 Casting spells on others, Is there a distance effect? |
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 Oct 19 2004, 09:35 PM
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#1
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Running Target  Group: Members Posts: 1,088 Joined: 8-October 04 From: Dallas, TX Member No.: 6,734  |
This was brought up in my last gaming session, and I just want to check to see if there were any rules which would come into play.
Our mage got wounded, and he offered to just stay out of the sewers and cast +3 reaction spell on both the troll and the ork, then send them down into the sewers whilst he stayed in safety. Is this kosher? Are there rules against this? I made a GM judgement against this, but I'm curious to see if it is possible. How far can a char with a mage's spell on him go before the spell dissapates due to distance or out of line of sight, or something else? I.E. can a mage cast stealth on someone and have that guy board a plane to Abu Dabi and still have it active? |
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Oct 19 2004, 09:40 PM
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#2
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
Why wouldn't it be? Spells have no range once sustained.
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Oct 19 2004, 09:43 PM
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#3
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
LOS is just needed for casting (as long as it's a LOS and not touch spell like +3 reaction is), but sustaining doesn't require LOS to continue to function.
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Oct 19 2004, 09:50 PM
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#4
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 292 Joined: 24-September 04 Member No.: 6,701 |
Just to clarify, I was that mage. Here's some details.
We were in the sewer and I got hit with a Serious. I managed to grit through the pain and slap the 2 big meat shields (troll and orc) with Reaction +3 (yes, I touched them). But for the rest of the fight, I was basically the boxcar between the locomotive and the caboose as far as casting was concerned. My only contribution after that was just burning a Karma pt from time to time to help my meat buddies' combat rolls. After the game, I made the comment that, for all that I contributed, I could have hit both of them with the Reaction spells before we went into the sewers and just sat back at the street level, sipping cappuccino and the battle would have mostly gone the same way. I wouldn't be at risk, and would have lost the "risk" Karma to be sure, and no, I wouldn't advocate that as a method of play. But I'm pretty sure that as far as spells work, that it would have worked that way. |
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Oct 19 2004, 09:56 PM
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#5
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
...or when it is a stated requirement of the spell itself, like with Mindlink (IIRC), where LOS must be maintained for the spell to continue to work. |
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Oct 19 2004, 09:58 PM
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#6
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
And you'd be right, which is what everyone has said (so far). :) |
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Oct 19 2004, 09:58 PM
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#7
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
No, they just have to remain within the area of the spell, not LOS. |
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Oct 19 2004, 10:05 PM
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#8
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,314 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Lisbon, Cidade do Pecado Member No.: 185 |
Funkenstein is correct. According to the books LOS has to be maintained to when the target of a spell is anything other than Self. The only exception is ritual magic which doesn't require LOS to function in the first place.
I assume everyone pretty much agrees that if you cast Mask on someone and he walks out of your Line Of Sight the spell stops working (for it to keep working you need a Sustaining Focus or an Anchoring). Why would it be any different with Increased Reaction? |
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Oct 19 2004, 10:20 PM
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#9
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Freelance Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 |
I'll just counter that (to keep things going) by asking where, exactly, you get the idea that you need to do so with Mask, in the first place? I'm not really big up on the magic rules, but I've always wondered where people come up with the notion that you do need to maintain line of sight once a spell's been cast (and why wouldn't, for instance, turning your head to sneeze, or even blinking, 'cause a sustained spell to fizzle?).
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Oct 19 2004, 10:22 PM
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#10
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
That is not true at all. Mask, as with most every other sustainable spell, works just fine when the magician is nowhere in sight. Mindlink is an exception because it is a Detection spell that only grants its effect to others within the area of the spell, and maintains that sense only as long as you are within that area. You can leave and re-enter the area whenever you like, however, and the spell will still function as long as the mage is sustaining it. |
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Oct 19 2004, 10:23 PM
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#11
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
My mistake. I thought there was something specific stated for this spell, over and above the normal Detection limitations. |
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Oct 19 2004, 11:11 PM
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#12
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
Sustaining magic was new concept for me when I started SR and I don't recall seeing sustained type spells in other games. It's either a throwback from it being a new concept, or maybe some goofy notion from the movies somewhere, they always seem to need to keep an eye on their targets too. |
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Oct 20 2004, 02:09 AM
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#13
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 777 Joined: 18-February 03 Member No.: 4,110 |
wouldn't that be like Levitate dropping the instant the mage is no longer touching the target? |
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Oct 20 2004, 03:26 AM
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#14
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,073 Joined: 23-August 04 Member No.: 6,587 |
It works.
As a GM I would have removed an appropriate portion of the danger karma (you already had experienced some danger so the amount would depend on the run details) given you 1 point of karma for unusual good tactics and asked you to fetch me a drink. Edward |
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Oct 20 2004, 04:17 AM
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#15
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Redundant as it is at this point, where on earth did you get that assumption? ~J |
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Oct 20 2004, 04:21 AM
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#16
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
Especially since he mentioned a Sustaining Focus in the same breath.
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Oct 20 2004, 05:26 AM
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#17
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,088 Joined: 8-October 04 From: Dallas, TX Member No.: 6,734 |
Okay, after poring thru the BBB I still don't see any penalties to sipping in the cafe while your buddies go enhanced in the sewers. Where does it say this? Is it in MitS or BBB? Also, I came up with another way of discouraging that other than the "you get 1 karma" which frankly to me is an easy way of getting karma every week. Yes, you're ducking out of the threat, but you're also earning money from the run and you do get that one or two karma. However, in BBB it says that all things astral are linked to their owner - so frankly if you are fighting spirits and they notice the people they fight are being amplified by someone else who isn't there, they are going to go track down the mage. So if the mage is sipping coffee in a coffeehouse, the mage will probably be attacked, without the support he/she would normally have, by one or more spirits. I still would like to see the book page where Synner's quote comes from - would make all of this moot. Doc |
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Oct 20 2004, 05:33 AM
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#18
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,088 Joined: 8-October 04 From: Dallas, TX Member No.: 6,734 |
Actually, I have a related question: if you are sustaining spells can you be attacked by spirits in the astral? Or can you only be attacked if you perceive/project?
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Oct 20 2004, 06:04 AM
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#19
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
If you aren't actually Astrally Perceiving, you cannot be attacked by anything purely Astral. The Spirit would have to Materialize for it to have an effect on you. You could not Project while sustaining spells, as Projection is an Exclusive Action. |
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Oct 20 2004, 06:15 AM
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#20
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,088 Joined: 8-October 04 From: Dallas, TX Member No.: 6,734 |
:dead: Thought as much. Thanks...and if anyone finds out where Synner's canon source is, let me know.
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Oct 20 2004, 06:32 AM
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#21
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Of course, an Astral being could still try to take down your spell.
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Oct 20 2004, 06:52 AM
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#22
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,088 Joined: 8-October 04 From: Dallas, TX Member No.: 6,734 |
How does that happen? Most spirits don't have powers that can do that - unless dispelling comes naturally to spirits? What methods can be used?
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Oct 20 2004, 07:02 AM
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#23
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Er...ignore me. I'm probably misremembering from an earlier edition, where spells were considered entities.
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Oct 20 2004, 07:14 AM
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#24
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,133 Joined: 3-October 04 Member No.: 6,722 |
Not being up on 3rd edition, Fortune is - from my point of view - correct, in that an active spell can be attacked on the astral plane. It's an alternative to dispelling, it just doesn't work too well against high-Force spells and the mage gets plenty of warning you're doing the hinky against his mojo.
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Oct 20 2004, 07:21 AM
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#25
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,133 Joined: 3-October 04 Member No.: 6,722 |
Found the reference. 2nd ed SR pp 147-148.
Incidentally, today's trick of the day: summoned spirit/elemental in Astral Space, instruction is to defend against spells cast at the summoner. I'm a hard bastard on that one, I make every spell the spirit trashes a separate service, but it's a great way to buy yourself time against a hostile spellcaster. |
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