a salamander could manifest inside the engine and use its flamethrower innate spell.

[Canid13]

Salamander stats are in MITS, and they do give a physical description. Not that it matters all that much, this is a spirit afterall :o)

[Zenmaxer]

Right, but the physical description doesn't state a minimum size, just what they happen to look like.

[Canid13]

Very true. And the usual 'BOD rule of thumb' don't work much for spirits :o)

[Adarael]

My rule of thumb on this particular problem is solved by a two part question 9and caveat) I put forth.
#1) Is physically striking a passenger possible, without first firing through the vehicle's armor plating? If no, such in the case of crew compartments in IFVs, do not pass go. You cannot shoot through windows/viewing slots if there is an armored plate *currently down* over them.
#2) Would a shot to an exposed passenger neccessitate the round/shell/weapon passing through parts of the vehicle? If no, such as in an open-backed Humvee, the weapon does not *automatically* do damage to the vehicle, but will generally do the light wound if the round/weapon is especially damaging or explosive. See 'Assault Cannon', 'Explosive charge,' or 'Dikoted blade-based weapon in strong man's hands.'

The caveat is that shooting at a passenger in most vehicles with decent cover (military vehicles, armored & window-tinted cars, planes, etc) firing at a pilot, driver or passenger usually neccesitates a called shot to be able to do *at all*.

[Da9iel]

A whole section on shooting passengers and nowhere did they mention called shots. After all, people don't shrink just because they jump into a vehicle.

[Kagetenshi]

But the area of them you can actually hit does shrink.

~J

[Da9iel]

No it doesn't. If you were targeting the portion of them that is behind glass, yes it would. But the rules use vehicular body or armor as a barrier rating. You can shoot through any part of that door, not just the window.

[EDIT]Door, roof, floor, rear, firewall, etc.[/EDIT]

[Da9iel]

Oh, and Zenmaxer, it specifically states not to stage down damage. The half power thing is not stated either way. I would think that they'd put it in there if you were still supposed to do it, then again, I did address the half power thing in my initial post.

[Adarael]

[Da9iel]

That's fine. Just understand that your called shot is not canon. :)
[EDIT]No, wait. I stepped over the line. The called shot is not necessarily canon.[/EDIT]

[Jason Farlander]

nitpick:

cannon = large heavy gun

canon = an accepted principle or rule/a body of principles, rules, standards, or norms.

[Da9iel]

Noted and fixed. Thank you.

[Da9iel]

Blind fire! The would be tank buster is thwarted by +8 blind fire through those "tinted windows." Ugh! That's even worse than a called shot!

[DigitalMage]