Mages and control action, ?????? Options

[Joker9125]

Can a mage cast a spell while he is under the influence of control actions?

Lets say Mage A throws all his dice into killing Street Sam B. Then Mage XYZ comes along and hits Mage A with a control actions spell while Mage A is out of spell defense dice.

Since the consiousness is unaffected I dunno.

[GrinderTheTroll]

I'd say the Targeted mage would need to break the spell first.

[RedmondLarry]

Great question, Joker!

The book appears to say he can do anything he wants that is mental only. This would mean he could retract spurs or razors, use a Smartlink to eject an ammo clip of the weapon he is holding, cast spells that do not require gestures or words or grabbing a fetish, use spell defense, use Headware radio if he has a Transducer. He could even use Dispelling on the Control Actions Spell.

However, I prefer to use Grinder's interpretion in my game.

[Kanada Ten]

The controlling magician could also force the spell's target to keep his or her eyes closed for the duration of the spell thus preventing all magical operations (since touch range requires a physical test), yes?

[Jason Farlander]

[Fortune]

[Edward]

Actually this sounds like a realistic limitation on the spell. I would allow you to take any purely mental action. As cyber wear is payed for with essence for the purpose of spells it is considered part of your body so you could not use it to take an action (you cant eject your weapon clip, headwear radio I would have to think about)

Remember: A mage is always touching himself.

Edward

[Joker9125]

[Fortune]

You beat me too it! :( ;)

[Joker9125]

Im just THAT fast! :D

[Fortune]

That's not always something to brag about. ;)

[Joker9125]

[Leowulf]

I think that a mage could control another mage and force them to cast spells in this manner. The controlling mage would have to know which spells the victim mage knew how to cast though. Otherwise, he would be grasping at straws and trying to find a spell to make them cast. The spell probably wouldn't be very effective with +4 TN penalties though.

The other side of this is that mages cannot see in the astral if their eyes are closed. Eyelids would act as an astral barrier, however being controlled does not prevent a subject from taking actions of their own, such as astrally projecting, on their initiative pass, does it?

[Fortune]

[Leowulf]

Actually, I misspoke a little because of the wine I'm drinking. Basically, eyelids can be considered opaque, for the most part. I believe it mentions in the SR3 book that solid opaque objects appear as black solid objects on the astral plane and cannot be seen through. Obviously, glass does not follow suit because it is solid and transparent. While I realize that some degree of light can be transmitted through the eyes, I just don't think that it would be enough to allow one to see astrally. I know that astral perception is partly psychic in nature, but I don't think it would work if one's eyes were closed, though it would work if one were blind and had their eyes open.

I disagree about not being able to force someone to activate cyberware as well. To me, the essence argument is moot because the spell isn't being cast upon the cyberware, it's being cast upon the individual to force them to perform actions.

Edit:

Nevermind about the vision part. I just reread the section. I still stand firm on the cyberware part though.

This post has been edited by Leowulf: Oct 5 2004, 03:18 AM

[Joker9125]

Is it a simple or complex action to astrally precive?

[Jason Farlander]

Simple.

[Edward]

I would say you would need control thoughts to make somebody cast a spell for you. And who cares about the +4 TN they still take drain.

I would say that you can not astraly preserve threw closed eyelids (with the possible exception of blind characters that have always been blind)

Edward

[SaddMann]

I would agree with OurTeam on this. The targeted mage is still conscious, just they have no control of voluntary muscle groups. The idea of extending or retracting spurs type action is tricky. If the action is purely a mental command, then they would be able to do it. This idea is supported by the mental command to fire or change modes of a smartlinked pistol. If the action is a mental command to a muscle group that contacts and forces the spur out (or the cybereye camera to snap its pic, or whatever), then they would not be able to do it, as they have no control over those muscle groups, but that would allow the controlling mage to extend the spurs. I think this option is supported by some of the fiction. (Not certain as most of my fiction is in storage for another few months)

Generally, I let controlling mage perform relatively gross motor actions. About as fine control as I allow is having them drop trou. (Yes, I have a mage that uses this particular option fairly often...)